Ongoing Senate scandal

[RedHot25]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/harp...udit-1.2436581

Prime Minister Stephen Harper says neither he nor anyone in his office gave Senator Irving Gerstein the green light to contact the auditing firm of Deloitte about Senator Mike Duffy's expenses audit. "No," Harper told reporters gathered in Winnipeg following an event where the prime minister and Manitoba Premier Greg Selinger welcomed the completion of a new four-lane expressway.
But emails obtained by the RCMP in court documents released this week reveal that Harper's former chief of staff Nigel Wright did ask Senator Irving Gerstein to contact Deloitte and sort the matter out.​

In an email to CBC News Friday afternoon, a spokespersonfor the prime minister clarified that Harper was only speaking for himself.
"He was answering for himself. He had no knowledge of Gerstein's efforts to contact Deloitte or that he [Gerstein] had been asked to do it," said Jason MacDonald, Harper's director of communications.
"The RCMP document speaks for itself." The question from the reporter in Winnipeg was "Prime minister, did you or the PMO approve Irving Gerstein to contact Deloitte about the Duffy audit?"

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Of course. He has totally mishandled the situation. I suspect he felt he could rely on his senior staff to handle situation in a professional and proper manner and its obvious now that he was completely wrong in that assessment.

Even if that is the case, do you think still should have been briefed on the matter?

Two VERY high profile senators (Duffy and Wallin, no disrespect to Brazeau but I wouldn't say he's nearly as famous as the other two) are accused of misappropriating public funds, even if you believe your staff is handling it, shouldn't the prime minister require follow up and progress on the situation?

[Duruss]

I have been thinking that the PMO staff involved in this my have really acted without approval to intentionally provide Harper with plausible deniability on the issue should something have gone wrong. A sort of misguided attempt to shield the brand, but the fact that may have been considered as a viable approach to the problem is ludicrous.

What I don't get is, why not just hang Duffy and the other Senators out to dry? I can only see positive optics from that.

[Zulu29]

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/11...-expenses-pmo/

Harper's press secretary released a statement today regarding the new info that has come to light.

[Zulu29]

Prime Minister Stephen Harper is stuck in a box, with legal pressure on one side and political pressure on the other, says former parliamentary law clerk Rob Walsh.

That means, Walsh says, that Wright may face prison, and two lawyers who had knowledge of the deal may face sanction from their law societies, unless Harper says that he knew about the deal.

“He’s got it either way,” he said. “He can’t admit that he knew anything without having the effect of causing himself political and legal problems.”
http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/new...ate=2013-11-26

Good article snowing how the PM is getting political and legal pressure from this scandal.

[MarchHare]

Interesting to look at the results of last night's by-elections in four federal ridings. While no seats changed parties, there was a radical swing in the vote share compared to the 2011 election:

Bourassa:
Liberal (winner): +7%
NDP: +1%
Bloc: -3%
CPC: -4%

Brandon-Souris:
CPC (winner): -20%
Liberal: +37%
NDP: -18%
Green: -1%

Provencher:
CPC (winner): -12%
Liberal: +23%
NDP: -9%
Green: +1%

Toronto Centre:
Liberal (winner) +8%
NDP: +6%
CPC: -14%
Green: -2%

Harper's party saw double-digit declines everywhere except the Montreal riding of Bourassa where the CPC only had 9% of the vote in 2011 and thus didn't have as far to fall.

Source: http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/...ithout-losing/

[northcrunk]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

Prime Minister Stephen Harper is stuck in a box, with legal pressure on one side and political pressure on the other, says former parliamentary law clerk Rob Walsh.

That means, Walsh says, that Wright may face prison, and two lawyers who had knowledge of the deal may face sanction from their law societies, unless Harper says that he knew about the deal.

“He’s got it either way,” he said. “He can’t admit that he knew anything without having the effect of causing himself political and legal problems.”
http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/new...ate=2013-11-26

Good article snowing how the PM is getting political and legal pressure from this scandal.

How long until Wright and Duffy spill the beans on Harper and take him down with them?

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Interesting to look at the results of last night's by-elections in four federal ridings. While no seats changed parties, there was a radical swing in the vote share compared to the 2011 election:

Bourassa:
Liberal (winner): +7%
NDP: +1%
Bloc: -3%
CPC: -4%

Brandon-Souris:
CPC (winner): -20%
Liberal: +37%
NDP: -18%
Green: -1%

Provencher:
CPC (winner): -12%
Liberal: +23%
NDP: -9%
Green: +1%

Toronto Centre:
Liberal (winner) +8%
NDP: +6%
CPC: -14%
Green: -2%

Harper's party saw double-digit declines everywhere except the Montreal riding of Bourassa where the CPC only had 9% of the vote in 2011 and thus didn't have as far to fall.

Source: http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/...ithout-losing/

harper was going to have a hell of a time beating Trudeau even before the Senate scandal. He has no choice of staying on as PM after the next election.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

harper was going to have a hell of a time beating Trudeau even before the Senate scandal. He has no choice of staying on as PM after the next election.

They still may be able to squeak out a minority but either way there is no chance Harper is PM after the next election.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by northcrunk

How long until Wright and Duffy spill the beans on Harper and take him down with them?

I've been wondering that myself, not so much Duffy though since he's the cause of all this drama. If Wright is facing jail, there's now a tonne of incentive to save his hide same with the two lawyers. I would imagine they don't want their image tarnished by a law society investigation.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

They still may be able to squeak out a minority but either way there is no chance Harper is PM after the next election.

I'm inclined to agree just because governments always have a shelf life and Harper will have been in power for nine years by 2015, but I wouldn't be so confident just yet. Much can change in the next two years, and I doubt the senate scandal will still be news that most voters care about by 2015.

Then again, maybe Harper is forced to resign before then if it gets much worse?

[Tinordi]

The knives come out:

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/opinion...218/story.html

The conservative mindset understands that power tends to corrupt. How far will we let it corrupt us? I have been involved in party work for more than a decade and I call on other party members to demand answers, or resignation from our leader...

Some of the prime minister’s key people have conspired to undermine Senate investigations, to influence a third-party financial audit and ultimately to pay off a senator, all, in tragic irony, to maintain an illusion of party ethics. The prime minister has, in the kindest interpretation, hidden the full truth.

Is that acceptable to you, as a Canadian and a Conservative?

As Conservatives, there is much Harper and his government have done to be proud of. But as more power is seized by the unelected members of Harper’s inner circle; as more of his key, chosen people turn out to be ethically unsound or worse, we must ask: how far will we let our own leader go?

Some Conservatives argue this tempest is all over a small amount of money. But if the prime minister’s key people are willing to go to such lengths over such a small issue, solely to maintain (how ironic) the façade of ethics, how far would they go over big issues? Does anyone trust this government to deal openly when facing major challenges?

We Conservatives have a rare opportunity. Our opponents are weak and divided. Our team is strong and experienced. If we force Harper to answer truthfully or resign, we gain back our ethical platform. We give a new leader a chance to run in the next election from the prime minister’s office. Even if we lose one election, we will likely face a short-term minority government with a flawed leader. In the big picture, this is the least risky time to change a faulty part.

[starseed]

While the conservatives lost a lot of votes, I think the biggest story (other than the Liberals almost taking a riding that was supposed to be locked in) is that Mulcair absolutely failed to keep up any momentum against the Liberals.

In my riding (Toronto Centre) the NDP far far outworked the Liberals. Anecdotally, I received about 4 NDP flyers, 1 CPC, 1 Green and 0 Liberal flyers. Yet the NDP gains were less than the Liberal gains here.

When the lines are redrawn here, the NDP may possibly get this riding in 2015, but nevertheless, I think it we can see that this paints a dark picture for Mulcair nationally in 2015. Especially considering they lost a lot of ground to the Liberals in Manitoba.

This may be going back to a two-horse race.

[Tinordi]

Andrew Coyne is the best writer on this topic:

http://o.canada.com/news/national/be...end-disbelief/

It requires nothing more than that you believe that, even after the revelation of Wright’s treachery, the prime minister was kept in the dark about the full extent of the operation, and of the others’ role in it; that, knowing the truth of their own involvement, they nevertheless allowed the prime minister to tell Parliament, falsely and repeatedly, that Wright acted alone; and that, when at length the full dimensions of the cover-up were uncovered, the prime minister, though he had at last been persuaded to accept Wright’s resignation, demanded no similar price be paid by the others who had betrayed him, such as Gerstein.

It asks us to believe a prime minister famous for his controlling ways took almost no interest in what his subordinates were up to; that finding his almost childlike trust betrayed, he reacted with Christ-like forgiveness; and that, notwithstanding his own utter blamelessness, he has refused for months to answer the simplest questions about what he knew, admitting only as much as the belated emergence of facts demands.

It requires that we accept that a prime minister who says he would never have agreed to any piece of the plot — the payoff, the audit tampering, the Senate whitewash — somehow found himself surrounded by people who, on the evidence, tackled the lot without hesitation.

Where could they have got the idea that this was acceptable? How could he have been so wrong about them? Why, it’s almost unbelievable.

[Ark2]

Originally Posted by Duruss

What I don't get is, why not just hang Duffy and the other Senators out to dry? I can only see positive optics from that.

This is my main issue with this whole scandal. There has to be more to it than just this, otherwise, why run the risk of incurring all this grief if all that was at stake was Duffy's reputation. On the surface, most of this is a non-issue for me, but it sounds like things could run deeper than this.

[troutman]

Conservatives in trouble, with Harper as dead weight


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...ticle15609883/

The Liberal showing, therefore, could not be explained by a strong local candidate or particular local issues running in the party’s favour. The most plausible explanations have to be the popularity of national Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau and the dead weight of Prime Minister Stephen Harper on Conservative fortunes.

The Senate scandal, where polls consistently demonstrate the public does not believe the Prime Minister, and the government’s overall thuggish tone and style, are apparently eating away at the Conservatives’ fortunes. Conservatives had a case to make to the voters on trade, economic management and issues such as the gun registry. They put a lot of effort and money into the Brandon-Souris. Yet the Conservatives barely won, despite having a much better-known candidate.

Everything the Conservatives have tried politically since the summer has failed. The Prime Minister doubled down on his narrow-casting strategy of appealing only to the party’s core voters. On Monday, he paid a price.

[octothorp]

Originally Posted by starseed

While the conservatives lost a lot of votes, I think the biggest story (other than the Liberals almost taking a riding that was supposed to be locked in) is that Mulcair absolutely failed to keep up any momentum against the Liberals.

In my riding (Toronto Centre) the NDP far far outworked the Liberals. Anecdotally, I received about 4 NDP flyers, 1 CPC, 1 Green and 0 Liberal flyers. Yet the NDP gains were less than the Liberal gains here.

When the lines are redrawn here, the NDP may possibly get this riding in 2015, but nevertheless, I think it we can see that this paints a dark picture for Mulcair nationally in 2015. Especially considering they lost a lot of ground to the Liberals in Manitoba.

This may be going back to a two-horse race.

Yeah, it's also important to keep in mind that by-elections tend to have protest vote elements that don't always make their way into federal elections (especially when the federal election is so far off). People can vote against the ruling party to send a message, without the risk that the ruling party will lose power. So you're right that what's more significant is that people seemingly chose to protest by voting Liberal rather than NDP. I think the extent to which the Conservatives have attacked Trudeau has helped establish his legitimacy relatively quickly.

[RedHot25]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/sena...udit-1.2443662

Conservative senators have blocked a Liberal move to bring a Deloitte executive to committee to be questioned about his possible interference in the audit of Senator Mike Duffy's expenses.

An RCMP affidavit released last week suggests that Michael Runia called a more junior Deloitte employee at the behest of Conservative Senator Irving Gerstein as the Prime Minister's Office and party leadership scrambled to rein in a scandal over Duffy's spending.


Runia is the Ontario managing partner for Deloitte's audit section and the auditor of record for the Conservative Fund of Canada, the Conservative Party's fundraising arm.


Elections Canada records show Runia regularly donates the maximum allowable amount to the Conservative Party.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by RedHot25

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/sena...udit-1.2443662

Now if that isn't the proverbial ostrich with its head in the sand then I don't know what is. Pretty effective internal committee when it blatantly disregards a potential witness. Keep it up with the cover ups though Cons, that hole is getting deep! Unreal...

[Flash Walken]

Crickets in here.