Flames 2013 Draft Discussion - Page 208 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

dying4acup · 05-20-2013, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

No, I guess not... Maybe Gio plus a later pick could get it done.

I'm all for trading up as long as the Flames remain with 3 1st round picks... I'd like to see roster players used to move them up in the round.

Not really many teams looking to add payroll, especially the payroll we are looking to trade.

Moving up is going to take picks or prospects. And on that note adding pre-apex players will also require prospects and draft picks.

Flames Draft Watcher · 05-20-2013, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dammage79

If by some insane miracle Nichushkin falls to another of the Flames first round picks, there should be no way he isn't donning a Flames Jersey in two years.

Look, I get and understand fully the inherent risk of taking a Russian player that isn't even on the boat yet. Call me crazy if you like but I don't see how he isn't the better prospect over MacKinnon and Drouin and Jones. Even my favorite in the draft Barkov. This is the kind of player you start building a core with and keep for a very long time.

Sorry for getting all uppity about this, but I am sold on this player. Eventually he will make all the teams that passed on him rue the day. Rue I say!

Well all that we can see from the highlights is that he is great at driving the puck down the wing and has excellent speed and some great puckhandling. His shot doesn't seem to be that amazing.

The highlights don't really show his passing, or his decision making and hockey sense, etc.

His hands aren't as good as Drouin or MacKinnon's IMO. He seems to half flub some of his shots and I'm not sure of those will go in vs NHL goalies. In the highlights he appears to be quite puckhoggish.

Big, one-dimensional goal scoring wingers are valuable (Vanek is probably an okay comparable but I think Vanek has a much better shot). But I don't see why you'd consider him more valuable than a franchise centre.

I'll probably go back and watch a world junior game of his again before the draft. But I'm really not seeing why you'd think he's better than MacKinnon or Drouin. Maybe you haven't seen MacKinnon and Drouin highlights? There's plenty of them.

Commandant · 05-20-2013, 08:18 AM

Steven Santini from the US NTDP

http://lastwordonsports.com/2013/05/...er-profile-39/

PlayfulGenius · 05-20-2013, 08:22 AM

Surely one of the CLB picks must be in play for a roster player that can help make sure they get into the playoffs next season... I wonder if Gio, Cammi, Tanguay or anyone else is of interest to them...anyone familiar with what they might be lookin for to improve their team?

Caged Great · 05-20-2013, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

Surely one of the CLB picks must be in play for a roster player that can help make sure they get into the playoffs next season... I wonder if Gio, Cammi, Tanguay or anyone else is of interest to them...anyone familiar with what they might be lookin for to improve their team?

Goals and players that can set them up. Cammalleri IMO would be the perfect fit there.

Yoho · 05-20-2013, 08:51 AM

I wonder if there is a fit for Tanguay and his contract anywhere for us to off load for picks or prospects?

kyuss275 · 05-20-2013, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoho

I wonder if there is a fit for Tanguay and his contract anywhere for us to off load for picks or prospects?

I am sure there is, as long as Feaster is not swinging for the moon. If Feaster wants a 2nd then probably not, but if he will take a 4th or 5th to move him without any money being eaten then there should be some teams.

GreenLantern2814 · 05-20-2013, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Goals and players that can set them up. Cammalleri IMO would be the perfect fit there.

I think Cammalleri is still probably needed around here for at least half a season. He's a good top six guy, seems a decent leader, and actually played better in my opinion after Iggy was traded.

That being said, depending on what civics Columnus offered, it would be very difficult to pass up 4 firsts this year.

Mith · 05-20-2013, 09:39 AM

For what it's worth, it's probably worth hanging on to these assets (or at least some of them) for the year, letting them play with the kids a bit, and then loading up for the 2014 draft too. I think it would be silly to try to draft all our talent in one draft and having multiple firsts in 2013 AND 2014 is almost certainly more valuable

Flames Fan, Ph.D. · 05-20-2013, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaine

I don't care where he is from personally. I have no blinders for Russian's or any other place. What I have a problem with is the fact that those from other countries that have shown little to no intention of coming to NA in the past and a real possibility exist that they will remain to play in the league they are currently in. This is a problem with the KHL unfortunately, something that has to be taken into account when drafting. This is why for example, Russians that play in the CHL before the draft are often much more valued in the draft than those that have played in the KHL.

Again all the skill in the world means nothing if the player doesn't actually play for the team that drafted him.

From my perspective, the KHL issue isn't so much that it doesn't vet the player properly, but that it gives the player an escape hatch.

Part of team's leverage in developing a young player in North America is that the players have limited options. Flames send you down to Abby and you don't want to report? Not many enticing options at hand.

But a player like Nichushkin could just say, eff it, it's not worth the extra work and I can go back and earn more and return to my comfort zone. I think this is partly what drove Cervenka to go back as well. It's a maturity issue, and probably one that is hard to gauge up front.

Bonded · 05-20-2013, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

I think this is partly what drove Cervenka to go back as well. It's a maturity issue, and probably one that is hard to gauge up front.

I think Cervenka went back because he did not fit on the team. For some reason he couldn't seem to stick in a good spot even though he did seem to be playing decently.

Flames Fan, Ph.D. · 05-20-2013, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonded

I think Cervenka went back because he did not fit on the team. For some reason he couldn't seem to stick in a good spot even though he did seem to be playing decently.

I don't disagree with that. But part of my point is that his incentive to work towards a fit was lessened by the fact that he knew he had a good place to escape to.

We can see what the Flames do on draft day, but I can understand the reticence to draft Nichushkin for reasons other than his nationality

dammage79 · 05-20-2013, 12:33 PM

http://flames.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=671403

List of kids going to the Combine.

dammage79 · 05-20-2013, 03:10 PM

Player that interests me is Nick Sorenson, 6'1" 176 lbs. RW from the QMJHL. Could be a third round steal. Needs to add size but at the third round these are the kind of picks teams will be looking at.

dammage79 · 05-20-2013, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Well all that we can see from the highlights is that he is great at driving the puck down the wing and has excellent speed and some great puckhandling. His shot doesn't seem to be that amazing.

The highlights don't really show his passing, or his decision making and hockey sense, etc.

His hands aren't as good as Drouin or MacKinnon's IMO. He seems to half flub some of his shots and I'm not sure of those will go in vs NHL goalies. In the highlights he appears to be quite puckhoggish.

Big, one-dimensional goal scoring wingers are valuable (Vanek is probably an okay comparable but I think Vanek has a much better shot). But I don't see why you'd consider him more valuable than a franchise centre.

I'll probably go back and watch a world junior game of his again before the draft. But I'm really not seeing why you'd think he's better than MacKinnon or Drouin. Maybe you haven't seen MacKinnon and Drouin highlights? There's plenty of them.

I've seen a fair share of both MacKinnon and Drouin highlights. Have no qualms with their skill or where they are seeded. What I see in Nichushkin though is a very similar skill set to MacKinnons with more size. The speed on both players look to be about the same.

The puckhogging thing you have me there. His shot looks fine and although it may not be on par with MacKinnons, Nichushkin doesn't seem shoot from the perimeter as much. He goes to the net and creates great opportunities from in close.

That is not to say neither Drouin or MacKinnon don't but I do see a clear difference in how they do it. I see a tougher player to get out from in front of the net once he gets there as well.

I want a franchise center a la Barkov, Lindholm, Monahan but I find myself on the very understanding side of things if they take the risky Russian.

Defensively he looked alright in the WJC from what I recall but I agree with you, I may have to go back and watch some full games to clarify.

Bonded · 05-20-2013, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

I don't disagree with that. But part of my point is that his incentive to work towards a fit was lessened by the fact that he knew he had a good place to escape to.

We can see what the Flames do on draft day, but I can understand the reticence to draft Nichushkin for reasons other than his nationality

Yeah. I would stay away from Nichushkin. Too much incentive and pressure to stay home.

Bonded · 05-20-2013, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dammage79

I want a franchise center a la Barkov, Lindholm, Monahan but I find myself on the very understanding side of things if they take the risky Russian.

Franchise centres are very optimistic projections for those centres.

dammage79 · 05-20-2013, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bonded

Franchise centres are very optimistic projections for those centres.

Barkov is right up there IMO regardless of Optimistic projections.

Johnny Rotten · 05-20-2013, 04:01 PM

Probably been mentioned elsewhere, but Philadelphia appears to be in cap trouble. They could probably buy out a Bryzgalov, Timonen, or Briere but not all three. If the Flames are willing to take one of the three, what pick could they get?

What about the Flames taking one of them and offering a late first for Philly's eleventh overall and a second...or something along those lines? The worse the contract the more the Flames get back?

devo22 · 05-20-2013, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Rotten

Probably been mdmtioned elsewhere, but Philadelphia appears to be in cap trouble. They could probably buy out a Bryzgalov, Timonen, or Briere but not all three. If the Flames are willing to take one of the three, what pick could they get?

What about taking one of ghem and offering a late first for Philly's eleventh overall and a second...or something along those lines?

didn't they just re-sign Timonen after the lockout? Why would they want to buy him out a couple months later?

Briere would be interesting, but he has an NMC and we already have enough smurfs.