[PGT] Flames lose 5-4 in shootout against Capitals

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by FBI

As much as I hate to say it, Butler didn't look THAT bad last night.

Russell is the new Butler.

[_Q_]

I thought Glencross, Stajan & Stempniak looked a step slower than they usually do. Maybe it was being rusty, maybe it was injuries, or maybe they were just in over their heads. Either way, as the de facto #1 line, they need to be better.

Backlund looked OK... nothing special.

Hudler was streaky, looking good sometimes and horrible at others.

Galiardi looked terrible, even before that penalty.

Baertschi and Monahan looked pretty good I thought, especially at the beginning of the game. They kind of slowed down a bit. Maybe it was an injury to Monahan as was previously mentioned.

Jones looked surprisingly good.

Bouma and Street played really well, although I was baffled when Hartley threw Street out there for the Power Play so many times. He's just not good enough to get PP time.

McGrattan was McGrattan.

Brodie and Giordano looked like they were in over their head. I remember Brodie looking like this at the end of last season when he became a #1 D-man after the Bouwmeester trade. He seemed to figure it out as the games wore on, so I'm not too worried about him.

I thought Russell had a horrible game.

Wideman had an OK game.

SOB-Butler looked unremarkable, but not particularly bad. Just not particularly good, which is OK in my opinion for those two.

Ramo, I thought looked decent, other than the shoot-out and break away. I don't know why, but I think he'll get much better.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by 868904

Agreed, maybe a better balance is needed; however, both Sven and Monahan actually got more ice than Street, and Street was much more impressive when he was on the ice.

Just think some posters are way too enamoured with the sexy prospects and think they can do no wrong. When Iggy broke in, he wasn't handed 20 minutes a night right away. There were some tough learning experiences for him too. Plus I always see these posters commenting on how great the Oilers do it with Eberle, Hall, RNH, Yakupov and how they load them up with ice time, well, sure those players put up points, but do they win? Can they hold leads? Can they defend? Not really.

You have to teach the kids to play defence properly and to compete in the defensive end when they are young. THat's how it gets ingrained into their game and that's how they become winners. Oilers have some great young players, but they aren't winners, yet. They won't be winners, till those young guys start competing in the defensive end.

I agree that you have to teach them defense. And I agree that they have to earn their ice-time. And I agree that just giving them first line minutes like the Oilers did is not the right way to develop kids.

Having said all that, Monahan and Baertschi busted their tails all night. They did the things that were asked of them. In OT, one point is already earned and they either get the other point or they don't - no harm no foul.

How about throwing them a little bone and giving them an opportunity to win the game? How about also sending the message that, hey kids, we believe in you? How about also remembering that it's a game and it's played best when the players are having fun?

Giving them one shift in OT is not going to get in the way of them learning things the right way. But it's going to do a lot to instill some positivity and some confidence in them.

[Anduril]

Surprised to be seeing as many negative views on Russell's performance and mentions of a bad habit of dropping down and sliding?
I didn't get to watch 100% of the game but was otherwise viewing for a good 80+% of it and I only saw Russell drop down twice. First time he broke up a play and second was taken advantage my Ovechkin. Afterwards Russell adjusted and stayed on his feet.

Overall a decent game from him.

[Enoch Root]

I don't like the slide play, but other than that, I thought Russell played very well.

[LouCypher]

I have faith that Ramo will improve his game as time goes on, shootout can certainly be improved. Kipper had a really hard time with shootouts at first but I think he adapted well, I think Ramo can to.

[CSharp]

Great first period. It was definitely a surprise to see the Flames up 3-0 while the Caps sucked with their home opener. But, I was hoping that the kids would hold on to their lead and win the game to upset the hometown crowd.

The 2nd and 3rd periods were usual Flames attitude on sitting on the lead. Glen-X on the 5-on-3 offensive faceoff loss was just totally pathetic. Baertschi actually looked good. I have no qualms about his effort last night. But, where the heck was Monahan? He was our 6th overall pick. Cripes, he was bascially non-existent. Iggy in his first game as a Flames vs Monahan last night - yeah, no comparison.

Ramo - why do I get a feeling he's in the same category as Irving, McBackup and all the Flames' butterfly-style goalies? I feel McD is a much better goalie. Definitely miss Kipper in net, but I hope Ramo proves me wrong.

[Textcritic]

^
Did you seriously just complain that an 18-year-old high draft pick did not look as good as a future first-ballot Hall-of-Famer in his first NHL game?!

[Day Tripper]

Originally Posted by CSharp

But, where the heck was Monahan? He was our 6th overall pick. Cripes, he was bascially non-existent. Iggy in his first game as a Flames vs Monahan last night - yeah, no comparison.

What, do you expect him to be anywhere near as good as Iginla someday? Most first overall picks will never be as good as Iginla, let alone sixth.

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

^
Did you seriously just complain that an 18-year-old high draft pick did not look as good as a future first-ballot Hall-of-Famer in his first NHL game?!

Yes, I'm still having Iggy and Kipper withdrawal symptoms

However, I did praise Baertschi on his efforts from last night game.

[cannon7]

Galiardi needs to bounce back tonight after that horrendous debut.

Ramo needs to be better, can't blame him for every goal, but he needs to be better.

[Savvy27]

RE: Russell's sliding plays

The Flames have actually been practicing those defensive slides, so I wouldn't put it all on Russell. I'm actually not a big fan of leaving the feet if it can be avoided, but the Flames coaches have a different view.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by moon

Probably what most people should have expected from this team a lot of energy and effort but not enough talent to maintain that level of play they showed early on for a full 60 minutes. Plus a real struggle defensively to keep the other team at bay for a full 60 minutes. This team looks like it will give the fans some moments/periods of excting play at least.

I liked what I saw from most of the young guys. Backlund was surprisingly decent, although struggled on the FO's. Monahan and Baertschi weren't great but also didn't look out of place and made some nice plays.

I thought Ramo was at best okay but looked shakey on some plays that could have resulted in goals and even if they were tips/breakaway did not make that big save the team needed. Should be expected for a guy with his background so can't be too shocked/mad about that.

I think the posters that continually get mad at those with criticisms or try and sugar coat everything are going to be as unbearable or probably most obnoxious than the critical posters. This year is going to have a lot of people with different views/opinions on what we see out there and hopefully posters can just deal with it civilly rather than the whining we have started to see in this PGT already.

Or it was the first game of the year and systems/chemistry/lines/consistency/goaltending/discipline/sharpness should be expected to have lapses over 60 minutes? If you're going to put it that way, then the Caps had an awful 30 or so minutes, but that definitely was not due to talent.

This is October hockey. It won't look the same as November hockey. And November hockey won't look the same as March hockey. It's like this every year. Can only evaluate accurately on individual levels, at this point.

Their performance as a team was admirable though, for an October 3rd game.

It's great to see positives coming from you, though.

[djsFlames]

Those being overly critical of Monahan's first NHL game need to give their heads a shake.

Guy admitted he was nervous as hell. You could tell by his vs Baertschi's play the difference in the amount of games each had played. But he still even picked up a point.

A kid gets a pass for game 1 from me every time. I'll begin my evaluations after tonight.

[Dienasty]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

^
Did you seriously just complain that an 18-year-old high draft pick did not look as good as a future first-ballot Hall-of-Famer in his first NHL game?!

Not to mention Iggy was a year older (played his next season of junior after his draft year)

A little bit different

[Calgary4LIfe]

Count me in as one of the few that thinks Hartley is bringing Baertschi and Monahan along decently.

Neither one of those players last night showed too much. Jones (who I wasn't a fan of at all) drove that line all night.

When they are having good solid shifts doing good things at both ends of the rink, they will of course be rewarded. You can't expect them to get loads of minutes in their first game. As the game went on, neither of them showed they deserved more minutes.

They will get better, and Hartley will reward them. I think the most important thing regarding the Flames is developing a culture of consistent hard work. Eventually Baertschi and Monahan (and every other future prospect) is going to earn their time into the higher lines with more minutes. The organization not only 'needs' them to, but WANTS them to. Just handing out big minutes is a bit of a disservice to the rest of the team.

Yes, you want them to develop properly. Flames didn't go out and sign a bunch of vets this off-season with the intent to compete. The Flames' top 6 are fairly one of the least talented in the NHL - only a matter of time before the kids start working their way up and taking jobs away.

When the new batch of kids come in, they will have to earn every minute of their time as well. Eventually you are left with a hard-working and hopefully a winning culture. Giving prospects development time isn't as simple as throwing them onto the top 2 lines and allowing them to fix their game. It is giving them top minutes in the AHL/Junior/Wherever else, and then bringing them up and making them earn their minutes while sheltering them.

Street showed a lot of heart, work ethic and had an all-round great game. He deserved the PP time and over-time. When Sven and/or Monahan do the same, they will get their time as well, without question.

EVERY coach prefers the vets over rookies, as the vets make less mistakes on defence. However, Hartley is also a coach that has brought along some notable youngsters in his time. He is a great coach for youth. I personally love his approach this year. This was the toughest camp that O'Brien has ever gone through from all the other 6 teams he has been on. He is positive, but also tough when he needs to be. That sounds like to me the proper coach to have around in a rebuild.

The kids will all get their chances. It is good to reward someone like Street who works his tail off constantly, and who is always sacrificing his body to make the right plays. He gets rewarded. What does this tell Sven and Sean to do? A light bulb should go off in their heads. The coach trusts Street because Street has earned that confidence. Sean and Sven will as well in time, as will every other prospect that has an NHL future with the Flames.

This is why you don't make Glencross a captain. Giordano plays a much harder working game every night (even last year, which was a terrible year for him, you could see him trying). Glencross takes too many damn nights off and sulks too much - though his pay-grade allows him to do so. If Glencross worked as hard as street, he would probably be close to a consistent 40 goal scorer and would be making more than double what he makes now.

This is the message that the Flames have to send to every prospect. Come in, work hard, do what you are told, and you will get lots of time. Don't do it, and you will not be a Flame.

Oilers didn't surround their prospects with good vets, and few have ever had to work for their spots. Yakupov I think will end up being a better player in the long run because they aren't doing that with him - he is having to earn his minutes. That is the proper way to develop.

There is nobody on here that said Baertschi and Monahan were better than any of the forwards ahead of them, or better than Bouma and Street. They WILL be, and when they are equal at least, they will be given more minutes and responsibilities. It will come soon.

In Monahan's case, he is going to get some PP and PK minutes before his 9 game stint is up. Flames need to see him in all situations coming up so they can make a better decision on whether to keep him or send him back. For his first NHL game, those weren't bad minutes at all. I bet it increases every game. Probably for both of them, unless they are having a terrible game/effort and get stapled to the bench.

[Burner]

Caps defenseman Jack Hillen underwent a successful surgery on Friday and will be out for 4-6 months (fractured tibial plateau)
Retweeted by Rob Kerr

[EYE_Overstand]

Originally Posted by Burner

Caps defenseman Jack Hillen underwent a successful surgery on Friday and will be out for 4-6 months (fractured tibial plateau)
Retweeted by Rob Kerr

More big hits by bouma pls

[t0rrent98]

If it weren't for OV.. the Flames would have easily won this game.. IMO.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Burner

Caps defenseman Jack Hillen underwent a successful surgery on Friday and will be out for 4-6 months (fractured tibial plateau)
Retweeted by Rob Kerr

Wow, brutal. Just a freak injury, but a tough break especially after missing half of last season with an injury. He was one of those undrafted players that was just starting to make a name for himself a couple of seasons ago and now injuries are really derailing his progress.