[CP Story] Roster Choices and Tough Guys

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Yep. The problem isn't McGrattan, Jackman, Bouma or Galiardi in isolation. It's the fact Hartley is playing all 4 of them in the same game. I think ideally all four of those guys are 4th liners. Which means at least one of our top 3 lines is taking a hit offensively by playing a grinder.

I doubt Hartley is suddenly going to change his mind on playing these guys. So we either wait for an injury or a trade to reduce the LOFT quotient on the bottom couple lines.

Galiradi was top 6 on a San Jose play off team and in his 5 year career before this year was never a 4th liner. The Flames are so good he becomes a 4th liner?

[moon]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Galiradi was top 6 on a San Jose play off team and in his 5 year career before this year was never a 4th liner. The Flames are so good he becomes a 4th liner?

Galiardi was only used in top 6 as a replacement for Torres after the suspension and was basically the 9th forward all year on the SJ Sharks all that year. Prior to that he has been up and down with average time on ice basically around the 8th/9th guy.

But he also has played like crap this year so yes it does make sense that as he declines in play his time should drop from a lower 3rd liner to a 4th liner.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Galiradi was top 6 on a San Jose play off team and in his 5 year career before this year was never a 4th liner. The Flames are so good he becomes a 4th liner?

If he was such a good top 6 forward why would they give him away for a 4th round pick? The Flames signed him to a $1.25M deal you figure SJ would love to have kept him at that price if they viewed him as anything more than a 4th liner/13th forward

[Vinny01]

I do realize why Gillis made the move to get Kassian a little more now. Having Iggy for all those years was great. Having a forward who would hit, fight, and have the skill level to be an elite player is rare. The Canucks were banking on Kassian becoming a Lucic type player and they are almost as few and far between as legit top line centres. Team toughness is very important and the Flames while they have been harder to play against are still bottom 5 in hits. McGratten and Jackman on the 4th line are not providing much and the loss of Glencross does sting. The Flames need a guy that can play in the top 6 but with a real mean streak if they want to get their old 2004 identity back

[nightfx]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I do realize why Gillis made the move to get Kassian a little more now. Having Iggy for all those years was great. Having a forward who would hit, fight, and have the skill level to be an elite player is rare. The Canucks were banking on Kassian becoming a Lucic type player and they are almost as few and far between as legit top line centres. Team toughness is very important and the Flames while they have been harder to play against are still bottom 5 in hits. McGratten and Jackman on the 4th line are not providing much and the loss of Glencross does sting. The Flames need a guy that can play in the top 6 but with a real mean streak if they want to get their old 2004 identity back

Michael Ferland is our only hope.

[Imported_Aussie]

Jackman is redundant - Galiardi and Bouma are younger and better hockey players, and all he has over them are a few pounds. He should be moved, and that extra forward spot could be used to give time to guys playing well in Abbotsford, like Reinhart.
McGrattan is redundant until he is let off the chain - you wouldn't get a skilled guy to "hold off on taking shots" so why would you get a guy whose bread and butter is to play physical and drop the gloves if warranted, to play a more conservative game? Either let him off the chain or bench him.

[djsFlames]

Out: Jackman, McGrattan (press box), Galiardi (cond stint, whatever)

In: Jones, Ferland, Knight

Baertschi - Monahan - Ferland
Bouma - Knight - Jones

Please and thank you.

[Jacks]

He'll probably never make it but it would sure be sweet if Kanzig developed into a #4 Dman. We wouldn't need a 4th line goon at all.

[Flashpoint]

Great article, thanks for putting it up.

If nothing else Jackman and McGrattan demonstrate what it takes to stay in the NHL when you don't have puck side talent. A willingness to sacrifice your physical well being for your teammates.

That has to have an impression. Hartley will play the guys who are on page, and willing to put what he asks out on the ice. It doesn't matter how "blue chip" you are - if you don't do it, you're benched.

I'm all for him playing both thugs as long as it takes for a prospect to take their jobs. Till that happens, stay the course.

[six pack]

I miss Tim too. Tim was a leader as well. Doesn't bode well that this team is not looking after each other.

[btimbit]

The problem with McGrattan is he's almost too tough, you can see during games people are scared to fight him. They'd rather exchange punches with someone like SOB instead. The other half, like others have mentioned, is the restraints placed on him by Hartley. He's not allowed to play his hockey, which results in him trying to skate around people and dump the puck in. Then look at the season he had last year.

I don't think we need both Jackman and McGrattan. I'd rather see Grats allowed to do what he does, then a few middle weight crash and bang types rather than two full time goons. I love Reinhart on this team and it'd be nice to see someone like Knight and/or Jooris play a few games to see what he's got. I'm a Jackman fan but he's started to slow down and McGrattan's made him a bit redundant. At the very least they shouldn't be on the same line, what's the benefit of having both out there at the same time?

Hardest thing for me to watch this season is the lack of physicality from this team. We're getting pushed around, and there's been lots of games where our Goalie is continuously getting run into or completely bowled over with no response.

[doctajones428]

Waive Jackman, give Reinhart his spot.

Bouma - Reinhart - McGrattan

/thread

McGrattan hasn't been our problem. Lack of urgency from everyone not named Russel is the problem

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by doctajones428

Waive Jackman, give Reinhart his spot.

Bouma - Reinhart - McGrattan

/thread

McGrattan hasn't been our problem. Lack of urgency from everyone not named Russel is the problem

Love it. /thread

[4oh3]

We need at least mcgrattan if someone messes with one of the young guys they need somebody to help them out

[4oh3]

Mcgrattan won me over when he beat sesito and soluted the city of calgary

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Galiradi was top 6 on a San Jose play off team and in his 5 year career before this year was never a 4th liner. The Flames are so good he becomes a 4th liner?

you don't think it's easier for depth/role players to fill in for injury on lines that are are loaded up with skill already?? He went from being a scratch 12 games in a row to playing on the sharks talent-loaded top line.

you can't expect the same results on another roster that doesn't have anything remotely close to the skill level of the sharks. Elite talent can help make players around them better. That's easily the case for galiardi and the sharks.

no disrespect to galiardi, hard working player, but i think he's over his head in trying to be an offense generator for the flames. prefer him being a north/south, energy guy for the flames who can play a decent 200 foot game.

[Machiavelli]

Originally Posted by doctajones428

Waive Jackman, give Reinhart his spot.

Bouma - Reinhart - McGrattan

/thread

McGrattan hasn't been our problem. Lack of urgency from everyone not named Russel is the problem

Thanking isn't enough. This is exactly what should happen.

[Ashasx]

I don't know if I want Reinhart on the 4th line, though...

It should probably be Jones until a spot opens on the 3rd line for Max.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Do Corbin Knight and Rienhart and Ferland and Wotherspoon and Ramage develop better by being an important part of a great AHL team or being a bit player on a lottery pick NHL team?

Unless they are ready to jump into the NHL role playing more than 10 minutes a game I think that developing a winning attitude and playing in important games is better for them at this point in their career.

I like what the Flames are doing with their current NHL ready prospects:

Right now Hartley is trying to work Brodie (23), Colbourne(23), Backlund (24), Baertschi(21), Bouma(23) and Monahan(19) into the NHL. That is 6 regulars out of 18 .

If 5 out of 6 are better next year than this Hartley should get some sort of award.

That is the prime goal of this season.


Does anyone think Bouma would flourish if he got the McGrattan role and had to fight Gazdic? The Flames sit McGrattan and Jackman then it would be a surprise if Gadzic did not try to inspire the wimpy Oilers by spanking Bouma if Bouma showed up.


Gadzic is on the smallest least aggressive team in the league.

Against the LA , St.L , Dallas, Toronto. Boston teams that have figured out that small skilled teams usually fold when bullied

Montreal has a small soft skilled team and have 14 fights in 19 games....

Yep lets get rid of our fighters and see what happens to the collection of young guys led by veteran small guys Hudler, Cammalleri and Russell.

Good post, but I think this points to errors in the construction of the team that hopefully Burke will fix.

Also, maybe we have the wrong tough guys?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I don't know if I want Reinhart on the 4th line, though...

Until he proves otherwise, that's where the guy fits. He hasn't exactly been lighting up the AHL. At this point, there's little reason to believe he'll develop a scoring touch at the NHL level.