Flames 2013 Draft Discussion

[djsFlames]

Okay, 3 ways this goes down.
Imo:

50% chance we keep all 3 picks and stay put.

25% chance we flip with Nashville. I think they could demand our 28th overall pick, because we don't have any 2nds. But I could see Feaster dealing one of Cammy/Tanguay/Stampniak prior to this to acquire a 2nd+ and flip that in a deal to move to 4th as a possibility as well. May succumb at the last minute to dealing one of the later 1sts to do a flip if they want Barkov badly enough though. But realistically moving 2 spots typically shouldn't be at that expense. (then again, the players in the top 4 are very highly regarded)

25% chance we flip (or just acquire) the 5th pick. Reasons for this: Jay can't make it work with Nashville, and feel they are at risk at having their preference at 6 to be snatched up at 5 by an alternate trade partner or Carolina themselves. Could be made in particular to block the Oilers if it comes to it (might come down to a bidding war, in which case we'll have trouble competing). Small chance Jay might deal the rumored top 4 d-man to Carolina (looking at Gio) + one of 1st round picks to add the 5th. They'll perceive it as a home run to take 2 in the top 10. If the picks are just swapped, I see our 3rd round (+ prospect, if bidding war ensues) being good enough.

No idea about changes to the later 1sts, but I see Feaster more likely acquiring a 2nd rounder by means of unloading a roster player than trading down with one of these. Just too many trade pieces that could potentially land that kind of return.

[The Fonz]

Like Columbus is experiencing right now, Bobrovsky is getting offer sheeted for 10M from the KHL. Big difference though... Columbus doesn't get compensated if they let him go.

[14]

Originally Posted by fotze

Didn't some team say his interview was the worst they have ever done.

Probably. A team that wants to pick him. All the draft talk by teams is a game of Poker. Luv all the references by people on CP that someone from an organization, even if it is referenced, is then the basis of truth.

Every scout, pr guy, GM, stick boy, etc are all playing a poker game right now.

[kehatch]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

Honest question, has there ever been a Russian drafted Top10 who is playing in the KHL at the time of the draft?

Going back to 2000 Zherdev, Malkin, Ovechkin, Filatov, and Chistov were all top 10 picks playing in a pro Russian league. Semin was almost a top 10 pick.

Chistov and Filatov did bolt. But not before spending years in the NHL/AHL and just not cutting it.

Zherdev isn't actually Russian. But he is one of the few examples of NHL caliber players bolting to the KHL. He was drafted way back in 2003.

The vast majority of NHL drafted Russian's returning to the KHL were guys that didn't actually cut it in the NHL. The guys that were successful NHL players that returned are very very rare.

The smart money is that Nichuskin will have a long career in the NHL. Not selecting him because he is Russian would be incredibly silly.

Not selecting him because his interview/testing at the Combine sucked, or because you don't like him as a player ... that makes sense. I am not saying the Flames should select him. But the Russian factor should have little to no bearing on the selection.

[Sidney Crosby's Hat]

Originally Posted by the_only_turek_fan

Button seems really really high on Monahan. He seems to think he will go at #5.

I wonder if Todd has any insight into a possible trade for a team moving up to #5 or if Carolina will take him with their pick at #5.

I really want this guy. 6'2", Center, can win draws, team captain, 2 way player.

I think a big reason why Craig made him go 5th was because he knows the Flames will take him at 6 but didn't want to make that pick.

My guess for top 15:

1. MacKinnon
2. Drouin
3. Jones (I think Tampa might trade this pick)
4. Nichushkin
5. Barkov (This pick is a strong possibility to be dealt also)
6. Monahan
7. Nurse
8. Lindholm
9. Fucale
10. Ristolainen
11. Wennberg
12. Mantha
13. Domi
14. Lazar
15. Horvat

[moon]

Originally Posted by Trailer Fire

Guarenteed that if he was Canadian he would be absolutely #1.

That's a pretty odd guarantee and one that seems to be totally against what every scout has said about him.

Sure he may drop for some in terms of him being Russian but no need to now overrate him because of that. He has shown nothing to indicate that he should be ahead of the "big 3" and it is debatable if he is better than Barkov, Lindholm and Monahan.

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Sidney Crosby's Hat

I think a big reason why Craig made him go 5th was because he knows the Flames will take him at 6 but didn't want to make that pick.

That's a really Flames-centric way of looking at it. I'm pretty sure he just thinks Carolina wants Monahan at 5. I believe that as well... Easy for us to point at Staal bros. and say they don't need another C. Doesn't mean they want to take a significantly higher risk prospect like Nichushkin or Nurse.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Sidney Crosby's Hat

I think a big reason why Craig made him go 5th was because he knows the Flames will take him at 6 but didn't want to make that pick.

My guess for top 15:

1. MacKinnon
2. Drouin
3. Jones (I think Tampa might trade this pick)
4. Nichushkin
5. Barkov (This pick is a strong possibility to be dealt also)
6. Monahan
7. Nurse
8. Lindholm
9. Fucale
10. Ristolainen
11. Wennberg
12. Mantha
13. Domi
14. Lazar
15. Horvat

Shinkaruk drops out of the top 15? Me no think so.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Shinkaruk drops out of the top 15? Me no think so.

I can see him and Mantha being inter changeable for sure. depends on the team and their needs.

[PlayfulGenius]

That's the highest I've seen Lazar...but I wouldn't argue against it.

[kehatch]

Originally Posted by moon

That's a pretty odd guarantee and one that seems to be totally against what every scout has said about him.

Sure he may drop for some in terms of him being Russian but no need to now overrate him because of that. He has shown nothing to indicate that he should be ahead of the "big 3" and it is debatable if he is better than Barkov, Lindholm and Monahan.

I would rank him 4 in terms of talent. Though I wouldn't fight to hard if someone put Barkov there. I think he will be the best player available when the Flames draft (if he is available). If he does have serious fitness, commitment, or attitude issues as some rumors say then I don't think he is a big enough upgrade over Lindholm/Monahan/Nurse that I would take him.

But if the Flames don't believe that to be true then they should definitely take him (assuming Barkov doesn't drop).

EDIT: On a side note Weisbrod said in an interview that he doesn't have a problem with prospects with poor fitness. Something along the lines of 'if the kids doesn't know how to work out yet but is still doing well on the ice that means you get an even better player once you teach them how to work out'. It made me immediately think to Nichuskin (who is rumored to have shown poor fitness levels in the Combine).

Obviously if commitment / character is the issue then you have a problem. But I have a feeling (and it is just that) that the Flames are seriously considering Nichushkin.

[trackercowe]

For those who watched Button's mock draft, it is just me or was Brian Burke growing a mullet? Guess now that he's no longer in front of the media every day he's allowed to let himself go lol.

Boy do I wish he was our GM though. Just by trading up to get Pronger and the Sedin's he has put himself ahead of most managers in the league. That's not really a shot at Feaster either, as I'd take Burke over probably 25 GMs in the league right now. I can't believe he has gone unhired thus far in the offseason. Hopefully somehow he'll still be available when the Flames replace Feaster.

[keenan87]

Where do people see Robert Hagg going?

[Vulcan]

EDIT: On a side note Weisbrod said in an interview that he doesn't have a problem with prospects with poor fitness. Something along the lines of 'if the kids doesn't know how to work out yet but is still doing well on the ice that means you get an even better player once you teach them how to work out'. It made me immediately think to Nichuskin (who is rumored to have shown poor fitness levels in the Combine).

Yeah, I read that too. It's really worked out for Ferland, House, Kolanos and maybe a couple of others.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Yeah, I read that too. It's really worked out for Ferland, House, Kolanos and maybe a couple of others.

Kolanos - Career AHLer
Ferland - Still way too early
Howse - 3rd round pick


All of these players are definitely NOT players that could end up being the best in their draft class.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by keenan87

Kolanos - Career AHLer
Ferland - Still way too early
Howse - 3rd round pick


All of these players are definitely NOT players that could end up being the best in their draft class.

I just gave three examples of players who have conditioning and or nutrition problems who at one time at least were thought to have some value to the Flames and haven't lived up to that value. I never said anything about being the best in their draft class and Weisbrod didn't either.

Yeah the young guys will get another chance but I wouldn't call not properly training to be a plus.

More on this subject, I'd like to see the Flames holding an all summer conditioning camp for their all their prospects. Something along the lines of what Gary Roberts does but only for Flames prospects.

[Henry Fool]

I've heard about Nichushkin being inconsistent and not using his linemates well. Someone who gets frustrated and develops tunnel vision. Granted that's true of many Russian star players but it's also not true that the only risk with him is related to the KHL. In a weird way the discussion about KHL has led people to assume that it's the only downside of drafting him.

I'd really like to know how much of the talent that supposedly sets him apart actually manifests on the ice every shift and how much of it is just theoretical or something that he does once a week. And how he plays off other players. Because you're trying to build a winning team, not a talent show.

[Henry Fool]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

I just gave three examples of players who have conditioning and or nutrition problems who at one time at least were thought to have some value to the Flames and haven't lived up to that value. I never said anything about being the best in their draft class and Weisbrod didn't either.

Yeah the young guys will get another chance but I wouldn't call not properly training to be a plus.

More on this subject, I'd like to see the Flames holding an all summer conditioning camp for their all their prospects. Something along the lines of what Gary Roberts does but only for Flames prospects.

It's more the attitude than the lack of conditioning by itself. I think teams want to gauge the mentality of the player. Lack of conditioning can be a sign of something lacking inside a prospect's head, but not necessarily.

With regard to Nichushkin, I doubt that conditioning would be an issue. Russian players tend to be pretty well developed in that regard.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by #-3

Just to be a smart a$$ that was the Russian Superleague

Not realy a smart a$$ comment, the russian league didn't offer the extreme contracts that the KHL does.

[Jacks]

Mackenzie has Gauthier at #22, I hope that comes true.