Flames Exploring Trade Options

[EYE_Overstand]

enough of this Vancouver Talk. i'm sure Cammy wil not go there because in the last decade Vancouver has been our biggest rivals… and judging by MG's past moves … he will make some dumb deal happen with Florida

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Red John

Finally Schneider gets dealt for a poor return

Since when is a top 10 pick in a great draft year a poor return for Schneider?

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Red John

Everyone is forgetting here that Mike Gillis is a smug man with quite the ego. He didn't buy out David Booth because he doesn't want to admit he lost that trade with the Panthers - going to give Booth every chance possible to save face.

That's small scale. Now think about the Hodgson trade. Gillis has been vilified for that move - he's going to give Kassian every chance to look good on that trade. Kassian won't be moved unless it's a significant overpayment.

Now think how big this whole Luongo fiasco has been. Finally Schneider gets dealt for a poor return....there is ZERO chance Horvat will be traded for a guy like Cammalleri. Horvat will be given every chance in the next 5-7 years to be an impact player for the canucks and again won't be dealt unless it's for a huge return.

Never discount "golden boy" status...usually reserved for 1st round picks and guys acquired in big trades. Kris Chucko got more chances than he deserved with the Flames...how much more will guys like Kassian and Horvat get.

No deal.

Gillis would have gladly bought out Booth if it was not for Booth's injury. From what i read in Vancouver papers he was not happy that Booth was injured during buy out time.

I agree with the rest of your post.

[Red John]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Since when is a top 10 pick in a great draft year a poor return for Schneider?

It is when other teams were offering more.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Red John

It is when other teams were offering more.

Source? We've heard Gillis was demanding more from EDM. Doesn't necessarily mean they offered more. And IMO it's perfectly understandable to not hand a starting goalie to your division rival who badly needs one. EDM having good goaltending makes it harder for VAN to make the playoffs.

[dissentowner]

Anybody who thinks Kassian has potential obviously did not see the guy play in junior. I have never seen a player in any league take more timely stupid penalties that directly hurt their team. There is nothing on the Flames I would trade for Kassian because I would hate to have him here.

[Flash Walken]

I'm not putting any kind of argument behind whether horvat is on the table or not for Vancouver, but, I will say, that David Booth is a significant, significant anchor to that organization and they should be desperate to remove him from the equation.

4.5 million dollar anchor. That is massive wasted cap on a contending team, especially on a team lacking in top 6 talent.

You've gotta look to the future always, but schneider was their best trade chip (without touching some core pieces), and maybe could have been used to bring in a second line centre or shooting winger, which they appear desperate for right now.

[herashak]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Since when is a top 10 pick in a great draft year a poor return for Schneider?

Franchise goalie for a potential #2 C

[brodyboy26]

If Gillis doesn't overpay for a scorer right away they will be out of the playoffs and he will probably be fired. they have scored one goal in 5 of last 7 games... he's locked up an older core long term with the expectation they are a playoff team..and playoffs are slipping away quickly.. he may overpay to save his job....flames might as well sniff around...I don't know how many other potential 40 goal guys with proven playoff scoring ability are on the market right now?? would gillis give up a #1 pick or top-high end prospect for a chance at playoffs? I'm sure he would give it serious consideration.

[FlameZilla]

I imagine these are the assets that are (or will eventually be) in play. I've included what I would hope their value would be.

Cammalleri: Traded for 1st round pick + prospect or re-signed to 2-year deal at or less than $5 AAV. He's a good talent and personality to have around during a rebuild. Great attitude & seems to have a rapport with the kids.

Stajan: Traded for pick (realistically he won't fetch a 1st rounder, so hopefully a 2nd or 3rd rounder), or packaged with other assets for a young NHLer or prospect. There is no scenario where I would like to see him re-signed.

Butler: Traded for literally anything. Might fetch us a 4th round pick, or packaged with another asset for a prospect. Butler has played better of late and is on a decent value contract. We may be stuck with him.

S.O.B.: He'd be a great 7th defenceman if it weren't for his contract. He'll be tough to move for anything substantial. If Jackman can fetch a 6th round pick then anything is possible. I absolutely hated O'Brien's play early in the season, but I think he's played better since being paired with Smid.

Wideman: I could see some teams calling Feaster with regards to this puck-moving D man. A team like Philadelphia is in the market for a defenceman in his mold. I could see him being packaged with another asset in exchange for a promising young forward or D prospect. It would be painful to lose such a solid presence, but I think he's one of our most valuable & expendable assets.

Russell: I would like to see re-signed to another good-value contract.

Stempniak: I keep flip-flopping between wanting him traded of re-signing him. I could see him garnering a decent return if he was packaged with another asset. On his own I think he's worth a 2nd rounder max.

Backlund: If he's to be traded I hope it's for a bonafide young NHL asset. Feaster will have put Mik's name out on the market because he believes he's an asset which could fetch us a substantial return. With the right package I think he could get us a Jake Gardiner, Brett Connolly or similar young player. If the return isn't stellar then I hope he sticks around. No point trading him just for the sake of it.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by herashak

Franchise goalie for a potential #2 C

I wouldn't call Schneider a franchise goalie at this point and it's a little early make a call on Horvat's potential.

[BACKCHECK!!!]

Originally Posted by FlameZilla

I imagine these are the assets that are (or will eventually be) in play. I've included what I would hope their value would be.

Cammalleri: Traded for 1st round pick + prospect or re-signed to 2-year deal at or less than $5 AAV. He's a good talent and personality to have around during a rebuild. Great attitude & seems to have a rapport with the kids.

Stajan: Traded for pick (realistically he won't fetch a 1st rounder, so hopefully a 2nd or 3rd rounder), or packaged with other assets for a young NHLer or prospect. There is no scenario where I would like to see him re-signed.

Butler: Traded for literally anything. Might fetch us a 4th round pick, or packaged with another asset for a prospect. Butler has played better of late and is on a decent value contract. We may be stuck with him.

S.O.B.: He'd be a great 7th defenceman if it weren't for his contract. He'll be tough to move for anything substantial. If Jackman can fetch a 6th round pick then anything is possible. I absolutely hated O'Brien's play early in the season, but I think he's played better since being paired with Smid.

Wideman: I could see some teams calling Feaster with regards to this puck-moving D man. A team like Philadelphia is in the market for a defenceman in his mold. I could see him being packaged with another asset in exchange for a promising young forward or D prospect. It would be painful to lose such a solid presence, but I think he's one of our most valuable & expendable assets.

Russell: I would like to see re-signed to another good-value contract.

Stempniak: I keep flip-flopping between wanting him traded of re-signing him. I could see him garnering a decent return if he was packaged with another asset. On his own I think he's worth a 2nd rounder max.

Backlund: If he's to be traded I hope it's for a bonafide young NHL asset. Feaster will have put Mik's name out on the market because he believes he's an asset which could fetch us a substantial return. With the right package I think he could get us a Jake Gardiner, Brett Connolly or similar young player. If the return isn't stellar then I hope he sticks around. No point trading him just for the sake of it.

You realize that would leave a team that would be worse than anything the Oilers have ever iced?

Players that remain:
Backlund - recent AHLer
Baertschi - recent AHLer
Berra. - should be in the AHL
Bouma. - recent AHLer
Breen. - AHLer
Brodie. - recent AHLer
Colborne - recent AHLer
Galiardi. - recently flipped for a depth pick
Giordano - definitely an NHLer
Glencross - definitely an NHLer
Hudler. - definitely an NHLer
B Jones. - AHLer
D Jones. - definitely an NHLer
Knight. - AHLer
McGrattan - yeah
Monahan. - should be in AHL
Reinhart. - AHLer
Ramo. - recent KHLer
Russel. - recently flipped for depth pick
Smid. - definitely an NHLer
Smith. - recent AHLer
Wotherspoon - AHLer


That's 14 guys who are either rookies, minor leaguers, or have very recently been minor leaguers (not counting the lockout), 2 guys who were flipped by their teams for depth picks (ie throwaways), and 4 established vets.

That would be horrific.

[herashak]

Originally Posted by Jacks

I wouldn't call Schneider a franchise goalie at this point and it's a little early make a call on Horvat's potential.

schneider is pretty much a guarenteed top 10 nhl goalie with another 6-7 years in his prime, basically gillies if he reaches his potential. Would you trade that for someone between monahan and knight.

[Poe969]

Originally Posted by BACKCHECK!!!

You realize that would leave a team that would be worse than anything the Oilers have ever iced?

Players that remain:
Backlund - recent AHLer
Baertschi - recent AHLer
Berra. - should be in the AHL
Bouma. - recent AHLer
Breen. - AHLer
Brodie. - recent AHLer
Colborne - recent AHLer
Galiardi. - recently flipped for a depth pick
Giordano - definitely an NHLer
Glencross - definitely an NHLer
Hudler. - definitely an NHLer
B Jones. - AHLer
D Jones. - definitely an NHLer
Knight. - AHLer
McGrattan - yeah
Monahan. - should be in AHL
Reinhart. - AHLer
Ramo. - recent KHLer
Russel. - recently flipped for depth pick
Smid. - definitely an NHLer
Smith. - recent AHLer
Wotherspoon - AHLer


That's 14 guys who are either rookies, minor leaguers, or have very recently been minor leaguers (not counting the lockout), 2 guys who were flipped by their teams for depth picks (ie throwaways), and 4 established vets.

That would be horrific.

Ya, with that kind of roster, we'd look like a rebuilding team who was close to the bottom of the league in position to get a lottery pick and have a bunch of prospects. Instead we should shoot for 9th place and maybe pick up more vets

[strombad]

Originally Posted by BACKCHECK!!!

You realize that would leave a team that would be worse than anything the Oilers have ever iced?

Players that remain:
Backlund - recent AHLer
Baertschi - recent AHLer
Berra. - should be in the AHL
Bouma. - recent AHLer
Breen. - AHLer
Brodie. - recent AHLer
Colborne - recent AHLer
Galiardi. - recently flipped for a depth pick
Giordano - definitely an NHLer
Glencross - definitely an NHLer
Hudler. - definitely an NHLer
B Jones. - AHLer
D Jones. - definitely an NHLer
Knight. - AHLer
McGrattan - yeah
Monahan. - should be in AHL
Reinhart. - AHLer
Ramo. - recent KHLer
Russel. - recently flipped for depth pick
Smid. - definitely an NHLer
Smith. - recent AHLer
Wotherspoon - AHLer


That's 14 guys who are either rookies, minor leaguers, or have very recently been minor leaguers (not counting the lockout), 2 guys who were flipped by their teams for depth picks (ie throwaways), and 4 established vets.

That would be horrific.

I'm not sure what significance there is to labelling some guys as "recently minor leaguers."

Brodie, Russell, Monahan, and Backlund are all bonafide NHLers at this point, with Baertschi being questionable and Berra showing all the qualities of a dependable NHL backup.

Plus, to think we wouldn't sign veterans in the off season isn't very logical, so at worst we'd be looking at a team like that for a couple months.

Horrific is a little much.

[moon]

Originally Posted by herashak

schneider is pretty much a guarenteed top 10 nhl goalie with another 6-7 years in his prime, basically gillies if he reaches his potential. Would you trade that for someone between monahan and knight.

He hasn't been a top 10 goalie at any point in his career so far what makes him a pretty much guarantee to be a top 10 goalie for the next 6-7 years?

The range between Monahan and Knight is enormous so pretty tough to answer that but if it was close to Monahan then yes I would gladly trade Schneider to get that.

[Vulcan]

I imagine that Gillis is in a win now situation, the same that Darryl was in, in his last years. This makes for desperate times. I'd be happy to try and fleece Gillis or any other GM in that situation.

[herashak]

Originally Posted by moon

He hasn't been a top 10 goalie at any point in his career so far what makes him a pretty much guarantee to be a top 10 goalie for the next 6-7 years?

The range between Monahan and Knight is enormous so pretty tough to answer that but if it was close to Monahan then yes I would gladly trade Schneider to get that.

Except he has done nothing but play like a top 10 nhl goalie since hes been in the league. i dont see how you can name 9 goalies better than him you can try. horvat looks solid but definitely not what im trading a young promising goalie with 100 games experience for.

[FlamesAllTheWay]

Originally Posted by FlameZilla

Stajan: Traded for pick (realistically he won't fetch a 1st rounder, so hopefully a 2nd or 3rd rounder), or packaged with other assets for a young NHLer or prospect. There is no scenario where I would like to see him re-signed.

If I had to wager a guess I think we'll see Stajan brought back on a much cheaper deal to be our 3rd line centre for the time beung. Pretty responsible defensively, good leader/team guy and decent in the face off dot.

Also I think the organization has wanted Backlund to emerge as a top 2 centre, which he has not, but they also don't see him being as being a part of our bottom 2. Probably part of why he's being shopped at this point and all the more reason to keep Stajan around for a few more years as a depth guy.

[FAN]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Anybody who thinks Kassian has potential obviously did not see the guy play in junior. I have never seen a player in any league take more timely stupid penalties that directly hurt their team.

How is that even a good measure of a player's potential? If anything, both Sabres fans and Canucks fans have complained about Kassian not being physical enough. Looking at his stats, he's had 3 minor penalties this season. That's as many as 4-time Lady Byng winner Datsyuk.