Bet on last place for the Flames?

[Brannigans Law]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

I'm not a bettor, but if I were, I'd even consider betting on the oilers finishing worse than the Flames. I think the Flames and oilers both finish in a similar spot to last year, which was pretty close together.

I really doubt the Flames finish 30th, I'd take that bet at even odds.

Id put money on that bet that the Oilers finish higher than we do. Hell I'd even give you odds.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Brannigans Law

Id put money on that bet that the Oilers finish higher than we do. Hell I'd even give you odds.

Yes, I think it's more likely that the oilers finish higher than the Flames. But I don't see the oilers being much better than last year, and I don't see the Flames being much worse.

Betting on the Flames finishing ahead of the Oilers is a better bet than the Flames finishing dead last, IMO.

[Old Yeller]

I think our center depth is an improvement over last year.

I think our goaltending is more than likely going to be a wash if we're just comparing to last years Kipper.

But when I look at our porous defence from last year and then look at the lineup this year, I'm hardly thinking Shane O'Brien and Kris Russell are going to be the saviours (no slight on Feaster as I like the moves/asset management).

I'm just hoping Brodie continues to progress, Giordano has a better year, and Smith returns to form from 2 years ago.... hell I'll also take Cundari continuing his .75 ppg pace all next year.

Then maybe we won't be in the bottom 5 for team defence stats... yes we will.

[Stormchaser]

Originally Posted by Old Yeller

I think our center depth is an improvement over last year.

I think our goaltending is more than likely going to be a wash if we're just comparing to last years Kipper.

But when I look at our porous defence from last year and then look at the lineup this year, I'm hardly thinking Shane O'Brien and Kris Russell are going to be the saviours (no slight on Feaster as I like the moves/asset management).

I'm just hoping Brodie continues to progress, Giordano has a better year, and Smith returns to form from 2 years ago.... hell I'll also take Cundari continuing his .75 ppg pace all next year.

Then maybe we won't be in the bottom 5 for team defence stats... yes we will.

I think you summarized the best case scenario in your post. Its unlikely for the Flames to meet all of those which is why they still trend downwards imo.

[4oh3]

The oilers have been dead last for 4 out of 5 years. Look where they are now I hate to say it but the oil got a decent team and a couple years down the road we'll be better!

[etdpratt]

Originally Posted by Kiran403

I know the Flames are in rebuild mode and probably won't make the playoffs let alone win the Cup. But are they really bad enough or inexperienced enough to finish 30th? The reason I ask is that a co-worker (oilers fan) is asking to bet me $100 that the Flames finish dead last in the NHL. I think that they are realistically in the 20-28 range as opposed to dead last. Would you take the bet?

How soon they forget that no NHL team in history has drafted 1st for three consecutive years. They took what Pittsburgh and Chicago did to a whole new level and they still can't make the playoffs.

[Trailer Fire]

Originally Posted by etdpratt

How soon they forget that no NHL team in history has drafted 1st for three consecutive years. They took what Pittsburgh and Chicago did to a whole new level and they still can't make the playoffs.

How soon you forget about the Nordiques. That was big time asset management that allowed them to, as the Avalanche, win a cup a few years down the road.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Trailer Fire

How soon you forget about the Nordiques. That was big time asset management that allowed them to, as the Avalanche, win a cup a few years down the road.

The 'big-time asset management' was trading away Eric Lindros for about three times what he was actually worth — and they only did that because he forced them by refusing to play in Quebec.

[Trailer Fire]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

The 'big-time asset management' was trading away Eric Lindros for about three times what he was actually worth — and they only did that because he forced them by refusing to play in Quebec.

Mats Sundin turned into Sylvain Lefebre, Claude Lemieux and a few other pieces. Owen Nolan became Sandis Ozolinsh. How easily we forget about the role players.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by moon

And not much reason to think the goalies this year are going to be much better than Kipper was last season without the skill to pull off the big games he had.

Kipper did have a few vintage games last year but really any NHL goalie should steal a few. Overall he was mediocre at best. Average goaltending would be an improvement.

I'm with you though, no guarantee we get even average. If Berra and Ramo turn out to be Karlson and Irving then they're screwed

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by nik-

Devils, Nashville and us. I think those are the three worst teams, but the other two have better goaltending by far. I'm sure some mystery team will outsuck us, but we'll be bottom 3.

Schneider and Rinne are good enough to keep them out of last place. I still think some team will be worse than the Flames though

[Gary83]

Kind of a win win if you can afford to lose $100.

You either win $100.

or

You lose $100 but the Flames are picking first or second overall.

[Lanny_McDonald]

I can't see another roster as weak as ours right now. We have too many guys that are a couple years away from being front line players and that will contribute to wins right now. Bartschi, Brodie, Knight, Monahan and Reinhart will all be pretty good in two years. Add in possibilities of Sieloff, Ramage and Wotherspoon on the backend, and then Gaudreau, Agostini, Jankowski, Granlund, Gillies, Poirier and Klimchuk in another couple of years and the future is looking pretty good. The next two seasons will be abysmal and we should be bottom of the league and the favorite to finish dead last, but there are always surprises here and there. I would take the bet. Odds are the Flames will find a way to finish 28th or 29th, as someone tanks better, and make you $100.

[Kiran403]

Originally Posted by Gary83

Kind of a win win if you can afford to lose $100.

You either win $100.

or

You lose $100 but the Flames are picking first or second overall.

haha ya that is true. The best scenario for me would be the Flames finishing 29th and then winning the first pick in the draft lottery.

[Erick Estrada]

Finishing 30th isn't as easy as you might think. The team will have to be spectacularly bad. As bad as the Flames were last year there were teams like the Avalanche and Panthers that were getting rolled by everyone almost nightly and look how bad those 30th place Oiler teams were.

The Flames have potential to be that bad but they are in a pack of a small handful of teams that also have that potential.

[BACKCHECK!!!]

I'm a huge Kipper fan, think he definitely has what it takes for another big comeback season, etc.

But Kipper was straight-up brutal last year. Joey Macdonald's numbers were better across the board, and MacDonald isn't even particularly good for a backup. But Kipper was STILL the weaker link in net, and was dragging down the goaltending as a whole.

So even if Ramo and Berra tank completely, and MacDonald gets pretty much all the starts, that's still and upgrade in net over last year.

Moon is also 100% right that the late-season "run" by the new kids had absolutely no substance (except the win over Edmonton, that was a thing of beauty). The new-look Flames were terrible, and fluked their way through a couple of wins they didn't deserve.

So with an upgrade in net, but with 82 games to even out the luck the Young Guns II were riding last season, I think the Flames finish in a similar position as last year.

It takes something very special to be last in the NHL these days.

[Bourque's Twin]

I think having a young, hard-working, and ambitious team will keep this team out of 30th place. It showed when they went on that winning streak at the end of last season.

[Huntingwhale]

IMO its just as hard to tank to last place as it is to win the cup. As long as crappy SE teams like TB and CAR exist, its going to be tough to get very last place. The fact that the Oilers were able to become a tanking dynasty for 3 years in a row is nothing short of a miracle. I think bottom 5 is possible, but as we saw this season, as soon as teams are out of the playoffs come deadline, it seems that every one of those GMs goes into tank mode and it becomes extremely difficult to achieve.

[Jason14h]

I think over a full 82 games people are going to be surprised how truly terrible this team is this season.

Anyone who thinks loosing your #1 minutes logging D (Even though he sucked), your captain and top scorer (Even though he sucked), your #1 setup man, and #1 goalie equates to anything other then a terrible team is kidding themselves.

We MAY not finish dead last, but we will be right there. On paper, this is probably the least talented team in the NHL

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

I think over a full 82 games people are going to be surprised how truly terrible this team is this season.

Anyone who thinks loosing your #1 minutes logging D (Even though he sucked), your captain and top scorer (Even though he sucked), your #1 setup man, and #1 goalie equates to anything other then a terrible team is kidding themselves.

We MAY not finish dead last, but we will be right there. On paper, this is probably the least talented team in the NHL

We lost those players at the deadline last year and quite a few teams out sucked us afterwards...

I don't think people understand the absolute crap on ice required to pull an Oiler "dynasty"