Cervenka signs 3-year deal with SKA (KHL)

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by OffsideSpecialist

The article cited earlier stated 4M euros per year, in fact the person you quoted has that stated the part of the article they quoted

the article states

According to the agency R-Sport, referring to an unnamed source, should pay Červenka be about 160 million rubles (about 5.1 million. USD, 4 mil. Euros) for the period of the contract.

which would mean that is the total. but you are right it starts by saying per year. so what do you believe when an article contradicts itself. i personallybelieve no one even the KHL is stupid enough to pay him 5.1 million per year

[FAN]

Originally Posted by JayP

I agree. I just contend that the Flames as an organization have to scout these guys better or it's just a waste of time, money, and the opportunity cost of getting someone else in the line-up. The Flames shouldn't stop trying, but simply bringing over another extreme longshot and pray for a miracle is a negative to the organization in the end.

Bringing over a longshot and praying for a miracle was stupidity and a disservice to a guy like Iginla. The team could have told Iginla to consider a trade in the offseason and the team would have gotten a higher return. But no, Feaster believed his additions were enough to compete for the playoffs and Iginla stayed.

To be fair, Cervenka was very much a known quality. He had been considered one of the best European UFAs for several years prior to coming over. There's obviously something there. But Feaster, Weisbrod, and whoever scouted Cervenka should have known that he's a winger and gauge his interest in having an NHL career, not just a trial run.

As I said in my previous posts, the biggest problem is that the Flames were seemingly relying on Cervenka to fill a role a top 2 center role, a role he was incapable of filling. You don't do that when the team is trying to compete for the playoffs. The Red Wings didn't rest their playoff hopes on Brunner being a top 6 winger or even an NHL player. The Ducks didn't rest their playoff hopes on Fasth being a #1 goalie. Those were good pickups. People who think that pencilling in Cervenka to be one of the team's top 2 centers instead of finding a real center didn't cost the Flames any games is kidding themselves. There's so much parity in this conference that you take away a team's 2nd line center and the team's record is going to suffer.

[Pointman]

It's 5.1 total, for three years.

http://www.championat.com/hockey/new...ov-rublej.html

(in russian)

Which is 1.7 per, as I posted few pages before.

it also says that Cervenka's former team (Omsk) was in touch with Cervenka, but figured that he asks for too much money, so he ended up in SKA.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by FAN

To be fair, Cervenka was very much a known quality. He had been considered one of the best European UFAs for several years prior to coming over. There's obviously something there. But Feaster, Weisbrod, and whoever scouted Cervenka should have known that he's a winger and gauge his interest in having an NHL career, not just a trial run.

It's pretty clear after watching only half a season of the guy that his skill set clearly makes him a powerplay-only player. Professional scouts should be able to pick that out pretty quickly considering how apparent his flaws are. That's hardly worth the risk. Especially when, like you said, the attitude was to win now and a "no risk" move like this was just another band-aid that continued to sap the trade value of guys like Iginla and Kiprusoff.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by JayP

It's pretty clear after watching only half a season of the guy that his skill set clearly makes him a powerplay-only player. Professional scouts should be able to pick that out pretty quickly considering how apparent his flaws are. That's hardly worth the risk. Especially when, like you said, the attitude was to win now and a "no risk" move like this was just another band-aid that continued to sap the trade value of guys like Iginla and Kiprusoff.

I hate to break it to you but scouting isn't an exact science. At the end of the day until you give a guy a shot at the NHL, you really don't know what to expect. All in all Cervenka ending up playing less then 40 NHL games. I think given another (full) year he could probably be a decent NHL player, more time to adjust to the style of play and speed etc but he took a pretty huge contract to go back home.

The Flames weren't the only guys interested in bringing him over (IIRC)

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

I hate to break it to you but scouting isn't an exact science. At the end of the day until you give a guy a shot at the NHL, you really don't know what to expect. All in all Cervenka ending up playing less then 40 NHL games. I think given another (full) year he could probably be a decent NHL player, more time to adjust to the style of play and speed etc but he took a pretty huge contract to go back home.

The Flames weren't the only guys interested in bringing him over (IIRC)

I won't say money was not a factor for Cervenka to go back home, but if Cervenka really thought he had what it takes to be a 2nd line player in the NHL, he would have made more in the long run, than $1.7 million a year( KHL contract) by giving it another shot.

I really don't think he had any desire to change his game. He probably did not like the physical play and the attention to detail in own zone play.

[FAN]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I won't say money was not a factor for Cervenka to go back home, but if Cervenka really thought he had what it takes to be a 2nd line player in the NHL, he would have made more in the long run, than $1.7 million a year( KHL contract) by giving it another shot.

I really don't think he had any desire to change his game. He probably did not like the physical play and the attention to detail in own zone play.

Yep. That was my point. Cervenka probably just want to say "I played in the NHL." If Cervenka was really interested in pursuing an NHL career he would have waited until free agency to see if there was any interest. His offensive numbers aren't exactly terrible. It's conceivable that he can put up 20 goals and 40 points over a full season while being a complete defensive liability of course.

[craigwd]

At least now Cervenka has a legitimate chance at a championship. Petersburg has been one of the best KHL teams since the league was formed.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Pointman

It's 5.1 total, for three years.

http://www.championat.com/hockey/new...ov-rublej.html

(in russian)

Which is 1.7 per, as I posted few pages before.

it also says that Cervenka's former team (Omsk) was in touch with Cervenka, but figured that he asks for too much money, so he ended up in SKA.

Haven't been able to figure out how but you hearing "tax free" money in the KHL, if true that's more like $3m per.

Personally I would have liked to see what a healthy conditioned Cervenka with a training camp under his belt could do.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by T@T

Haven't been able to figure out how but you hearing "tax free" money in the KHL, if true that's more like $3m per.

Since the KHL is very much a nationalist project, tax-free is propably true. Never heard that contradicted, although there seems to be a bit of hush-hush about this issue.

Possibly it only applies to certain teams, star players or something. Or in true Russian style, "for those who play nice".

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by minnow

Failed experiment, nothing gained, not much lost. Best wishes, etc etc.

meh, that's about it...

I've been pretty open about not liking Feaster, but the Cervenka move wasn't a bad one and was worth the risk.

Feaster needs to learn not to over sell these guys to the media and fans though; it sets up unfair expectations...To be honest, I didn't expect much from Cervenka, but the organization is so lacking in skill, it was a worth the one year look...

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by T@T

Haven't been able to figure out how but you hearing "tax free" money in the KHL, if true that's more like $3m per.

Personally I would have liked to see what a healthy conditioned Cervenka with a training camp under his belt could do.

Article doesn't say if $1.7M is net or gross, but it doesn't matter much as taxes are only 13%. KHL is not tax free. Players pay 13% of their salaries, which is a tax rate for every employee in russia (myself included).

[FAN]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

Feaster needs to learn not to over sell these guys to the media and fans though; it sets up unfair expectations...To be honest, I didn't expect much from Cervenka, but the organization is so lacking in skill, it was a worth the one year look...

But did Feaster really oversold Cervenka or was he genuinely excited? Hey look what my hired workers found at a flea market in Europe. Something like this would have sold for a lot more here in North America!

Feaster probably thought he signed a top 2 center and everybody was going to praise him for thinking outside of the box.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Pointman

Article doesn't say if $1.7M is net or gross, but it doesn't matter much as taxes are only 13%. KHL is not tax free. Players pay 13% of their salaries, which is a tax rate for every employee in russia (myself included).

Well officially they should. However, there is so much rumours going around that KHL players don't need to pay taxes that I'd need to hear it from some players to think that it doesn't happen.

As I said, KHL is a nationalist sports project and one of Putins pet projects. Laws don't necessarily apply.

[Cwolf]

Russian is my native language and I read some articles in russian about Cervenka's contract. It is 5.1 million PER YEAR. And I think it's normal for former best KHL player. Proof (in russian): http://www.newsandscore.com/ru/hocke...dollarov-v-god

[craigwd]

Roman Cervenka's top 10 goals in the KHL!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xPVqFeubYE

One of my favourite players for Omsk, all the best with Petersburg!

[Table 5]

If it's 5.1 per year, I'm not surprised he didn't even bother to see what else the NHL could offer. He probably would've got a little more than last year, and that's it.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Cwolf

Russian is my native language and I read some articles in russian about Cervenka's contract. It is 5.1 million PER YEAR. And I think it's normal for former best KHL player. Proof (in russian): http://www.newsandscore.com/ru/hocke...dollarov-v-god

SKA already made a statement saying that this article is fake and 480M in roubles ($5.1 per year) figure is not true:

http://www.sports.ru/hockey/149026197.html

They didn't officially say what the real salary is, but they didn't deny previously reported 160M in three years ($1.7 per year)

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Itse

Well officially they should. However, there is so much rumours going around that KHL players don't need to pay taxes that I'd need to hear it from some players to think that it doesn't happen.

As I said, KHL is a nationalist sports project and one of Putins pet projects. Laws don't necessarily apply.

While nobody knows for sure what goes on under the table, I didn't find any rumours in russian web about not paying taxes for official contract figures (undertable payments is another issue). I only saw it in NA sources. In several russian articles I saw that usual 13% taxes apply,and it is just mentioned as common knowledge. Particularly, during the Zinovyev contract dispute it was reported that Ak Bars was paying all the taxes alright on Zinovyev's salary (http://sportweek.ru/swxokkey/111-ahbars in russian). However, this 2008 year interview by Barys's president http://www.sports.ru/hockey/5992660.html claim that often clubs are doing undertable payments to their players to avoid taxes. 2 days after it he had to completly withdraw those statements after KHL and public reaction though. Nonetheless, KHL clubs do fully pay taxes for official contracts. There may be undertable payments though. Which is, in fact, fairly common in Russia, as I was receiving such undertable untaxable payments in 2 out of 4 jobs I had in my life. This has nothing to do with Putin, nationalist project and such though.

[Cwolf]

Originally Posted by Pointman

SKA already made a statement saying that this article is fake and 480M in roubles ($5.1 per year) figure is not true:

http://www.sports.ru/hockey/149026197.html

They didn't officially say what the real salary is, but they didn't deny previously reported 160M in three years ($1.7 per year)

Well... another link with russian news (video) clearly saying 5 per http://tvrain.ru/articles/samyj_bezu...lchuka-343528/