Flames Development Camp July 10th - 16th

[Stampede2TheCup]

Originally Posted by Bend it like Bourgeois

I'm scared of Monahan turning pro already. He was a 6th overall pick, not a 1st, an was not a dominant scorer in junior.

If he is physically ready that's one thing, but what will make him the best possible player from ages 22-32? I don't know the answer, but it would not hurt my feelings at all to see him go out up big numbers and learn to score against boys before he tries against men.

I'm not scared of it. It doesn't sound like Flames management wants to force it or anything. They'll probably only do it if it makes the most sense for his development after seeing him in camp and a 9-game trial. I don't think he needs to have been as dominant as guys like Hall in his draft year because he has such good hockey sense and is good all-around so he can potentially fit into an NHL roster pretty well without lighting up the score sheet.

I really think it's hard to guess whether he'll crack the lineup this year because even after seeing him in prospect camp it's hard to judge just how he'll do against NHL'ers.

[frinkprof]

On Monahan, I too would like to see him get 9 games and go back to Junior. A couple reasons.

One is that I think that players sticking with the big club in their draft year should be rare cases with special circumstances. Some of those circumstances would include:

- Have already played in the World Junior Championships or World Championship

- In the case of Europeans, have already played, and not just scraping by while doing so, in a European league amongst men

- Are incredibly physically mature for an 18/19 year old. Not just that they have the height and muscle mass, but that they have had it for long enough to be used to playing with it.

- Have exceptional pedigree. First overall in most (but not all drafts) and a few second and third overall. Not to slight Monahan because 6th overall isn't a huge dropoff in this department, but he isn't solidified in that very top pedigree group in this draft. If you're not in that group, you should fit one of the other criteria.

The other reason is the makeup of the Flames heading into this year. There are lots of rookie names in the mix already and I just think that there's only so many rookies you can have on the team before it can become too many to have a healthy atmosphere for them. You need to mix in some veterans (young 25-29 range and older 31 and up range veterans) to help keep a good atmosphere of professionalism, consistency and to foster mentorship of the younger players. These names are Horak, Hanowski, Knight, Ramage, Bouma, Breen, Reinhart and especially the 20 and under guys in Wotherspoon and Baertschi. Some of these guys may stick while others will be up and down to the AHL, but there's a good bet that there will be 4 or 5 rookies around the club at any given time.

Don't get me wrong with all of this, because Monahan and the 2013/14 Flames is an interesting situation and a case for keeping him is almost as convincing as sending him back for me. Development wise, I think there's a lot to be said for the opportunities that would be presented to him by going back to the OHL.

I say let him get his 9 games in, get the first-few-games jitters out, get some familiarity with the city and his future teammates, coaches, trainers and managers, get him a big boy paycheck or two and then send him back to gain some muscle, dominate the OHL, play in the World Juniors and hopefully go deep into the OHL playoffs and to the Memorial Cup.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by cral12

THW's Ryan Pike reflects back on Flames prospect development camp:

Selling Hope: Flames Future On Display At Development Camp

Even Morgan Klimchuk, a local boy who attended last year’s scrimmage in the stands as a fan, was taken aback by the level of fan support in the dead of summer.

Too funny.

[Matty81]

If Calgary sends Monahan back to the OHL I am really hoping Ottawa deals him, the 67s are god awful and he's not going to get a chance to win, other teams can pretty much just key in on him and the Salituro kid... gonna be a long tough year for them with probably a lot of teams targeting him with chippy play. The 67s are rebuilding and could use picks and 15/16 year olds so it makes sense to trade him from both sides, and he's finished high school so no reason not to move. When you look at their roster from last year too they actually had a lot of 18/19 year olds too, they've probably got a long way to go before they contend again.

I think he'd gladly play through the season with the 67s based on what I've seen of his character but I think it would be of more benefit for him and the 67s if he joins a winning organization and gets a nice long playoff run and potentially a shot at the Memorial Cup.

[Flames Fanatic]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Too funny.

I have to say I don't blame him. The amount of people that showed up on a Monday morning for a scrimmage yesterday was flabbergasting. I mean, sure Saturday makes sense, but a Monday after Stampede, when you know the emails and voicemails are backed up, to see the turnout was pretty special.

I know I wasn't the only one that was there every day either. Couple other guys that I chatted with and a few others I just recognized by sight. It was a lot of time to sink in. I figure I spent more than 24 hours at Winsport in the past week, and I missed Saturday.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

On Monahan, I too would like to see him get 9 games and go back to Junior. A couple reasons.

One is that I think that players sticking with the big club in their draft year should be rare cases with special circumstances. Some of those circumstances would include:

- Have already played in the World Junior Championships or World Championship

- In the case of Europeans, have already played, and not just scraping by while doing so, in a European league amongst men

- Are incredibly physically mature for an 18/19 year old. Not just that they have the height and muscle mass, but that they have had it for long enough to be used to playing with it.

- Have exceptional pedigree. First overall in most (but not all drafts) and a few second and third overall. Not to slight Monahan because 6th overall isn't a huge dropoff in this department, but he isn't solidified in that very top pedigree group in this draft. If you're not in that group, you should fit one of the other criteria.

The other reason is the makeup of the Flames heading into this year. There are lots of rookie names in the mix already and I just think that there's only so many rookies you can have on the team before it can become too many to have a healthy atmosphere for them. You need to mix in some veterans (young 25-29 range and older 31 and up range veterans) to help keep a good atmosphere of professionalism, consistency and to foster mentorship of the younger players. These names are Horak, Hanowski, Knight, Ramage, Bouma, Breen, Reinhart and especially the 20 and under guys in Wotherspoon and Baertschi. Some of these guys may stick while others will be up and down to the AHL, but there's a good bet that there will be 4 or 5 rookies around the club at any given time.

Don't get me wrong with all of this, because Monahan and the 2013/14 Flames is an interesting situation and a case for keeping him is almost as convincing as sending him back for me. Development wise, I think there's a lot to be said for the opportunities that would be presented to him by going back to the OHL.

I say let him get his 9 games in, get the first-few-games jitters out, get some familiarity with the city and his future teammates, coaches, trainers and managers, get him a big boy paycheck or two and then send him back to gain some muscle, dominate the OHL, play in the World Juniors and hopefully go deep into the OHL playoffs and to the Memorial Cup.

Great analysis. I really don't think Monahan will accomplish anything at the NHL level if he joins the team. I'd honestly much rather see him go back to juniors, get traded to a competitor, and absolutely dominate.

We aren't going to be competitive next season whether he joins the roster or not. I'd rather see him dominate kids his age, at the WJHC or in the CHL. I think it will be really good for his confidence. We have some dark days ahead of us. I'd rather see him succeed now and develop a winner's attitude.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Flames Fanatic

I have to say I don't blame him. The amount of people that showed up on a Monday morning for a scrimmage yesterday was flabbergasting. I mean, sure Saturday makes sense, but a Monday after Stampede, when you know the emails and voicemails are backed up, to see the turnout was pretty special.

I know I wasn't the only one that was there every day either. Couple other guys that I chatted with and a few others I just recognized by sight. It was a lot of time to sink in. I figure I spent more than 24 hours at Winsport in the past week, and I missed Saturday.

Yeah, I meant it was funny that he was there last year just as a fan watching, now he's attending as a top draft choice.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Goodlad

Great analysis. I really don't think Monahan will accomplish anything at the NHL level if he joins the team. I'd honestly much rather see him go back to juniors, get traded to a competitor, and absolutely dominate.

We aren't going to be competitive next season whether he joins the roster or not. I'd rather see him dominate kids his age, at the WJHC or in the CHL. I think it will be really good for his confidence. We have some dark days ahead of us. I'd rather see him succeed now and develop a winner's attitude.

If Monahan is ready to play in the NHL, play him... but if he goes back I don't have a problem with it either. The CHL is a great place to continue to develop and like you said he'll hopefully move to a contender and be a big part of the 2014 World Juniors.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

If Monahan is ready to play in the NHL, play him... but if he goes back I don't have a problem with it either. The CHL is a great place to continue to develop and like you said he'll hopefully move to a contender and be a big part of the 2014 World Juniors.

Monahan is an interesting case in determining whether he's ready for an NHL role or not. Because he was a late birthday, fairly physically matured, and very defensively responsible he seems like a guy that could slot anywhere from the 4th line to the 1st.

This is one of those situations where I'm going to have to trust the judgement of people more qualified than me. I'll be excited to see how he does either way.

[darthma]

Originally Posted by Fire

We just need a Keith and Seabrook. Hopefully Brodie can be one of them.

We had a Keith Seabrook already... didn't work out. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Seabrook

[getbak]

Originally Posted by darthma

We had a Keith Seabrook already... didn't work out. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Seabrook

They should have paired him with this guy: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=30854

[Day Tripper]

Originally Posted by getbak

They should have paired him with this guy: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=30854

And since the Flames like their -skis (Jankowski, Hanowski, tried to trade for Bartkowski), I think Feaster should do everything in his power to acquire this legend: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=95034

He's an Alberta boy too!

[Hockey_Ninja]

I would love to see a high profile forward Flames prospect on Team Canada. I think it would be better for Monahan to go back to junior for a year.

[dammage79]

He'll get his nine games for sure. But the WJC would be amazing for him. Tough call. But even if he produces nicely in those nine games, I tend to lean towards hoping they send him down for the international experience. Add to that it would be interesting to see how he deals with the insane pressure of playing for team Canada.

Jankowski is a long shot but it would be amazing to see two Flames prospects filling two of the top nine center roles.

[Stampede2TheCup]

Originally Posted by dammage79

He'll get his nine games for sure. But the WJC would be amazing for him. Tough call. But even if he produces nicely in those nine games, I tend to lean towards hoping they send him down for the international experience. Add to that it would be interesting to see how he deals with the insane pressure of playing for team Canada.

Jankowski is a long shot but it would be amazing to see two Flames prospects filling two of the top nine center roles.

He could still play the World Juniors even if he stuck with the Flames. It's not like they'll be battling for a playoff spot and needing every bit of help they can get.

[Alberta_Beef]

I think Monohan will make the club. What keeps many 18 year olds that have the ability off rosters is physical maturity and defensive ability. Monahan has both of these. I see no reason he can't step in a play a role similar to what Ryan O'Reilly played for the Avs or couturier played for the Flyers as an 18 year old rookie.

Besides if he goes back to the OHL will it really be good for him to play for that god awful team? I'm not sure it will be. I think with how bad the 67's are he might even be better off practicing with the Flames than playing for the 67's.

I'm wouldn't hand him a spot but if he is on the edge of being ready I would do similar to what the Kings did with Brayden Schenn, keep him up for 9 games but have him a healthy scratch for a bit too. Let him practice with the big club, maybe even sneak him down to the AHL on a "conditioning stint" due to not playing alot. Waste a portion of the season, let him dominate the WJC and get traded to a contender in the OHL playoffs.

[red sky]

I think he could still stand to beef up a bit before joining the big leagues. Another 10 pounds would really help out his frame as he is still somewhat lanky.

[TheGrimm]

The one thing that scares me in holding off on keeping prospects with the big club this year is the fact that it creates further backlog next year. I agree it's nice to keep another year of ELC for a guy like Monahan, however the Flames are going to be a bad team regardless next year, so the sooner we get some of these guys some experience the sooner we can rely on them as veterans.

I've bolded the guys I think we need to get into the line up sooner rather than later. Assuming these guys are all 50%+ likely to be future NHLers:

Markus Granlund – C
Mark Jankowski – C
Corban Knight – C
Sean Monahan – C
Max Reinhart – C
Kenny Agostino – LW
Michael Ferland – LW
Johnny Gaudreau – LW
Morgan Klimchuk – LW
Ben Hanowski – RW
Emile Poirier – RW
John Ramage – D
Patrick Sieloff – D
Tyler Wotherspoon – D

If the organization holds off with these guys this year I am not convinced that will help the team at all in the longer term.

Not saying they all need to play 82 games, just saying that they need to be given some opportunity to play.

[frinkprof]

^Agostino and Sieloff are tough because Agostino is going back to college for another year and Sieloff is still junior-eligible. Maybe Agostino can join at the end of the year like Hanowski did last year and get some experience in.

With Sieloff though, given the personnel already with the big club on defense, there's not much room for him and if you give him more than 9 games, you can't send him back to Junior and he's in the pro system to stay, plus you burn a year on his Entry Level Contract. Still a lot for Sieloff to gain by staying with his junior club.

I agree on the other guys though. I think Knight will probably make the team out of camp, but working in guys like Granlund, Ramage and Hanowski on call-ups will be good for them and the club.

[Canada 02]

if you give him more than 9 games, you can't send him back to Junior and he's in the pro system to stay

that's not true