Shawn Thornton cheapshot on B. Orpik - gets 15 games

[PaperBagger'14]

I'm not going to sit here and defend Thornton at all here, despicable act, no place ad nauseam. But go through and watch replays of the McSorley hit on brashear, Bertuzzi, Chris Simon and his 2 big suspensions and tell me what your gut feeling is. Every time I see replays of those it makes me sick and for some reason this incident doesn't have the same horrifying element to me. Now I'm not trying to argue "gut instincts" in nhl disciplinary action, just a simple observation from myself. I would love to hear how others view them in contrast with each other.

Edit for spelling mistake**

[GGG]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

I'm not going to sit here and defend Thornton at all here, despicable act, no place ad nauseam. But go through and watch replays of the McSorley hit on brashear, Bertuzzi, Chris Simon and his 2 big suspensions and tell me what your gut feeling is. Every time I see replays of those it makes me sick and for some reason this incident doesn't have the same horrifying element to me. Now I'm not trying to argue "gut instincts" in nhl disciplinary action, just a simple observation from myself. I would love to hear how others view them in contrast with each other.

Edit for spelling mistake**

To me I get that sick feeling from it. If instead of getting up he is out for the year with a concussion I think it starts to be percieved the same way or if Moore doesn't get hurt Burtuzzi's incident seems to not be that bad. To me the problem with all of these is the blatent intentional disregard of another players safety. Ignoring the result of the action and focusing only on the action itself to me I get that same sick feeling. I did see the replay without sound or comentary and assumed that Marchment would be out for weeks with a concussion. If instead I knew he wasn't hurt my initial reaction may have been different.

Was Simon the stomp on the guys legs? Because I think Neal is worse than that.

[doctajones428]

5 games is exactly what I predicted he would get. If you compare it to Duncan Keith's elbow to Daniel Sedin's head, it's very similar. Ruthless head shot at speed with an obvious intent to injure, along with a big name on the back of the jersey.

It's clearly a tiered system, I feel Keith and Neal should of been handed 10, but it's sadly just not the way it works. If Shaw and Vitale pulled those garbage head shots they would of easily had the book thrown at them for hitting a star player.

I still hope Thornton gets 25 games

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

I don't doubt that he is feeling very contrite right now.

But I think it's fair to point out that if the concept of the team enforcer wasn't promoted as some type of justice-wielding measure, then the Thornton-type incidents would decrease.

Thornton is running around on the ice because he feels that as the team's enforcer, this is part of his job. Conversely, he probably felt a bit under pressure to go out and enforce some justice for his teammate because he senses (rightly or wrongly) that the coaching staff expects that of him. He was a little desperate to mete out justice, knew that he had not yet been able to do so, and lost his head.

So yes he got caught up, but I don't think we should excuse the pressure that these enforcer types feel because of how their role is defined by the coaches. Although I don't excuse Thornton for what he did, I also don't excuse the team and the coaching staff because they're the ones who define the roles for their players.

Except that, until this incident, Thornton had never committed a suspendable infraction. So really, correlation does not equal causation. This was a one-off incident that, frankly, had little to nothing to do with his role as an enforcer. Consequently, removing the enforcer role is highly unlikely to prevent incidents like this in the future. It's just contrived anti-fighting rhetoric.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Except that, until this incident, Thornton had never committed a suspendable infraction. So really, correlation does not equal causation. This was a one-off incident that, frankly, had little to nothing to do with his role as an enforcer. Consequently, removing the enforcer role is highly unlikely to prevent incidents like this in the future. It's just contrived anti-fighting rhetoric.

And except that, when you look at these types of incidents in general, it is the enforcer that is frequently involved. If you were a betting man that had to lay a bet on the next player to do this type of thing, you're going to put your money down on the enforcer rather than the skilled winger who is counted on to produce offense.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

And except that, when you look at these types of incidents in general, it is the enforcer that is frequently involved. If you were a betting man that had to lay a bet on the next player to do this type of thing, you're going to put your money down on the enforcer rather than the skilled winger who is counted on to produce offense.

False dichotomy. Players of all roles are known to commit these kind of stupid acts. Case in point, James Neal.

Overall, I'd say most of these infractions are committed by guys who can best be described as "rats". They are rarely scorers, but not to often are enforcers either. How many goons/enforcers have gotten suspensions of, say 5+ games in the last few years? Thornton will be one, Scott will be two. Kaleta is a hopeless case who was finally drummed out of the league. More of a rat, but fits this title as well. White and Kaleta last year. The year before, PLLL Carcillo, Shelley. Some enforcers, yes. But they make up a minority of these incidents overall. And really, the skilled guys are hardly unrepresented - Duncan Keith, Rene Bourque, James Wisniewski, James Neal as four examples over the same time frame.

[getbak]

Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger

Thornton gets 15 games. #TSN

Wow.

[Joborule]

Fair punishment I think. A good chunk of games, including the ones he already missed.

[corporatejay]

Wow, Bertuzzi should sue the league. I simply don't see how this wasn't at least as bad if not worse.

[DOOM]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Wow, Bertuzzi should sue the league. I simply don't see how this wasn't at least as bad if not worse.

Orpik isn't seriously injured.

[Erick Estrada]

He should have got at least 20 games as his act was essentially assault as it wasn't a hockey play at all and just punching a defenceless player in the face. Shoddy work by Shanahan again.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Wow, Bertuzzi should sue the league. I simply don't see how this wasn't at least as bad if not worse.

Found that comment lying under a bridge, eh?

[TurnedTheCorner]

Stiff penalty, could have been a bit longer, but I'm OK with it.

[transplant99]

Its fair IMO....but when compared to what Neal got its a farce. Neal's act was far far more dangerous but because Marchand wasnt injured, its considered not as bad.

Its a freaking joke.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Wow, Bertuzzi should sue the league. I simply don't see how this wasn't at least as bad if not worse.

It was not as bad as Bertuzzi's in any way, shape or form. Thornton did not drive Orpik head first into the ice like Bertuzzi did to Moore. End of discussion.

This was still very bad, and deserved a long suspension. I expected 10 games, and am pleased it was more.

[Resolute 14]

15 is reasonable, but LOL at media types talking about setting a precedent. No suspension in NHL history has ever set a precedent, and no suspension ever will.

Also, as Tranny says, makes Neal's paltry five look like an even bigger joke.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Found that comment lying under a bridge, eh?

That wasn't meant to be a troll post. I sincerely thought Thornton should have got a year.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

It was not as bad as Bertuzzi's in any way, shape or form. Thornton did not drive Orpik head first into the ice like Bertuzzi did to Moore. End of discussion.

This was still very bad, and deserved a long suspension. I expected 10 games, and am pleased it was more.

To me, the big difference is that Bertuzzi had a long cooling off period. Thornton was basically in the heat of the moment.

[browna]

Snet saying nothing yet confirmed since the original report, and that sources have quieted up...so maybe something more to this then that. Announcement to come up at 2pm MT.

[Francis's Hairpiece]

I thought it should have been longer.

Maybe, if you sound really contrite after the game, it won't be as big a suspension...?