Kenya mall shooting

[CaptainCrunch]

I thought that I would throw this in here as it is a growing and nasty news story.

Current death toll is at 62 with dozens wounded including at least two Canadians

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/kenyan-s...ting-1.1466182

More disturbing is that some of the gunman have been described as white. One is possibly a male from Ontario

A nasty rumor floating around is that the female shooter is the wife of one of the UK subway bombers

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...d-8833096.html

There are probably going to be some pretty big reprisals against the Al Shabab.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/comme...ticle14460642/

[Ozy_Flame]

I have family visiting Nairobi right now. They're nowhere close to the mall, but I would prefer they just get the heck out of there. Nairobi / Kenya is not a safe place for non-Muslims to visit these days, especially with their encroachment on the conflict in Somalia. There is regularly trouble with religious extremism there lately.

[FlamesAddiction]

Some of the witnesses said that the shooters were asking people if they were muslim and if they said yes, they were freed. There was also a church attack in Pakistan this weekend that killed 81 people, mostly from Pakistan's Christian minority. I have to wonder if these attacks were coordinated.

The weird thing about Kenya is that Muslims are actually a small minority and are isolated in specific regions for the most part. Muslims only make up about 10% of the population (less than some "western" countries). They sure seem pretty militant there though.

[CaptainCrunch]

I don't know, maybe somebody with the background can correct me, but isn't killing hostages a major break in Muslim hospitality laws?

Something about if you shelter and feed someone no matter the religion you are responsible for their wellbeing?

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

The weird thing about Kenya is that Muslims are actually a small minority and are isolated in specific regions for the most part. Muslims only make up about 10% of the population (less than some "western" countries). They sure seem pretty militant there though.

I think there is a very high chance that this isn't the Muslim minority in Kenya; these are international jihadists organized by al-Shabaab. I doubt more than 1-2 of the militants are actually Kenyan. A good handful will be Somali I imagine.

“He said we only want to kill Kenyans and Americans,” she said. “He then told me I had to change my religion to Islam and said ‘do you forgive us? do you forgive us?’. Naturally I was going to say whatever they wanted and they let us go.

Definitely sounds like al-Shabaab retaliating against Western imperialism and Kenyan forces making strides in Somalia.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I don't know, maybe somebody with the background can correct me, but isn't killing hostages a major break in Muslim hospitality laws?

Something about if you shelter and feed someone no matter the religion you are responsible for their wellbeing?

These terrorists pick and choose pieces to use for their cause. They're like cafeteria Catholics, except for instead of using birth control and eating meat on Fridays ... they gun down people at The Gap.

Minor differences.

[_Q_]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I don't know, maybe somebody with the background can correct me, but isn't killing hostages a major break in Muslim hospitality laws?

Something about if you shelter and feed someone no matter the religion you are responsible for their wellbeing?

These pieces of #### aren't Muslims though. I would call them Godless scumbags, but that would be an insult to the good atheists out there.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I think there is a very high chance that this isn't the Muslim minority in Kenya; these are international jihadists organized by al-Shabaab. I doubt more than 1-2 of the militants are actually Kenyan. A good handful will be Somali I imagine.

“He said we only want to kill Kenyans and Americans,” she said. “He then told me I had to change my religion to Islam and said ‘do you forgive us? do you forgive us?’. Naturally I was going to say whatever they wanted and they let us go.

Definitely sounds like al-Shabaab retaliating against Western imperialism and Kenyan forces making strides in Somalia.

From the fractured news reports, there are some whites including a suspected white female.

I would be interested in knowing the identity of the Canadian. We seem to be exporting our share of terrorists lately.

[JobHopper]

Terrible news and such senseless violence. Same with the church bombing in Pakistan. You have to wonder about when and how close we're actually from this happening at home here in Canada and Calgary.

Also, I have to wonder if Obama's (and I like the guy) foreign police isn't on the soft side. Putin seemingly talked the US out of striking Syria, now the Iranians who are also backing Syria, are claiming to want more friendly relations with the US. Hopefully they're not buying this BS.

You have to feel for the victims here though, and as far away as it seems, it's a lot closer to home. Canadian casualties as well as talk of some the terrorists being Canadian and American.

It's part of the reason I quit taking the c-train to and from work on a regular basis. Crowded trains that make a lot of stops and you can't get out and no security. Scary.

[chemgear]

Originally Posted by JobHopper

It's part of the reason I quit taking the c-train to and from work on a regular basis. Crowded trains that make a lot of stops and you can't get out and no security. Scary.

I think that might be a little much, but I could certainly be very wrong.

Frankly, I avoid the C-Train simply because it sucks.

[NuclearPizzaMan]

Originally Posted by JobHopper

Also, I have to wonder if Obama's (and I like the guy) foreign police isn't on the soft side. Putin seemingly talked the US out of striking Syria, now the Iranians who are also backing Syria, are claiming to want more friendly relations with the US. Hopefully they're not buying this BS.

This really has nothing to do with what is happening in Kenya.

Originally Posted by JobHopper

It's part of the reason I quit taking the c-train to and from work on a regular basis. Crowded trains that make a lot of stops and you can't get out and no security. Scary.

You stopped taking the C-Train because you are afraid of terrorism? Seriously?

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by JobHopper

You have to feel for the victims here though, and as far away as it seems, it's a lot closer to home. Canadian casualties as well as talk of some the terrorists being Canadian and American.

It's part of the reason I quit taking the c-train to and from work on a regular basis. Crowded trains that make a lot of stops and you can't get out and no security. Scary.

Canada has a growing problem of home-grown extremism. Libya and Algeria are reminders of that. And the fact that we have seen many different creeds and colors of Canadian extremists fighting abroad means the problem isn't isolated to pockets of Canadian communities. I would venture to argue those who are from middle-class families and live an unassuming life are the most slippery and difficult to detect.

Not sure avoiding the train because of a potential terrorist attack is the best course of action though. While common sense should prevail, you can't live your life in constant fear. You should be more worried about lightning hitting you - chances are greater of that happening.

[ah123]

This attack hit close to home for my wife. Her cousin-in-law and daughter were in the mall at the time of the attack. They were saved by a quick thinking bank employee who locked everyone in the bank vault; they spent 6 hours in the vault before being rescued.
The Canadian business man that died is the cousin of a friend of hers and she found that there were some other friends of the family that barely made it out.

[JobHopper]

I really believe we have extremists right here in Calgary. I hope I'm wrong. I still take the train but I do think about it quite a bit. We shouldn't live in fear but on the other hand we also shouldn't be naive and action should be taken and security looked at and updated as needed.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by JobHopper

I really believe we have extremists right here in Calgary. I hope I'm wrong. I still take the train but I do think about it quite a bit. We shouldn't live in fear but on the other hand we also shouldn't be naive and action should be taken and security looked at and updated as needed.

Your suspicions are likely true, although I suspect it's mostly growing/harboring extremist elements in transit, or more likely, terrorism financing.

Regarding extremists in transit, these are likely homegrown Canadians that haven't been flagged by the Five Eyes, so as to avoid detection crossing borders. Leaving the country is far easier than coming into it.

As for terrorism financing, I believe there was an issue a couple of years ago of a Calgary group funding the Tamil Tigers, but not totally sure. But that which we don't see in the media/public is larger than we may think.

[PIMking]

bunch of idiots, just senseless killing is just flat freaking stupid

[undercoverbrother]

Fella I know if SA posted this on Facebook, I hope it is not true:

[CaptainCrunch]

This was the intent of Al Quada after 9/11. To drive the American's to distraction with a lot of devastating but small attacks. Make the world feel unsafe everywhere. But the secret of Al Quada, was that the leadership were afraid to die, the concept of martyrs was cool for the schlubs, but not for the senior guys, and America knocked them off balance and kept them moving in survival mode.

While I have my doubts that this is probably a smoke screen to disseminate fear, we could be seeing a whole new dimension to global terrorism unfolding right now.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by JobHopper

I really believe we have extremists right here in Calgary. I hope I'm wrong. I still take the train but I do think about it quite a bit. We shouldn't live in fear but on the other hand we also shouldn't be naive and action should be taken and security looked at and updated as needed.

such as?

[missdpuck]

Lock n load Duff, lock n load.