Senators have lost $94 million dollars under Melnyk

[WilderPegasus]

Originally Posted by SebC

I wonder how much it costs them every year that their arena's location is the Ottawa-equivalent of "North of Airdrie".

More like Crossiron Mills if you believe Google Maps to be accurate.

[WilderPegasus]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The Capital area is a crappy sports market. How many times do you have to blame crappy teams or crappy owners? They've lost their football team twice and almost lost the Sens before Melnyk stepped up. When the federal government is your largest employer and you have a limited corporate base, that does not bode well for revenues. Should have never been awarded an expansion franchise, only got it because Tampa and Ottawa were the only ones to pony up the full expansion fee.

Saying it before and saying it again doesn't mean it is true.

Ottawa never almost lost the Sens. The guy before Melnyk was in the same situation as the Devils last owner - he went into too much debt while building a new rink. And in both cases the team was sold pretty quickly after it became available unlike Phoenix which did have a chance of losing its franchise. Calgary was closer to losing its franchise in the 90's than Ottawa when the Flames were having problems getting fans.

The statements by Melnyk need to be taken with about a million grains of salt. He's trying to get the government to give him a casino. He doesn't make any claims about how much the rink is making or his ticket buying service that has replaced Ticketmaster (and it's service charges) in Ottawa.

[Badgers Nose]

Melnyk gets a lot of flack, but that is an example of putting your money where your mouth is regarding supporting the community.

I can see why he would be mad at Dani nickel and diming him.

Dani says he took less to stay in Ottawa previous contract. Eugene pays up to $10 million a year out of pocket to keep the team there. I know who wins that pissing match.

[speede5]

Ottawa has great public transport on game days. We paid $3 for a return trip from downtown, bus has it's own highway, you can't beat that. Location is not killing this team.

[LIP MAN]

Originally Posted by speede5

Ottawa has great public transport on game days. We paid $3 for a return trip from downtown, bus has it's own highway, you can't beat that. Location is not killing this team.

Not necessarily that, but having a slew of bars and surrounding neighborhoods helps pull people in.

[N-E-B]

The Senators are the only team in Canada I would put in the "who cares" category. Hate to say it, but Ottawa just isn't a good sports town.

[Buck Murdock]

Ottawa and sports just don't mix.

[valo403]

You certainly need to take this with a grain of salt. The sens may be losing money, or other entities may be losing money, but there could very well be another entity raking it in. Still, Ottawa likely isn't the easiest market out there, and the location is brutal (that bus sucks).

I do find it hilarious that this thread isn't filled with people calls g for the team to be moved. Why is that? Canadian based teams get an extra benefit of the doubt? The recent NJ thread certainly didn't get the same response.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by WilderPegasus

More like Crossiron Mills if you believe Google Maps to be accurate.

Crossiron Mills is between Calgary and Airdrie. Scotia Centre or whatever it's called now is past Kanata.

[WilderPegasus]

Originally Posted by SebC

Crossiron Mills is between Calgary and Airdrie. Scotia Centre or whatever it's called now is past Kanata.

Are you trying to make a point and failing or are you just babbling for no reason?

[SebC]

Originally Posted by WilderPegasus

Are you trying to make a point and failing or are you just babbling for no reason?

You criticized my analogy, so I'm defending it.

[c.t.ner]

Although, I have beef about Ottawa as a vibrant city to live in, but after living here for the past year anyone who says that the Senators aren't supported by the locals is clearly someone who hasn't spent anytime in the city. The Senators are the heart and soul of this city, sure it's not a well known cultural and sports mecca like other Canadian cities, but nobody can say that there isn't support for the Sens in the city. (and yes I know that there a lot of ex-pat Toronto and most of Gatineau cheers for the Habs)

The problem with most sports franchises nowadays is that you simply can't make a profit of owning a Team alone. You have to diversify the portfolio and expand it's reach outside of simply the team and arena. As much as people rag on Ken King, if there's one thing the guy has done a phenomenal job on it's the business side of things and expanding the Flames income base (Flames Central, Hitman, Stampeders, etc). The article hints at it, but the Senators need to work other revenues outside of just the Senators and the Crappy Tire Centre. Sure they own CapitalTickets and sound like they've sweetened their income from the renaming of Scotiabank place, but things like a downtown Casino and some other properties would help the larger Senators organization on the income side.

[moon]

Originally Posted by valo403

I do find it hilarious that this thread isn't filled with people calls g for the team to be moved. Why is that? Canadian based teams get an extra benefit of the doubt? The recent NJ thread certainly didn't get the same response.

Yes Canadian teams certainly should get the benefit of the doubt especially with a strong dollar. And probably not a lot of calls for the team to be moved as the owner hasn't indicated any intentions of wanting to move or not own the team (the opposite actually) and even if the losses are true, which most people think they aren't, they aren't close to the situations of NJ or Phoenix where the owners could't pay the bills.

There also have been a lot of critical posts in this thread about Ottawa as a sports city and the arena situation similar to posts in the NJ and Phoenix threads.

[Plett25]

Originally Posted by valo403

You certainly need to take this with a grain of salt. The sens may be losing money, or other entities may be losing money, but there could very well be another entity raking it in. Still, Ottawa likely isn't the easiest market out there, and the location is brutal (that bus sucks).

I do find it hilarious that this thread isn't filled with people calls g for the team to be moved. Why is that? Canadian based teams get an extra benefit of the doubt? The recent NJ thread certainly didn't get the same response.

I find it hilarious that in the 1st paragraph you answered the question you posed in the 2nd paragraph. Nobody's calling for the Sens to be moved because nobody believes Melnyk.

Besides not really believing Melnyk, he bought the team for $92 million and Forbes values the Sens at $220 million. Even if he has put $94 million into the Sens in addition to his original $92 million purchase price, he's still $30 to $40 million to the good.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Plett25

I find it hilarious that in the 1st paragraph you answered the question you posed in the 2nd paragraph. Nobody's calling for the Sens to be moved because nobody believes Melnyk.

Besides not really believing Melnyk, he bought the team for $92 million and Forbes values the Sens at $220 million. Even if he has put $94 million into the Sens in addition to his original $92 million purchase price, he's still $30 to $40 million to the good.

Thanks for not following along. Check the recent Devils thread. Very little interest in critical thinking or questioning from some people, and a quick call for moving the team or calling out the market. So to sum it up, Ottawa = look beyond the story, non-Canadian market = take it at face value and question the viability of the market.

[HOWITZER]

Living on the west side of Kanata was the sweetest thing. Could literally walk to the games and pay 10.00 for a cheap ticket in the 300s (wayyyyyy better sight lines than the dome's 300s). But man that rink was in the middle of nowhere. It would be practically impossible to convince people from Orleans or Gatineau to make the trip on a regular basis seeing as it's some 70+ kms each way to Orleans.

That location is killing the Sens. But make no mistake, the Sens are absolutely loved in Ottawa. You have to remember that before the Sens, Ottawa was either Leafs fans or Habs fans. When you drop a new team in it doesn't just flip a switch in everyone's brain and they start cheering for Ottawa. They've literally had to develop their fan base from young kids up to today. Now that its been 20+ seasons since Ottawa came to be, I think you'll find that there's a lot more interest in the Sens as younger people start to spend some disposable income on going to see games.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by HOWITZER

When you drop a new team in it doesn't just flip a switch in everyone's brain and they start cheering for Ottawa. They've literally had to develop their fan base from young kids up to today. Now that its been 20+ seasons since Ottawa came to be, I think you'll find that there's a lot more interest in the Sens as younger people start to spend some disposable income on going to see games.

So . . . it took 20+ years for the Flames to develop a fan base in Calgary?

[trublmaker]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So . . . it took 20+ years for the Flames to develop a fan base in Calgary?

more like nano-seconds

[c.t.ner]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So . . . it took 20+ years for the Flames to develop a fan base in Calgary?

I'd say it took 10-15 years for all the kids who were born in the late 70s + 80s to grow up to become young adults and spend their extra income on Flames stuff. Which is essentially what you're seeing now with the sens.

I work with a slew of 20-30 year olds from the Ottawa area and they're ravenous Sens fans. Let's not forget that the Sens were a feable franchise for the first 5 years of existence (anyone else remember Peter Sidorkiewicz in the all star game?), unlike the Flames who already had some key cogs in place prior to moving to Calgary. And geographically, the Senators are in a way worse spot than Calgary ever was. Sure there are still some life long Leafs and Habs fans in Alberta, but it's not like anyone can take a 2-3 hour train ride to Toronto or Montreal from Calgary to watch their beloved team.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by SebC

You criticized my analogy, so I'm defending it.

To be fair, your analogy is wrong. The distance between downtown Ottawa and the Canadian Tire Centre is almost the exact same as the distance between downtown Calgary and CrossIron, making it comparable to "South of Airdrie", not north as you suggested.