Revisiting 2009 draft - would you rather?

[The Original FFIV]

Don't want to have a long subject line so here goes:

Would you rather the Flames have picked Jacob Josefson or Marcus Johansson or are you happy with the return we received for Erixon (Horak, Wotherspoon and Granlund)?

Josefson/Johansson would have filled the need for depth at C and were the top two C available at the time. Neither have the preferred size to play C at the NHL level (Johansson is already on the wing in Washington) but given the lack of natural Cs in the organization it would have been beneficial to have this added depth. Johansson is further along in his development but from the reading I've done Josefson is in the same spot Backlund was last year and we did see some progress.

Horak seems to cap out as a 3rd line/depth guy. Believe Wotherspoon is a 5-6 with potential to be a 4 and Granlund has obvious skill but will it translate to the NHL level? And will his size hold him back from playing C, which is his preferred position.

Given our C situation wish that Sutter had gone with either Swedish C instead of Erixon. Yes, Horak and Wotherspoon seem set to play but in support roles. Wild card here is Granlund and if he can play his game in the NHL.

A bit slow on the news so just trying to generate some discussion. Perhaps either player could be a trade target if Feaster is going to upgrade the C position like he said around draft time.

[dammage79]

I'm happy with what we have.

[Enoch Root]

OP, I think you are under-estimating Wotherspoon's potential. He is progressing towards being a very solid D-man.

[PlayfulGenius]

the package of 3 is superior at this point, I think...and it's Wotherspoon that tips the scales for me...we'll see if he pans out.

It would be so awesome if Wotherspoon ends up > Erixon

[getbak]

All things considered, it worked out much better than we could have expected. Horak, Wotherspoon, and Granlund all have the potential to be NHL players (possibly all three will see NHL action this season).

So far, statistically, Horak and Josefson don't seem to be all that different from each other, and while Johansson has put up better numbers, he has done so on a higher-scoring team, and I think the collective group of Horak, Wotherspoon, and Granlund are still preferred.


In fact, even if Erixon had gladly and willingly signed with the Flames, I would still prefer the return.

Horak has already far exceeded the expectations of a fifth round pick and should be in Calgary full time this year.

Wotherspoon just keeps getting better every time I watch him (and between the Winterhawks playoff runs over the last three years, and last year's World Juniors, I've watched him a lot). Most people didn't expect him to even make Team Canada, and by the end of the tournament, he was arguably Canada's best defensive d-man. I don't think we can put a ceiling on him at this point. I expect him to be taking a regular shift in the NHL by the time the calendar turns to 2015.

Granlund is a bigger question mark. One of the frequent comments about him at the camp last week was that he already has an NHL shot. Unfortunately, that shot isn't packaged inside an NHL-sized body. My instinct on Granlund is that if he does become a regular NHLer, it will be somewhere other than Calgary. He does have a skill level that could make him attractive in a trade package.


Also of note, when the Flames traded with New Jersey at the 2009 Draft to move down from 20 to 23, they received a third round pick that they later packaged with a fourth round pick to get a slightly higher third round pick, which they used to draft Ryan Howse. So far, Howse has been a disappointment, but it was while scouting Howse that Conroy took notice of his line mate, Roman Horak, and he told Feaster to keep Horak in mind if a trade with the Rangers was ever in the works.

[moon]

Out of 3 choices Johanssen is preferred for me but if Wotherspoon turns out to be more than an AHL/6th d-man the Flames package could look better than Josefson.

[Poe969]

I'd take all of them over Tom lol.

[ricardodw]

So looking at Bob Mckenzie's 2009 pre-draft rankings..... what was the problem with going Canadian at pick #23 after the 6 best Euro's were gone. McKenzie ranked Ryan O'Rielly just ahead of Erixon and turns out he is in the top 10 from the class of '09.

Was there a rule that the Flames had to take the long-shot on a Euro instead of picking a Canadian that was ready for a regular shift in the NHL 3 months after he was drafted?


Sometimes the obvious pick is a lot better than the guy that needs to develop for another 2-3 years.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

So looking at Bob Mckenzie's 2009 pre-draft rankings..... what was the problem with going Canadian at pick #23 after the 6 best Euro's were gone. McKenzie ranked Ryan O'Rielly just ahead of Erixon and turns out he is in the top 10 from the class of '09.

Was there a rule that the Flames had to take the long-shot on a Euro instead of picking a Canadian that was ready for a regular shift in the NHL 3 months after he was drafted?


Sometimes the obvious pick is a lot better than the guy that needs to develop for another 2-3 years.

Erixon was bigger at the time.

[Stampede2TheCup]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

So looking at Bob Mckenzie's 2009 pre-draft rankings..... what was the problem with going Canadian at pick #23 after the 6 best Euro's were gone. McKenzie ranked Ryan O'Rielly just ahead of Erixon and turns out he is in the top 10 from the class of '09.

Was there a rule that the Flames had to take the long-shot on a Euro instead of picking a Canadian that was ready for a regular shift in the NHL 3 months after he was drafted?


Sometimes the obvious pick is a lot better than the guy that needs to develop for another 2-3 years.

Hindsight is 20/20. I'm pretty sure O'Reilly jumping straight into the NHL was a surprise to most NHL teams or he wouldn't have gone in the second round. Most guys of his pedigree in the CHL don't make the jump so quickly so it's not like it was blatantly obvious. Erixon was playing a regular shift as D-man against men in the Swedish elite league.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by timbit

Erixon was bigger at the time.

26 PIM in the CHL >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22 PIM in assorted no-contact SEL leagues.


22 PIM in a year by a bruising d-man .... and THEN 3 years later we find out that he is not prepared for the NHL.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by blah blah

Hindsight is 20/20. I'm pretty sure O'Reilly jumping straight into the NHL was a surprise to most NHL teams or he wouldn't have gone in the second round. Most guys of his pedigree in the CHL don't make the jump so quickly so it's not like it was blatantly obvious. Erixon was playing a regular shift as D-man against men in the Swedish elite league.

Played a huge role on a poor team in the OHL.... who else that the Flames recently drafted has that sort of pedigree?

[timbit]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

26 PIM in the CHL >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22 PIM in assorted no-contact SEL leagues.


22 PIM in a year by a bruising d-man .... and THEN 3 years later we find out that he is not prepared for the NHL.

Pretty funny.

[Stampede2TheCup]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Played a huge role on a poor team in the OHL.... who else that the Flames recently drafted has that sort of pedigree?

I dunno, no recent second round pick rings a bell. Or are you referring to Monahan who hasn't even played in the NHL yet? Very few guys jump straight into the NHL each year so when a second rounder did it was anything but obvious.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

So looking at Bob Mckenzie's 2009 pre-draft rankings..... what was the problem with going Canadian at pick #23 after the 6 best Euro's were gone. McKenzie ranked Ryan O'Rielly just ahead of Erixon and turns out he is in the top 10 from the class of '09.

Was there a rule that the Flames had to take the long-shot on a Euro instead of picking a Canadian that was ready for a regular shift in the NHL 3 months after he was drafted?


Sometimes the obvious pick is a lot better than the guy that needs to develop for another 2-3 years.

Knock on O'Reilly was his skating. And we already had Nemisz in the system whose skating was already suspect.

[FAN]

At the time I felt the Flames should have kept the pick and draft John Moore, who was the top rated defenseman available. It would still be a good choice today.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Knock on O'Reilly was his skating. And we already had Nemisz in the system whose skating was already suspect.

Serious question: Did O'Rielly's skating improve over 3 months so that he was able to play 81 NHL games? or was he mis-scouted?


IRC Nemisz showed up to his first pro camp in what he thought was the best shape of his life and was in the bottom 5% of the players showing up.

Nemisz was a support player in junior and O'Rielly was the best player on his team as a 17 year old.

[ricardodw]

Out of the whole Erixon mess I really like the fact that after getting drafted in the 5th round, one more year of junior and Horak was NHL ready.

As the Flames rebuild I certainly hope they are scouting 19 year old juniors that were drafted after the 2nd round that have improved and because of their lower draft status might be available as a throw in.

[FlameZilla]

I think had Tom stayed with the Flames he would have had his moment to shine a lot sooner than he has with NYR/CBJ. Ironic, given that he cited a lack of NHL opportunities as his reason for holding out. His development may have been stunted by the ordeal he & his advisors have put himself through. Perhaps had he stayed put he would have been a useful tool on our blue line. Instead he is just a tool.

Granlund & Wotherspoon have shown lots of potential & Horak is a regular NHLer in my books. This trade goes down as a Feaster 'win'... albeit a small one.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by FlameZilla

This trade goes down as a Feaster 'win'... albeit a small one.

How is this a small win for Feaster? He inherited a prospect that misled the team of his intentions and managed to get Horak and the picks that led to Granlund (45th) & Wotherspoon (57th) instend on a compensatory pick that would have been the 53rd.

This is a HUGE win for Feaster.