2013 NCAA football thread

[transplant99]

Miami is on pace to win 98-0 against Savannah St.

Stanford looks like they are the real deal....cant wait for thay nov 7 game when they host Oregon.

[MRCboicgy]

Didn't the Big Ten ban games against I-AA (not going to call it FCS). In a way, it's nice to prevent a lot of these travesties, but in other ways, the $$ really helps smaller schools.

Oh well, there are enough low-end teams that can fill in.

[Senator Clay Davis]

77-7 after 3. If I was Savannah State I would just leave and head on home.

[ResAlien]

Michigan decides to have another close one, wins 24-21. Better get these kinks worked out quick boys.

[Stay Golden]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

Michigan decides to have another close one, wins 24-21. Better get these kinks worked out quick boys.

yep or they will start mounting up losses. Get Morris with equal reps to Gardner so Garner realizes he is on a short leash and for crying out loud get Green with at least 10 plays, he is going to be much better than Toussaint. Sure Toussaint had 120 yds rushing but he had 8 carries for a loss.
He is terrible with first contact and can only make anything happen on the outside or if there is a Semi wide hole to run through and that is slim to none.
Hoke has got to be irritated having to deal with bad media scrums after ugly wins. It is up to him to pull Gardner and Toussaint when it is clearly not working early.

[transplant99]

The Big 10 commish fires back at those athletes that want to be compensated.

"Maybe in football and basketball, it would work better if more kids had a chance to go directly into the professional ranks," Delany said. "If they're not comfortable and want to monetize, let the minor leagues flourish. Train at IMG, get agents to invest in your body, get agents to invest in your likeness and establish it on your own. But don't come here and say, 'We want to be paid $25,000 or $50,000.' Go to the D-League and get it, go to the NBA and get it, go to the NFL and get it. Don't ask us what we've been doing.

"If an athlete wants to professionalize themselves, professionalize themselves. We've been training kids for professional sports. I argue it's the color, I argue it's the institution. If you think it's about you, then talk to John Havlicek about that, you've got to talk to Michael Jordan about that. These brands have been built over 100 years."

"You don't have to play for the Redskins or the Bears at 17, but you could develop IMG," Delany said. "My gosh, there are lots of trainers out there. There are quarterback coaches teaching passing skills, guys lifting weights, guys training and running. They can get as strong and as fast in that environment as they can in this environment. Plus, they don't have to go to school. Plus, they can sell their likeness and do whatever they want to do. We don't want to do that. What we want to do is do what we've been doing for 100 years. ...

"I think we ought to work awful hard with the NFL and the NBA to create an opportunity for those folks. We have it in baseball, we have it in golf, works pretty good, we have it in golf, we have it in hockey. Why don't we have it in football, basketball? Why is it our job to be minor leagues for professional sports?"

[valo403]

You know what that's a great argument that I didn't really think of when considering all the things at play here.

The NCAA isn't forcing these guys to play there, they could very well go ahead and train on their own, or better yet bring suit against the NFL and NBA in order to play at whatever age they wish. Training on your own, or being in the minors, isn't as appealing because it wouldn't allow athletes to leverage off of the platform, and enjoy the benefits and frills, of big time college sports. As much as these programs use athletes to benefit them, plenty of athletes are using programs to enhance their brand.

[Stay Golden]

"Maybe in football and basketball, it would work better if more kids had a chance to go directly into the professional ranks," Delany said. "If they're not comfortable and want to monetize, let the minor leagues flourish. Train at IMG, get agents to invest in your body, get agents to invest in your likeness and establish it on your own. But don't come here and say, 'We want to be paid $25,000 or $50,000.' Go to the D-League and get it, go to the NBA and get it, go to the NFL and get it. Don't ask us what we've been doing.

"If an athlete wants to professionalize themselves, professionalize themselves. We've been training kids for professional sports. I argue it's the color, I argue it's the institution. If you think it's about you, then talk to John Havlicek about that, you've got to talk to Michael Jordan about that. These brands have been built over 100 years."

"You don't have to play for the Redskins or the Bears at 17, but you could develop IMG," Delany said. "My gosh, there are lots of trainers out there. There are quarterback coaches teaching passing skills, guys lifting weights, guys training and running. They can get as strong and as fast in that environment as they can in this environment. Plus, they don't have to go to school. Plus, they can sell their likeness and do whatever they want to do. We don't want to do that. What we want to do is do what we've been doing for 100 years. ...

"I think we ought to work awful hard with the NFL and the NBA to create an opportunity for those folks. We have it in baseball, we have it in golf, works pretty good, we have it in golf, we have it in hockey. Why don't we have it in football, basketball? Why is it our job to be minor leagues for professional sports?"

I completely agree what was said. If these young men think they can make the NFL without going to NCAA by all means go for it. you won't get the same high standard of training and competition to better themselves and they won't as players get too far.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by valo403

You know what that's a great argument that I didn't really think of when considering all the things at play here.

The NCAA isn't forcing these guys to play there, they could very well go ahead and train on their own, or better yet bring suit against the NFL and NBA in order to play at whatever age they wish. Training on your own, or being in the minors, isn't as appealing because it wouldn't allow athletes to leverage off of the platform, and enjoy the benefits and frills, of big time college sports. As much as these programs use athletes to benefit them, plenty of athletes are using programs to enhance their brand.

Sure, I think his point is a good one, but isn't in the NCAA who wants to keep the 2 year/ 1 year minimums in Football and Basketball so they keep their recruits.

Also, I'm (somewhat) okay with the universities not paying these athletes, but they should be allowed to get a job (and if it pays $25,000 a year to be a security guard at the local dealership, so be it) or sell their autographs. The NCAA prevents them from making ANY money, even if it's off their own likeness.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Sure, I think his point is a good one, but isn't in the NCAA who wants to keep the 2 year/ 1 year minimums in Football and Basketball so they keep their recruits.

Also, I'm (somewhat) okay with the universities not paying these athletes, but they should be allowed to get a job (and if it pays $25,000 a year to be a security guard at the local dealership, so be it) or sell their autographs. The NCAA prevents them from making ANY money, even if it's off their own likeness.

Is it? Those are NBA and NFL policies. I don't doubt that the NCAA is rather happy they exist, but would they go to bat for them if it really came down to it? I'd be interested to see what the NCAA had to say if they were called in a case like the Clarett case against the NFL (anti-trust case arguing against the age restriction). If their position is as Delany puts it you'd think they'd file an amicus brief urging the court to allow athletes free choice.

The interesting thing is I don't think that removing those restrictions would change much for football, at least not for a long time. NCAA programs offer the resources to turn high school athletes into professionals. They have the best coaches, they have the best facilities, they have the most exposure and most importantly they have the most money. The NFL minor leagues would be miles behind in pretty much every category. I'd be interested to see if that reality would lead a court to say that the NCAA has effectively cornered the market. Could be some really interesting stuff in this area in the next little while.

I agree with your second point. I don't love the idea of players getting fake jobs that pay ridiculously, but really that's no different than an appearance fee for showing up at a promo event.

[SuperMatt18]

Still don't really get how they get away with not letting players get paid for their own likeness.

If Nike wants to give Clowney a couple hundred thousand to be a spokesperson this year why not just let him get paid.

How does that in any way break the integrity of being an "amateur" athlete when the NCAA is flaunting these guys each week on primetime television.

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

If Nike wants to give Clowney a couple hundred thousand to be a spokesperson this year why not just let him get paid.

Because Oregon would win the national championship every year...

[Senator Clay Davis]

Incorrect, Texas would be the national champs every year. They wanna give $10 million a year and a private jet to Saban, so yeah. Texas would have a super team every year with how much money they have. Oregon has Nike money, which while nice, is not Texas money.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Incorrect, Texas would be the national champs every year. They wanna give $10 million a year and a private jet to Saban, so yeah. Texas would have a super team every year with how much money they have. Oregon has Nike money, which while nice, is not Texas money.

Nike also wouldn't dump all its money into Oregon, they're smarter than that. They'd spread it around to a number of programs, just as they do now. Oregon may see extra Phil Knight money, but that's different than Nike money.

[valo403]

No college football video game next year, EA just announced it. 13 year old me would be livid.

[ResAlien]

####

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Incorrect, Texas would be the national champs every year. They wanna give $10 million a year and a private jet to Saban, so yeah. Texas would have a super team every year with how much money they have. Oregon has Nike money, which while nice, is not Texas money.

Yeah but Texas doesn't have the world's largest athletic equipment company behind them (which in this case is extremely important since we're discussing college players becoming spokespersons for a brand). In all likelihood, it would be Oregon (Nike) vs Maryland (Under Armour) battling it out for the best recruits year after year (there may also be an Adidas school but they're german so I don't see them throwing themselves behind a school as easily as the other two).

Originally Posted by valo403

Nike also wouldn't dump all its money into Oregon, they're smarter than that. They'd spread it around to a number of programs, just as they do now. Oregon may see extra Phil Knight money, but that's different than Nike money.

Probably also true but you'd have to think Uncle Phil (Nike) and Kevin Plank (UA) would give their respective alma matters a leg up on the rest.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by wpgflamesfan

Yeah but Texas doesn't have the world's largest athletic equipment company behind them (which in this case is extremely important since we're discussing college players becoming spokespersons for a brand). In all likelihood, it would be Oregon (Nike) vs Maryland (Under Armour) battling it out for the best recruits year after year (there may also be an Adidas school but they're german so I don't see them throwing themselves behind a school as easily as the other two).



Probably also true but you'd have to think Uncle Phil (Nike) and Kevin Plank (UA) would give their respective alma matters a leg up on the rest.

No more than the Uncle's at any other school. Oregon and Maryland don't have the market cornered on wealthy alums (Maryland even being in this conversation is bizarre, if UA is so interested why are their facilities pathetic by big program standards?). Business decisions would see money spent at a number of schools, personal decisions wouldn't be any different than what we see now.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Sure, I think his point is a good one, but isn't in the NCAA who wants to keep the 2 year/ 1 year minimums in Football and Basketball so they keep their recruits.

Also, I'm (somewhat) okay with the universities not paying these athletes, but they should be allowed to get a job (and if it pays $25,000 a year to be a security guard at the local dealership, so be it) or sell their autographs. The NCAA prevents them from making ANY money, even if it's off their own likeness.

they get a stipend already, they get medical, and tutors for free. Most of the kids wouldn't be able to get admitted to 95% of the schools they play for if it wasn't for their ability to catch a ball.

They need to shut up and realize that they're kings on campus, they can do whatever they want, they have the ground that they walk on worshiped. But they're too stupid to realize that only 1.5% of the players in NCAA football actually make it to the NFL and instead of pissing their degree away that they could actually do more than most in their families have done.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by PIMking

they get a stipend already, they get medical, and tutors for free. Most of the kids wouldn't be able to get admitted to 95% of the schools they play for if it wasn't for their ability to catch a ball.

They need to shut up and realize that they're kings on campus, they can do whatever they want, they have the ground that they walk on worshiped. But they're too stupid to realize that only 1.5% of the players in NCAA football actually make it to the NFL and instead of pissing their degree away that they could actually do more than most in their families have done.

None of this addresses why they shouldn't be able to make money off of their own likeness.

Also, it's not like some dumb kid who gets accepted to Duke is all of the sudden going to be smart and get a 4.0 in advanced physics. They weren't good enough to get in in the first place they are looking at 2.0 in "athletics" at best.

I would also assume, as far as football players are concerned that it's basically a 30 hour a week (plus game day) commitment.