Ongoing US Mass Shooting Thread

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by jammies

No, no, it's quite logical: he was scared of being shot, so he shot himself, thereby saving himself from being shot. Quod erat demonstrandum!

Yes, that makes sense, but isn't near as exciting as the right wingers interpretation of a suicide that turned into ... pro gun hero on school property saves 1,000's.

[Shnabdabber]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

Can you back this up from a credible news source aside from some right wing gun nut web site?

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/15...ring-shooting/

Sorry, it's fox. Hopefully you can forget about your partisanship for a few minutes and bring yourself to read it. Or do you need me to find the quote for you too?

[DuffMan]

Fox News? No I don't accept that as a credible.

But regardless, even if it is true, going to school in a country where there has to be armed guards, would suck beyond belief.

Only in America, and Somalia, and Yemen and hotspots in the ME, etc. etc.

The NRA is leading that country of sheep down the wrong path, imo. so happy my kid doesn't go to school there.

[Shnabdabber]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

Fox News? No I don't accept that as a credible.

Denver Post then?

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_24...rview-hundreds

"The quick actions of a deputy sheriff working as the school's resource officer and an unarmed security guard undoubtedly saved lives, Robinson said. They immediately dashed from the cafeteria down a long hallway to the library while yelling for students to get down and get back."

I don't care for Fox news either but the point still stands. A armed resource officer and a security guard stopped the shooting from escalating.

Yes, that makes sense, but isn't near as exciting as the right wingers interpretation of a suicide that turned into ... pro gun hero on school property saves 1,000's.

So a guy who walks into his high school, starts randomly shooting down hallways, and was armed with a shotgun, molotov cocktails and a machete was just trying to commit suicide? Right. Downplay it all you want but this just proves that a good guy with a gun was able to stop a bad guy with a gun. Of course your interpretation of the situation; is that a armed resource officer, who cornered the shooter in a room, with the shooter knowing full well what happens to them when they run out of ammo or unarmed victims, was simply nothing more than "a suicide" and naturally right wing gun nuts claim thousands of lives were saved.

What planet are you from?

The NRA is leading that country of sheep down the wrong path, imo. so happy my kid doesn't go to school there.

Yup. A private, non gov't funded group that is older than most organizations/businesses in the US that is trying to protect their constitution is clearly leading the sheep down the wrong path. You must either be ignorant of history, have no concept of what the 2nd amd actually stands for or both. The fact you would rather have a gov't control and dictate the terms of life for individuals in a supposed free society lets me know exactly what side of the fence you are on that contains and controls sheep.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

Downplay it all you want but this just proves that a good guy with a gun was able to stop a bad guy with a gun. .

But what if neither had guns. What is there was not an excessive amount of guns floating around society?

[ernie]

Yes a armed officer may have helped prevent more tragedy in this case. On the other hand it didn't do a darn thing for Columbine where there was an armed security officer that exchanged fire with Harris in the parking lot and a nearby patrolman who also got there and exchanged shots in the parking lot. Didn't do a darn thing to stop the massacre.

[Shnabdabber]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

But what if neither had guns. What is there was not an excessive amount of guns floating around society?

Well we can fantasize about what if's or face the reality that there over 300 million firearms in circulation the US. And that's a estimate. Dreaming of a Utopian world isn't going to make them disappear.

[Shnabdabber]

Originally Posted by ernie

Yes a armed officer may have helped prevent more tragedy in this case. On the other hand it didn't do a darn thing for Columbine where there was an armed security officer that exchanged fire with Harris in the parking lot and a nearby patrolman who also got there and exchanged shots in the parking lot. Didn't do a darn thing to stop the massacre.

So since it helped in this case, but not at Columbine the answer is to do nothing and allow every school shooting/public shooting to be a unchecked massacre?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

Well we can fantasize about what if's or face the reality that there over 300 million firearms in circulation the US. And that's a estimate. Dreaming of a Utopian world isn't going to make them disappear.

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

So since it helped in this case, but not at Columbine the answer is to do nothing and allow every school shooting/public shooting to be a unchecked massacre?

So because there is a large number of weapons "walking" the streets I the US gun control shouldn't be undertaken?

The NRA and other pro-second ammendmant groups is what is responsible for the "300 million" weapons.

It would seem the caused the problem.

[Shnabdabber]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

So because there is a large number of weapons "walking" the streets I the US gun control shouldn't be undertaken?

Well, since you dream of a USA with no firearms (the term weapons is a misnomer) what gun control would you recommend that wouldn't violate Americans core rights and values and that would be effective?

Keep in mind no one has any idea where the supposed 300 million firearms actually are.

The NRA and other pro-second ammendmant groups is what is responsible for the "300 million" weapons.

It would seem the caused the problem.

No, Americans exercising their second amendment right is why there are 300 + million firearms in the US.

The NRA and other pro 2nd amd groups don't buy firearms for anyone.

[DuffMan]

So good guys with guns, kill bad guys with guns, who just killed some innocent people with guns. awesome.

God bless America,

[DuffMan]

and I still don't believe this story. makes no sense.

If I was shooting up a place and some armed resource officer approached me, I'd go for the shoot out, I wouldn't shoot myself before the resource officer did. Makes absolutely no sense. If anything I think he had a huge amount of remorse for shooting the girl and decided to take his own life. Had nothing to do with a good guy with guns.

Like I said though I still don't believe it. There would be a lot more news about it if that was the case since then. Has anyone seen an interview with the resource officer giving his version of events? why not? I haven't.
You'd think Fox would roll out the red carpet for him, fly him in on a private jet. But no, not a word from him. hmmm.

Also, apparently this was recorded, I haven't seen any footage of any of it.

People don't believe man landed on the moon, yet they believe this story.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

So good guys with guns, kill bad guys with guns, who just killed some innocent people with guns. awesome.

God bless America,

Wait...

You dont think that....

good guys with guns, kill bad guys with guns, who just killed some innocent people with guns

doesn't occur in Canada....and nearly every other country in the world?

Fascinating.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Wait...

You dont think that....



doesn't occur in Canada....and nearly every other country in the world?

Fascinating.

I just checked the OT at Florida Panthers fan site, and there is no thread entitled, "Ongoing Canadian mass shootings thread"

[ernie]

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

So since it helped in this case, but not at Columbine the answer is to do nothing and allow every school shooting/public shooting to be a unchecked massacre?

The "check" doesn't come with another person carrying a gun. The check comes from no one carrying guns.

It isn't even debateable. The statistics are clear.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

Well, since you dream of a USA with no firearms (the term weapons is a misnomer)

We are posting in a mass shooting thread, I assumed you would know I was talking about firearms...........

what gun control would you recommend that wouldn't violate Americans core rights and values and that would be effective?

I have no idea what kind of control wouldn't violate their "core right". However, I do know that the current approach is not working. When the US guns violence per capita is in line with 3rd world countries, you might say there is a problem.

I suspect that it will take a fundimental shift in their "core values". Is this possible, I have no idea, it will take years, maybe generations, but I hope it happens. Sadly, I am not confident it will.

Keep in mind no one has any idea where the supposed 300 million firearms actually are.

So wait what?? There are 300 million (you number) firearms and no one knows where they are.......Don't you think that is a problem? Don't you think that someone (other than the owners) should know where they are?

No, Americans exercising their second amendment right is why there are 300 + million firearms in the US.

The NRA and other pro 2nd amd groups don't buy firearms for anyone.

Thanks tips. I am aware the NRA is not giving out firearms, although if they could figure out a way to do that I am sure they would. What the NRA, et al., is doing is yelling and screaming about gun ownership and how any discussion on gun control is un-American (my term).

It appears, and I might be wrong that you are inagreement with the US approach to gun control. If such is the case, we could talk/post ofr 100 years and I will never change your mind. Stats regarding the number of deaths related to guns in the US will do nothing.

Thankfully I live in Canada, but I have friends and family that lives in the states and that drives me crazy.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

So since it helped in this case, but not at Columbine the answer is to do nothing and allow every school shooting/public shooting to be a unchecked massacre?

The trouble with this arguement is it fails to address the point that every school shooting is already an unchecked massacre, the only variable is how big a massacre. Statistically there are gun owners at just about every mass shooting in the US, the reality is guns are crap at defence, great at offence.

[Temporary_User]

Crazy mass shooting in the Philippines today.

A gunman attacked a Philippine mayor as he left the country's main airport on Friday along with crowds of Christmas travelers, killing him, his wife, a child and another man, authorities and witnesses said.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/w...illed/4139627/

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Shnabdabber

So since it helped in this case, but not at Columbine the answer is to do nothing and allow every school shooting/public shooting to be a unchecked massacre?

I have to admit, I love the consistent blind spot you exhibit in your arguments. The high number of mass shootings in the United States every year is obviously linked to the high number of available guns in the country, yet your argument for ensuring safety is to promote the idea that even more guns be available.

That is the kind of thinking that has resulted in many hundreds of families having to relive their ordeal on the anniversaries of their children's senseless deaths at school.

[BloodFetish]

The US is in another arms race. Not with the Soviets this time but with itself.

After over 200+ years people still cling to the language 2nd amendment to have their guns, when the threat behind the amendment, the threat of British invasion, is long since gone.

I see no hope that American society will ever rid themselves of this problem.