01-31-2014, 08:55 AM
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#21
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: NC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
He was playing just fine. Sitting him was not the cause of his improved play.
He talked to his old Swedish coach for advice and this is what got him scoring more, less worried about his mistakes.
Tough love wasn't the trick.
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I think tough love would get me back on the ice. No hockey player wants to just sit and watch the game as his other team mates play. I don't know Backlund personally, but I think this played a big role in him becoming better as well.
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01-31-2014, 08:58 AM
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#22
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan
I think tough love would get me back on the ice. No hockey player wants to just sit and watch the game as his other team mates play. I don't know Backlund personally, but I think this played a big role in him becoming better as well.
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You can't attribute Hartley to his success. Any positive play after a benching and it's smart coaching? It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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01-31-2014, 09:09 AM
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#23
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Boca Raton, FL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
You can't attribute Hartley to his success. Any positive play after a benching and it's smart coaching? It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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No, I think YOU in particular can't attribute any success of any player to Hartley. I don't trust your opinion on this particular topic, sorry.
__________________
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01-31-2014, 09:15 AM
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#24
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Lifetime Suspension
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
He was playing just fine. Sitting him was not the cause of his improved play.
He talked to his old Swedish coach for advice and this is what got him scoring more, less worried about his mistakes.
Tough love wasn't the trick.
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Yes, he was playing JUST fine. Now he's playing great.
When did it change? When he brought his Swedish coach over. Why did he do that? Because Hartley was benching him.
Unless you think it's a marvellous coincidence that Backlund gets benched a few times and then immediately after decides "oh I should improve my game by calling in an expert who helped me when I was younger".
Keep rockin' that denial bro. Hartley's benching worked like a charm.
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01-31-2014, 09:19 AM
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#25
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
You can't attribute Hartley to his success. Any positive play after a benching and it's smart coaching? It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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Ashasx I really hope that you realize this is not the Pee Wee 1 Bow Valley Flames one day. This is professional sports they all get paid to do a particular job. Maybe they don't perform to your liking, Burke, Hartley etc. However, your reaction in most posts is like your son just missed a shift in minor hockey and you're going to make sure the coach hears your displeasure.
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01-31-2014, 09:29 AM
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#26
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: NC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
You can't attribute Hartley to his success. Any positive play after a benching and it's smart coaching? It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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You must be one of the Hartley haters. Backlund wasn't playing well, Hartley benched him. Backlund is now back better than ever since he was benched, can't we both agree on that?
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01-31-2014, 09:31 AM
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#27
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Franchise Player
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So if a player starts playing better after a benching, it is no doubt, unquestionably the result of the coach?
Come on now. It's ridiculous. Several people were even saying at the time (besides just me) that when Backlund starts scoring again, they'll attribute it to Hartley.
I know you guys think it's just so simple, but it's not. Even Backlund attributes it to talking to his Swedish coach.
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01-31-2014, 09:32 AM
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#28
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Norm!
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Its going to be very tough to take that A off of his jersey and give it to a returning veteran. The guy has earned that A with his great play in all aspects of the game.
This is the path that Baert should be looking at. Backlund was in the whipping house because of his inconsistent play and unwillingness to battle at times. He took the benchings and coaches ire to heart and really stepped forward.
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01-31-2014, 09:38 AM
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#29
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Lifetime Suspension
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
So if a player starts playing better after a benching, it is no doubt, unquestionably the result of the coach?
Come on now. It's ridiculous. Several people were even saying at the time (besides just me) that when Backlund starts scoring again, they'll attribute it to Hartley.
I know you guys think it's just so simple, but it's not. Even Backlund attributes it to talking to his Swedish coach.
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And WHY did he start talking to his Swedish coach again?
Use your head.
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01-31-2014, 09:41 AM
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#30
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strombad
And WHY did he start talking to his Swedish coach again?
Use your head.
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Because he was getting little support, so he reached out for help from elsewhere.
He was too focused on his mistakes because it would lead to his benching. His coach came over for a week to help improve his mental game.
If you're applauding Hartley because he was the reason his coach came over to help Backlund, that is just silly and you know it.
Why did he have to seek help from outside the organization in the first place?
Use your head.
Backlund's advanced stats have always been very good. The benching is not that cause of this effect. It's regression toward the mean.
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01-31-2014, 09:46 AM
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#31
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Thunder Bay Ontario
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moving forward, would it be;
Monahan
Backlund
Stajan
Colborn?
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Fan of the Flames, where being OK has become OK.
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01-31-2014, 09:46 AM
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#32
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Lifetime Suspension
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
Because he was getting little support, so he reached out for help from elsewhere.
He was too focused on his mistakes because it would lead to his benching. His coach came over for a week to help improve his mental game.
If you're applauding Hartley because he was the reason his coach came over to help Backlund, that is just silly and you know it.
Why did he have to seek help from outside the organization in the first place?
Use your head.
Backlund's advanced stats have always been very good. The benching is not that cause of this effect. It's regression toward the mean.
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Hartley's benching inspired Backlund to take the extra step to improve his game. If you want to add your own fantasy version to the mix, so be it, but I'm going to stick with the facts.
Does it cause you physical pain to give Hartley credit, or is the anguish you experience just mental?
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01-31-2014, 09:49 AM
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#33
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strombad
Hartley's benching inspired Backlund to take the extra step to improve his game. If you want to add your own fantasy version to the mix, so be it, but I'm going to stick with the facts.
Does it cause you physical pain to give Hartley credit, or is the anguish you experience just mental?
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I give him credit and defend him when it is due.
When people said Backlund would turn it around 2 months ago, not because of the benching, credit is due to Backlund, not Hartley.
Hell, Brodie was a healthy scratch the very first game Hartley coached for us. Should we attribute his success to Hartley? Or perhaps Hartley just didn't read the player well enough.
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01-31-2014, 09:53 AM
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#34
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Calgary, AB
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Backlund was benched not because he was making mistakes, but because he wasn't generating enough offensively and was afraid to make a mistake.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/11/01...ng-offensively
That was the exact reason Hartley gave for the benching but nope can't give him any credit at all for the turnaround in Backlund's offensive game.
The fear of making a mistake was lingering effect that the coaching that Brent Sutter had on him, and Hartley was trying to correct that.
Did talking with people close to him help? Of course but to say Hartley had no role is just being biased and being unable to give credit where it is due.
Last edited by SuperMatt18; 01-31-2014 at 09:57 AM.
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01-31-2014, 09:53 AM
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#35
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Franchise Player
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Backlund himself said it wasn't the benching and it was the discussions with his old coach. Why is this still being attributed to Hartley? The actual player addressed this, so why are we still speculating?
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Originally Posted by MisterJoji
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01-31-2014, 09:54 AM
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#36
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Lifetime Suspension
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
I give him credit and defend him when it is due.
When people said Backlund would turn it around 2 months ago, not because of the benching, credit is due to Backlund, not Hartley.
Hell, Brodie was a healthy scratch the very first game Hartley coached for us. Should we attribute his success to Hartley? Or perhaps Hartley just didn't read the player well enough.
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Those aren't even comparable situations and I'd like to believe you have the intellectual integrity to know that.
Backlund wasn't playing well. Because of this, his role was being limited and it led to being benched. Nobody is saying that Hartley is the sole reason Backlund is playing well (don't be obtuse, you're better than that), but to be unable to give Hartley any credit for providing a "wake-up call" is simply unjust and incorrect.
Full points to Backlund for turning it around, and full points to Hartley for inspiring that turnaround.
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01-31-2014, 09:55 AM
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#37
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperMatt18
Backlund was benched not because he was making mistakes, but because he wasn't generating enough offensively and was afraid to make a mistake.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/11/01...ng-offensively
That was the exact reason Hartley gave for the benching but nope can't give him any credit at all for the turnaround in Backlund's offensive game.
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He wasn't creating offence because he was too focused on his defensive game. ie., worried about making mistakes.
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01-31-2014, 09:57 AM
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#38
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Section 120
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Backlund is an important piece of the future. He's not Monahan, Giordano, or Brodie, but he's a heart and soud guy who loves being a Flame and will add a fantastic 2-way game to this club for another 6+ years I hope.
If the Flames draft a Centre this year then in 3-4 years they will have Reinhart/Bennett, Monahan, and Backlund as the 1-2-3 centres down the middle. That's awesome.
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01-31-2014, 10:03 AM
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#39
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Calgary, AB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
He wasn't creating offence because he was too focused on his defensive game. ie., worried about making mistakes.
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Was that from Hartley though, or was that based on Sutter as the coach.
Since Hartley clearly benched Backlund because he was too focused on defense and was too worried about making mistakes it clearly looks like it wasn't something that Hartley was pushing on him.
It was Sutter that build that mindset into Backlund and Hartley was trying now to help correct that.
Lots of people have a hand in the turnaround. Backlund himself, his coach from Sweden, his Dad, the skills coach that he works with, etc but to give Hartley absolutely no credit like you are doing is what is wrong.
Did the benching and discussions with Hartley about what Backlund needed to work on instantly make Backlund the better player? No.
Did it possibly set off a chain of events that turned his game around? Sure as hell looks like it.
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01-31-2014, 10:04 AM
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#40
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Norm!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poe969
moving forward, would it be;
Monahan
Backlund
Stajan
Colborn?
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That's not bad, I guess it depends on Monahan's development, is he going to be that true number 1 center, or is he going to be that 1b/2a type of center.
I love the kids game and his smarts, but he's not exactly a offense generator, he's more of a cleanup guy with a great two way game. He's probably a better bigger version of Daymond Langkow.
We have to be careful in this rebuild, do we roll the dice on another center prospect or do we start building the blue line and wing positions.
I really like Colborne's game and I love the fact that he's accepted his role with this team with gusto. I think Stajan is great as long as the weight of the world isn't on him, and Backlund is looking like a good 2b/3a center. What I really like is that all of our centers going forward have good to great two way games. This is going to establish a great culture for the next 5 or so years.
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