News from the Draft combine

[3 Justin 3]

Shinkaruk has below average in basically his entire build, doesn't have the greatest hand-eye and is apparently a dick off the ice.

Do not want.

Also, Horvat is 2 inches shorter than Barkov and has 4 pounds on him with 1.1 % lower body fat. What a beast.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by T@T

Hand-eye - lower = better

What exactly is that test? Interesting that MacKinnon was the worst in the category among those players, but I'm guessing it's not a hugely important test.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by T@T

Some player stats starting to be leaked:

Barkov: Height 74.5 inches, Wing span 76 inches, Weight 207.5 lbs, % Body Fat 11.8, Hand-eye 35.9 seconds, Upper body development A, Lower body development A

Monahan: Height 74.5 inches, Wing span 72 inches, Weight 188 lbs, % body fat 9.6, Hand-eye 31 seconds, Upper body development A, Lower body development A

Nichushkin: Height 76 inches, Wing span 78.5 inches, Weight 205 lbs, % Body Fat 10.3, Hand-eye 39.2 seconds, Upper body development A, Lower body development A

MacKinnon: Height 72.5 inches, Wing span 74.5 inches, 190.3 lbs, % Body fat 7.6, Hand-eye 40.9 seconds, Upper body development AA, Lower body development A

Domi: Height 69.5 inches, Wing span 70.5, Weight 190.7 lbs, % Body fat 8.8, Hand-eye 35.9 seconds, Upper body development A, Lower body development A

Horvat: Height 72.5 inches, Wing span 75.5 inches, Weight 211 lbs, % Body fat 10.7, Hand-eye 30.8 seconds, Upper body development AA, Lower body development A

Shinkaruk: Height 70.5 inches, Wing span 74 inches, Weight 172.5 lbs, % Body fat 9.5, Hand-eye 36.5, Upper body development BA, Lower body development BA

Lazar: Height 72 inches, Wing span 74.5 inches, Weight 191.2 lbs, % body fat 9.6, Hand-eye 29.1, Upper body development A, Lower body development A



E=Extensive, AA=Above Average, A=Average, BA=Below Average

Hand-eye - lower = better

These results have me feeling quite positive about drafting Monahan. Nothing to raise any concern, and his good performance in the hand/eye tests is a nice surprise, I think.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3

Shinkaruk has below average in basically his entire build, doesn't have the greatest hand-eye and is apparently a dick off the ice.

Do not want.

Also, Horvat is 2 inches shorter than Barkov and has 4 pounds on him with 1.1 % lower body fat. What a beast.

Below average doesn't mean he's out of shape and more that he's somewhere below the middle of the curve. I agree though that it's a bit of a red flag as it speaks to player motivation as if he can't get in top shape for this will he take his career as seriously as others? He's definately a polarizing guy but I recall Getzlaf had a bit of a dark cloud over him going into the 2003 draft so you can't get too caught up in this stuff.

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Below average doesn't mean he's out of shape and more that he's somewhere below the middle of the curve. I agree though that it's a bit of a red flag as it speaks to player motivation as if he can't get in top shape for this will he take his career as seriously as others? He's definately a polarizing guy but I recall Getzlaf had a bit of a dark cloud over him going into the 2003 draft so you can't get too caught up in this stuff.

I remember that but it was a bit unwarranted. He was a Calgary Hitman after all so most of us knew him better than most... It was a bit odd he fell to 19th, he was IMO a better prospect than Cs who went before him, Richards and Carter in particular

Edit: So Richards actually went after him, so I guess it's just Carter.

[puckedoff]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Below average doesn't mean he's out of shape and more that he's somewhere below the middle of the curve. I agree though that it's a bit of a red flag as it speaks to player motivation as if he can't get in top shape for this will he take his career as seriously as others? He's definately a polarizing guy but I recall Getzlaf had a bit of a dark cloud over him going into the 2003 draft so you can't get too caught up in this stuff.

From listening to his interviews I think he is extremely motivated and willing to put in the work that he'll need to in order to make it. Not that I think he should be our first selection, but that I wouldn't hold his results as a mark against his attitude.

[Enoch Root]

Good scores / bad scores in these tests is a bit of a double edged sword IMO...

If a guy's fitness is below average, is that bad because it shows he isn't motivated (possibly), or is it good because his hockey skills are where they are despite his lack of training (i.e. lots of upside because how good would he be if he were in better condition)?

On those scores above, the ones that interest me from that list are Monahan and Horvat. Barkov having 11.8% body fat, despite being a 17 year old pro hockey player, is a bit of a potential worry.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Good scores / bad scores in these tests is a bit of a double edged sword IMO...

If a guy's fitness is below average, is that bad because it shows he isn't motivated (possibly), or is it good because his hockey skills are where they are despite his lack of training (i.e. lots of upside because how good would he be if he were in better condition)?

On those scores above, the ones that interest me from that list are Monahan and Horvat. Barkov having 11.8% body fat, despite being a 17 year old pro hockey player, is a bit of a potential worry.

I'm not surprised about Barkov's body fat given he has a chubby looking face. You would hope as he matures he will do better here as nothing upsets NHL teams more than athletes coming to camp out of shape.

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not surprised about Barkov's body fat given he has a chubby looking face. You would hope as he matures he will do better here as nothing upsets NHL teams more than athletes coming to camp out of shape.

Plus, didn't have have a season ending shoulder injury? I'm sure he won't be as fit as the other guys who are either still in game shape or can workout hardcore without worrying about rehabbing an injury.

[red sky]

Nope, it is his chubby face.

[Bourque's Twin]

Originally Posted by red sky

Nope, it is his chubby face.

If it is then Phil Kessel must be 80% body fat.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Plus, didn't have have a season ending shoulder injury? I'm sure he won't be as fit as the other guys who are either still in game shape or can workout hardcore without worrying about rehabbing an injury.

Good point. I don't think that body fat measurement is going to scare off any teams that are highly interested in him. The NFL is more guilty but there becomes a point where any team can just keep digging and digging turning up small flaws in players to the point where they come up with excuses why not to draft who is clearly the best player. I think most teams are wiser than this.

[Commandant]

Draft Combine, Heights and Weights, as best as I could come up with assembling multiple sources (pics online, scans at HF, and my own source at the International Centre).

http://lastwordonsports.com/2013/06/...s-and-weights/

[The Fonz]

I think a more telling stat would be DSP (days since puberty). I want to know which guys still have some pube in the tank to get them that extra inch, and possibly 10 lbs. That could be the difference maker.

[Ashasx]

One thing about the combine...

Who is really a better prospect if two players post the exact same stats in the exact same league, but one is much more physically mature and fit than the other?

Wouldn't it be the player who has yet to develop physically, since he's already matching the numbers of the other player?

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Commandant

Draft Combine, Heights and Weights, as best as I could come up with assembling multiple sources (pics online, scans at HF, and my own source at the International Centre).

http://lastwordonsports.com/2013/06/...s-and-weights/

Wow. Subban is shorter than I thought. He really drew the short straw in his family.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

One thing about the combine...

Who is really a better prospect if two players post the exact same stats in the exact same league, but one is much more physically mature and fit than the other?

Wouldn't it be the player who has yet to develop physically, since he's already matching the numbers of the other player?

Makes sense up to a certain poiint. Fredrick Gauthier is an example. at that point it would be mostly about how in shape they actually are.

[Max Cow Disease]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

I want to know which guys still have some pube in the tank to get them that extra inch

This is remarkable.

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

One thing about the combine...

Who is really a better prospect if two players post the exact same stats in the exact same league, but one is much more physically mature and fit than the other?

Wouldn't it be the player who has yet to develop physically, since he's already matching the numbers of the other player?

I've been making this point in a few threads... I agree, the less developed player has more potential.

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

I think a more telling stat would be DSP (days since puberty). I want to know which guys still have some pube in the tank to get them that extra inch, and possibly 10 lbs. That could be the difference maker.

This may be best post in he history of this forum.

I truly hope 'pube in the tank' replaces 'post-apex' in the Flames vernacular.