[News] Brian Burke joining Calgary Flames as President of Hockey Operations

[Leafs67]

Congrats to my second favourite NHL franchise; you have just landed a champion. Before Burke's arrival in Toronto, the organization had nothing in terms of a capable front office, no prospect depth, and no marquis talent anywhere in the organization, save for Luke Schenn. The team that took the Bruins to game 7 was the team that Burke built. That organization now has a healthier prospect pool which promotes internal competition across the board. Don't underestimate the importance of that element of your rebuild. Top tier talent no longer inherits NHL exposure by default; they claw their way out of the AHL by proving their mettle. Secondly, he stabilized the boardroom by hiring knowledgeable hockey executives whose opinions all carry weight. No dead weight, no old cronies interfering with hockey operations. Third, he made sure the development program reflected the systems and philosophies employed by the NHL team. Expect to see something very similar happen in CGY. Your AHL and junior players will br groomed from the ground up to play Flames style hockey, which will be based on pride of ownership, accountability, and a hostile brand of puck that will make the battle of Alberta absolutely epic. Here's something to consider: While Feaster's dismissal is not imminent, Burke will certainly be charged with both the task of evaluating and overseeing his ability to follow a critical path to success of his particular design, as well as the ultimate responsibility of alleviating the franchise of Feaster's presence should he fail to execute according to that plan. Your house will be in order much sooner than the Toronto project took, because you have assets that are moveable, prospects in the system, picks in the hopper, and some pretty solid building blocks to jump off with. Good luck, and while I'm primarily a Leaf fan, I'm also a fan of the game. I'll be watching this team closely and with great interest.

[puckluck2]

Best news all summer.

[Leafs67]

Originally Posted by Gord Wappel

Yeah. I hope you are right.
I hope he understands (was made to understand) that most fans are really ok with sucking for a year or two in order to be relevant in future.
In Toronto there was a lot of pressure for the impossible.

What I will find very interesting is how it can possibly work with the media. He is is naturally a media magnet - he's good at keeping spotlight on himself. And he seemed to love it. How will this work while leaving Feaster empowered. I heard him on Toronto Radio yesterday as he deftly said "I won't be talking to anyone about that trade - Feaster will make all the calls". But how long can he resist his nature....

Just to add a Toronto perspective, those once critical of the Kessel trade have been all but silenced as of this last season. Kessel has been an absolute pillar of offensive excellence in Toronto and has gone from strength to strength while adding to his arsenal by becoming an engaged back checker (his speed and active stick are seen diffusing pressure at an increasing rate) as well as an astonishingly gifted setup man with surgical precision feeds through traffic. Seguin, despite being insulated on a deep Bruins team, has struggled with maturity both on and off the ice. Had he taken his antics to Toronto, he'd have been an absolute bust, as that market would have picked their teeth with him. Toronto's situation differs in that there was no depth anywhere when Burke arrived, therefore top prospects would have been rushed into active duty prematurely and subsequently damaged for life. Burke anticipated as much and opted for young elite talent with NHL experience. He also correctly judged Kessel's character, anticipating that his somewhat aloof demeanour would make him nigh impervious to media distraction. In hindsight, it was a stroke of genius. The onus is now on their current management to secure that asset going forward. In Calgary, Burke and Co. will have the luxury of a far more reasonable fan base and local media presence, as well as an ownership group that will allow him to see the project through to completion.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Irrelevant. When they call him Cindy, they are hardly expressing their support. These nicknames are not given out of affection or respect.

It certainly seems to be the case that most posters on CP are supportive of Burke's hiring — now. That does not mean that they thought well of him when he was running the Canucks or the Ducks, and the 'McBlowhard' gags were flying.

Anyway, Burke is no Sidney Crosby. Crosby is a bona fide superstar, a generational talent. It would be a very odd hockey fan who thought Burke was a superstar GM, or the best hockey executive of his generation.

Some of what we're seeing today, I suspect, is coming from people who are inwardly thinking, 'Oh, hell, he's on our side now, I guess I'd better learn to cheer for him' — and outwardly saying the right things to lull their cognitive dissonance to sleep.

I am behind this hire completely because what he did or said 9 years ago in Vancouver has little to no bearing on the hockey mind he is now. In fact, those kind of incidents make people better in the long run if they learn from them.

It is never a bad thing to add talent to an orginization, and like him or hate him, Burke is definately a great hockey guy.

This situation is like when a team plays a rival a lot who has that "pest" who gets under not just the players skin, but also the opposing fans. Then the guy comes available and your team signs him...all is forgotten quickly because now you get to enjoy the benefits of his game on your club. Nothing wrong with that.

Although his role and what he will do day to day as far as the team goes is a bit muddled, there is no doubt that Burke will be part of making the Flames a much better hockey team. We have seen it before and will see it again, good hockey people are good hockey people and success follows them regardless of previous transgressions.

[kyuss275]

Not sure why the thread " Brian Burkes role for president" was closed? This thread seems more of a yay-nay thread. The other thread made by "fan" actually looked into another organization that is doing the same thing the flames are going to try. Anyways i took a post out from there and will respond to it on this thread. This is "TurnedTheCorner" post:

"You should watch the videos of the press conference, they answer most of your questions.

"Will Burke replace Feaster and hire a new GM or replace Feaster himself?" - No

"Burke has stated that Feaster is still the GM and still the guy in charge, but did mention that he will be guiding Feaster and that Feaster will be the transactional guy. What does this all mean?" - Feaster is still the GM in charge of player moves and contracts. Burke oversees him directly, just as King did before.

"My guess is that the status quo will remain for a while. While I do think Feaster can't be at all happy with this, it's likely in his best interest to keep his GM title and help lead a successful rebuild here in Calgary." - Feaster and the hockey operations people who report to him are quite happy with this.

"Not sure how this will affect Weisbrod who came here looking to take upon a larger role." - This has no effect on Weisbrod's role."


First off i don't think you can take the presser at 100% face value. I watched Burke in other interviews during the day and he contradicted the presser a couple of times. If we go by the presser then KK still looks after the business side and Feaster is GM. What would that really leave Burke to do? No chance he is just going to sit in a room and wait for Feaster to come along with an idea, for him to say yes or no.

Burke mentioned things that GM's do like scouting and said that it was Feasters job. On another station he said that if he felt like he wanted to go and scout, he was going to go out and scout.

Burke mentioned at the presser that Feaster would be the man making the trades and doing the work and he would be there only for guidance. On another staion he said that if he has ideas for a trade or transaction that he would go and tell Feaster what he is thinking.

This could also have an effect on Weisbrod. Burke during the presser said there is a sscience to drafting and that he was going to evaluate the process to make sure its done the way he thinks it should be done. This is the only thing that he has said that scares me. I like Weisbrod's approach to drafting, so they better seee eye to eye.

I truly believe that Burke and Feaster want this to work and that Burke did not take this job thinking he will fire Feaster the second he can. The main problem is that while Feaster and Burke are friends they have never worked together. If they see eye to eye on a lot of things then this could work. If they don't and just spend the year arguing with each other, then someone will have to go. I don't see Feaster winning that battle. Durring the year they will probably have a difference of opnion on players ( Feaster on tv said they talked about one player that Feaster likes and Burke hates), the biggest battle will be Hartely. You know Feaster will go to the wall for Hartely. Not convinced that Burke is going to like what he see's in him if its the same system as last year.

[kremb]

Should be an easier job than he had in Toronto. Yes he's helping rebuild a team, but at least he doesn't have Matt Stajan as his first line centre this time.


via

http://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/comme...oined_calgary/

[Yakbutter]

Originally Posted by kremb

Should be an easier job than he had in Toronto. Yes he's helping rebuild a team, but at least he doesn't have Matt Stajan as his first line centre this time.


via

http://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/comme...oined_calgary/

uh, you may want to go look at this teams center depth. Matt Stajan is the most capable NHL center on the roster...lol

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Yakbutter

uh, you may want to go look at this teams center depth. Matt Stajan is the most capable NHL center on the roster...lol

Stajan certainly has the most NHL experience on the roster but I am not sold on him being the most capable anymore. If Backlund continues his progress (and stays healthy) then I would put him above Stajan on the depth chart. Knight and Monahan are rookies and Monahan may not even make the team *this year* but either/both of them could displace Stajan.

Also, Stajan is a pending UFA this time whereas the last time around he had another year on his contract that needed to be offloaded. It will be much easier to trade Stajan as a rental, especially if a team in the playoff hunt gets bit by the injury bug and is looking for a 2/3 center.

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I've always been pro-Burke although despite his association with the Canucks and Leafs. He's not the greatest GM of all time by any means as he's made his share of mistakes but he usually always comes out on top in trades and his last one of JVR for a 4/5 defenseman in Luke Schenn was the difference maker for the Leafs last season.

Burke is actually a pretty decent trade architect in my opinion (although i still think the kessel deal was a bad move for the franchise).

looking back at some doozies he put together while with the leafs:

Matthew Lombardi, Cody Franson, 2013 conditional fourth-round pick (if Lombardi plays less than 60 regular-season games over course of 2011-12 and 2012-13 seasons) for Brett Lebda, Robert Slaney, 2013 conditional fourth-round pick -> SOLID trade

Anahiem trades J.S. Giguere to Toronto for Vesa Toskala and Jason Blake. -> decent trade when you consider they got a decent goalie for 2 guys they were itching to get out of town.

Bruins trade Joe Colborne, 2011 first-round pick (No. 30 Rickard Rakell), 2012 conditional second-round pick (No. 54 Mike Winther) to Toronto for Tomas Kaberle -> Solid solid trade. potentially (conditional picks) getting three assets for a guy they absolutely needed to get rid of.

Flames trade Dion Phaneuf, Keith Aulie and Fredrik Sjostrom to the Maple Leafs for Niklas Hagman, Jamal Mayers, Matt Stajan and Ian White. -> LOL.....

Anaheim trades Joffrey Lupul, Jake Gardiner and a 2013 conditional fourth-round pick to Toronto for Francois Beauchemin. -> what a ridiculously lopsided trade. lupul goes on to be a top line scorer, gardiner a solid d prospect with huge upside for an overpaid beauchemin (in my opinion).

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

Bruins trade Joe Colborne, 2011 first-round pick (No. 30 Rickard Rakell), 2012 conditional second-round pick (No. 54 Mike Winther) to Toronto for Tomas Kaberle -> Solid solid trade. potentially (conditional picks) getting three assets for a guy they absolutely needed to get rid of.

I keep forgetting about that trade. As "bad" as the Kessel trade was for moving out two solid first rounders for a top line scorer, the Kaberle trade was an absolute fleecing. Kaberle did sweet F all to help the Bruins win the cup. The entire time I was cheering the Bruins on for that run I kept noticing how completely useless Kaberle was.

At least when Burke lost his trade to the Bruins he still came out with a 40 goal scorer that continues to contribute to the team.

I also still hate to think about the Phaneuf deal. The Flames should have been able to land a much bigger fish (an actual first line center) and somehow that trade turned into the Flames getting bent over a barrel and getting a collection of useless parts.

If Burke puts together just one trade where the Flames come out as such clear winners he will be worth having in the organization. If he can help build a number of those trades throughout the rebuild then I can see the Flames being back in the playoff picture as legit contenders.

[SuperMatt18]

Yeah he is good at trades generally speaking.

I would add JVR for Schenn to your list, as well as moving Versteeg for a 1st and a 3rd.

Toronto: http://www.nhltradetracker.com/user/...Brian_Burke/77

Anaheim: http://www.nhltradetracker.com/user/...rian_Burke/201

Vancouver: http://www.nhltradetracker.com/user/...rian_Burke/189

[Tinordi]

In retrospect it's a very tough argument that the Kessel deal was a bad trade for Toronto. He's clearly the best player in the deal and really fit a need for the franchise.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

Burke is actually a pretty decent trade architect in my opinion (although i still think the kessel deal was a bad move for the franchise).

looking back at some doozies he put together while with the leafs:

Matthew Lombardi, Cody Franson, 2013 conditional fourth-round pick (if Lombardi plays less than 60 regular-season games over course of 2011-12 and 2012-13 seasons) for Brett Lebda, Robert Slaney, 2013 conditional fourth-round pick -> SOLID trade

Anahiem trades J.S. Giguere to Toronto for Vesa Toskala and Jason Blake. -> decent trade when you consider they got a decent goalie for 2 guys they were itching to get out of town.

Bruins trade Joe Colborne, 2011 first-round pick (No. 30 Rickard Rakell), 2012 conditional second-round pick (No. 54 Mike Winther) to Toronto for Tomas Kaberle -> Solid solid trade. potentially (conditional picks) getting three assets for a guy they absolutely needed to get rid of.

Flames trade Dion Phaneuf, Keith Aulie and Fredrik Sjostrom to the Maple Leafs for Niklas Hagman, Jamal Mayers, Matt Stajan and Ian White. -> LOL.....

Anaheim trades Joffrey Lupul, Jake Gardiner and a 2013 conditional fourth-round pick to Toronto for Francois Beauchemin. -> what a ridiculously lopsided trade. lupul goes on to be a top line scorer, gardiner a solid d prospect with huge upside for an overpaid beauchemin (in my opinion).

Can't disagree with any of those trades. The Boston trade with Kaberle was the reason i wanted Burke in place before the deadline. I don't think it would have mattered on the Iggy trade, but i have no doubt in my mind that Burke gets more out of the Blues for JBO.

[jaymac106]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

In retrospect it's a very tough argument that the Kessel deal was a bad trade for Toronto. He's clearly the best player in the deal and really fit a need for the franchise.

I agree, however the real answer will come a few years down the road as we watch how Seguin and Hamilton progress. Although with Seguin already shipped out, I guess we need to watch what Louie Erickson does in Boston.

[Azure]

Burke has already said he made the Kessel trade because he was given 3 years to win, and developing the draft pick he had wouldn't have helped with that.

[rockstar]

Originally Posted by Leafs67

Congrats to my second favourite NHL franchise; you have just landed a champion. Before Burke's arrival in Toronto, the organization had nothing in terms of a capable front office, no prospect depth, and no marquis talent anywhere in the organization, save for Luke Schenn. The team that took the Bruins to game 7 was the team that Burke built. That organization now has a healthier prospect pool which promotes internal competition across the board. Don't underestimate the importance of that element of your rebuild. Top tier talent no longer inherits NHL exposure by default; they claw their way out of the AHL by proving their mettle. Secondly, he stabilized the boardroom by hiring knowledgeable hockey executives whose opinions all carry weight. No dead weight, no old cronies interfering with hockey operations. Third, he made sure the development program reflected the systems and philosophies employed by the NHL team. Expect to see something very similar happen in CGY. Your AHL and junior players will br groomed from the ground up to play Flames style hockey, which will be based on pride of ownership, accountability, and a hostile brand of puck that will make the battle of Alberta absolutely epic. Here's something to consider: While Feaster's dismissal is not imminent, Burke will certainly be charged with both the task of evaluating and overseeing his ability to follow a critical path to success of his particular design, as well as the ultimate responsibility of alleviating the franchise of Feaster's presence should he fail to execute according to that plan. Your house will be in order much sooner than the Toronto project took, because you have assets that are moveable, prospects in the system, picks in the hopper, and some pretty solid building blocks to jump off with. Good luck, and while I'm primarily a Leaf fan, I'm also a fan of the game. I'll be watching this team closely and with great interest.

Man, it must be said, you write beautifully.

[Tinordi]

Yeah reviewing the state's of the two organizations before Burke came in, the Flames look much better than the Leafs.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by jaymac106

I agree, however the real answer will come a few years down the road as we watch how Seguin and Hamilton progress. Although with Seguin already shipped out, I guess we need to watch what Louie Erickson does in Boston.

I don't think Louie factors in to the Toronto/Boston trade at all. That is going a little too deep into it, because you're then basing the original trade on asset management and the ability of the GM of the Dallas Stars.

Even judging it as "Kessel vs. Seguin/Hamilton" is a little silly if you think about it. You're judging a trade that was a known commodity for two unknowns based on what those unknowns turned out to be. The problem with that is had Toronto kept those picks, there's no guarantee that Toronto would have chosen those two guys. What if they had drafted.... I don't know, Gudbranson and Seimens instead? I'd rather have Kessel. As far as the debate of Seguin/Kessel goes, I'd much rather have Seguin as a building block, he's better now than Kessel was at the same point in his career.

I think what we have to consider is the trade as it was, not as how it turned out to be. The Leafs were less than 4 points away both years from those picks being significantly worse. From that standpoint, the Kessel trade AS IT WAS: good. As it is now? Meh, I like Seguin, but you can make a case for it. Had the Leafs had even one extra win in either year, the picks would likely look entirely different.

I guess my long winded point is that trades where players are involved are fair game for "win/loss" because before the trade happens you're judging ability and potential. Trades for picks aren't really, because it takes SO many intangibles to make those picks good. You have to ask yourself: "Can I guarantee a 30+ goal producer in the first round of the next two drafts." You can't, so you make the trade.

[Leafs67]

Originally Posted by rockstar

Man, it must be said, you write beautifully.

Too kind, grateful for the compliment. When the subject matter is as interesting as our great game, the words tend to flow...

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

In retrospect it's a very tough argument that the Kessel deal was a bad trade for Toronto. He's clearly the best player in the deal and really fit a need for the franchise.

Exactly. It isn't like Burke traded picks for an aging star. He added a young front line player who has performed well. Kessel is an odd duck to be sure, and not a guy that should be your franchise player. But his stats speak for themselves.

At best the trade is shaping up to be a marginal win for the Bruins, but I would not rank it among even the top 10 bad deals from the last few years. It isn't nearly as bad as some people make it out to be.