WQF (3) Vancouver Canucks vs (6) San Jose Sharks (Sharks win 4-0!!!!).

[dash_pinched]

I searched the thread and didn't see this posted, apologies if I missed it, but Corrado playing last night has burned the first year of his ELC. In my opinion, that's pretty bad asset management as it was highly unlikely that the Canucks were going to rally and win this series.

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by dash_pinched

I searched the thread and didn't see this posted, apologies if I missed it, but Corrado playing last night has burned the first year of his ELC. In my opinion, that's pretty bad asset management as it was highly unlikely that the Canucks were going to rally and win this series.

it's not a big deal, it means he gains an extra 300k or so in one season (like the raise Tanev will get this season)

he's been a top 6 guy for them since he came up, and will be next year as well

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dash_pinched

I searched the thread and didn't see this posted, apologies if I missed it, but Corrado playing last night has burned the first year of his ELC. In my opinion, that's pretty bad asset management as it was highly unlikely that the Canucks were going to rally and win this series.

I enjoy a good Nuck bashing as much as the next guy, I don't agree with this.

If a guy can help your team and contribute - especially in the playoffs - you play him. The ELC is nothing compared to the playoffs.

Of course, they lost anyway, so there is that, but going into the game, you ice your best team.

[CaptainCrunch]

I just look at the depth off Vancouvers forward group and its pretty patchwork, they have a decent blue line and very good goaltending.

It seems todays NHL depth and especially the bottom 6 up front is a huge factor for any kind of success.

It almost seems that its easier to find the scoring up front through trades, draft and free agency then building a cohesive checking and energy line.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

it's not a big deal, it means he gains an extra 300k or so in one season (like the raise Tanev will get this season)

he's been a top 6 guy for them since he came up, and will be next year as well

This is all true, but I think it's terrible asset management as well. I really really like what I've seen from Corrado and he could be a hell of a player soon. To burn a year off his contract is just bad idea when Ballard was sitting in the press box.

[cKy]

Truth be told, if Corrado didnt play, and the Canucks still lost (which they wouldve), all the Nuck fans would be bitching cause they didnt play with the best possible lineup.

I think they made the right call

[OILFAN #81]

Here in San Jose it's been a passing of the torch. The media, fans, and players know this is Logan Couture's team now. He's the main cog and Thornton/Marleau/Pavelski are the support. ICouture has definitely stepped his game up. Interesting to see what the Sharks do at next years' trade deadline with Marleau and Thornton both being pending UFA's. Torres has been a huge benefit on the bottom 6 and Niemi in goal has been amazing. He'd be my Vezina nominee and has been solid in the playoffs as well.

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

This is all true, but I think it's terrible asset management as well. I really really like what I've seen from Corrado and he could be a hell of a player soon. To burn a year off his contract is just bad idea when Ballard was sitting in the press box.

yes but that's a decision they make before Corrado plays a playoff game

and the Canucks going in to the playoffs probably didn't think it was going to only last 4 games

you ice your best team, Corrado is on that best team even when everyone is healthy

and the optics of benching him look amateur IMO to do it in a playoff game when everyone knows the reason why

sends the wrong message to your team, the opponents, and the player

[Komskies]

Originally Posted by Hesla

This is the point when their Fortunes turned. They have never been the same team since this incident. Other teams figured out they lacked testicular-fortitude and refs figured out that they dive all the time.

AC has the best version of that one on his website:



http://www.recklesscaution.com/misc_...inSpeedbag.gif

I think he spliced the CBC feed with NBC footage. What a pro.

[Captain_Obvious]

Originally Posted by Komskies

.

This sequence is the Canucks in a microcosm.

It was astounding to the see the absolute lack of push-back in this situation.

It personifies how they react as a whole when the going gets tough.

[Red John]

Seems the million dollar question is "What's wrong with the canucks" so would like to take my stab at it.

1) They are getting bad luck and bounces. Hear me out. Last years playoffs and this year, they are losing a lot of close one-goal games that could go either way. Went back this morning and watched game 7 of the 2011 finals against Boston and surprisingly that game wasn't the blowout the score indicated. The canucks are a good team with a solid top line and good structure and when you have that you'll be in every game. Frankly that game 7 was basically Vancouver getting a few grade A chances and not converting, and Boston creating two goals literally out of nowhere. The O has gone from creating 4 goals/game in the playoffs to barely over 1 goal/game since the 2011 finals against Boston. They've played two Stanley Cup winning teams in Boston and L.A. since then, and a Sharks team full of confidence right now.

2) They are not creating their bounces. They have zero confidence - it could be because nothing good has happened to them in crucial moments in games, it could still be because of that game 7 loss to Boston - that will haunt players for a long time - but the canucks have been in pretty much every game but when the chips are down they haven't made clutch plays.

3) They can't elevate their game. This is likely due to playing in a weak division where their solid structure + solid top line is good enough to win most nights. When you don't have to elevate your game all regular season long and still win the division every year, you can't just flip a switch in the playoffs. The other problem is that their two top players are the quintessential guys who are regular season players - they do their best work on the powerplay, fade away when the checking gets tight, and aren't great skaters which is the number one way you elevate you game in the playoffs - be quicker all over the ice. It's tough to elevate your game as a team in playoffs when your two star players just don't fit that mold.

There are other issues to be sure. Gillis hasn't been able to find secondary scoring for the top line - when the Sedins stop scoring others haven't stepped up. The Booth trade didn't work out. Kesler hasn't been able to stay healthy. Higgins just doesn't have the hands to play second line full-time and neither does Raymond.

Too much salary has been allocated towards the D and goaltending - given the style the canucks used to find success in 2011 (ultra high tempo, blazing transition game, great PP) they let the wrong guy leave in Ehrhoff - and gave big bucks to Bieksa who was obviously a product of playing with Hamhuis, and same with Edler, Garrison and trading for Keith Ballard who the coach has a hate-on for.

Talk about goaltending for a second here: Gillis erred in not dealing with the Luongo trade situation. He's a stubborn man who decided he wouldn't trade him until the return he wants gets offered. Reminds me of that guy down the street who has an old sports car that's worth 10k at most but he keeps listing it for 25k because he paid 50k for it brand new and refuses to accept what the market dictates. Luongo's been a pro about it all season long but when you have a big-ticket goalie who doesn't want to be there and a coach who resolves this elephant in the room by flipping a coin before games, you could honestly see this playoff debacle coming a long way away.

You get the sense at times that Vigneault's message has gotten stale with this group - he's a good tactical coach but is an easy personality to dislike with his whiny demeanor and it rubs off on the players - also get the sense that he doesn't have a lot of control over his players sometimes.

The solution:

You don't trade Kesler. He's one of the few players on the canucks who has the personality and skillset to elevate his game in key situations when he's healthy. He could be a No. 1 center on the team similar to Patrice Bergeron - won't put up 75 points again most likely but is great defensively and an all-situations guy which is what they need.

You do trade the Sedins. They aren't great skaters and can't elevate their games in the playoffs - they are great players but not elite and their value is still high. The canucks have big money and term tied up in too many players (like Darryl Sutter's Flames) so if there's any chance of re-shaping the core you have to move guys that still carry good value.

Move Luongo pronto. He may be a good goalie still but he'll never win a Cup in this city with the baggage he has at this point. It doesn't matter if you think Schneider's better or not - Luongo has too much bad history here and you need to start over.

Move some salary off the blueline. Anyone except Hamhuis and Tanev could go. Garrison's value will never be higher, Edler would fetch a huge return still and Bieksa is a bum when he's not paired with Hamhuis - either put them back together or trade Bieksa who is pretty erratic for a $4.6 million guy.

The team has the worst prospect pool in the league and moving guys before its too late (see: Calgary) will get some blue chippers back into the system.

One final thing to address: Mike Gillis is not a well-liked guy. A lot of his peers can't stand him and he rubs a lot of people the wrong way due to being and just his personality in general. Even Vigneault doesn't get along with him. You can let that go if you're having a ton of success but Gillis really just inherited a roster from Nonis that was ready to peak. He hasn't drafted well at all, tied himself to his core with long expensive deals that don't allow the flexibility he now needs, and whiffed on a few recent trades. Given five straight division titles it would be insane to think about firing him but how much of that was actually his doing? Seems like the decline is more his fault than the original rise to the top was.


tl;dr Vancouver has had bad luck but haven't created their bounces and confidence is shot since 2011 finals. They can't elevate their game in the playoffs and aren't built for success. They'd do well to refresh things and move out some big pieces while there's still value there but it will be tough. One wonders if Gillis is the man to actually carry that out as he's lost the luster he had as a GM in 2011.

[IgiTang]

^ what? Sorry, fell asleep.... I think you were saying the nucks suck cause theyre .. Well, the nucks!

[Super Nintendo Chalmers]

[red sky]

Originally Posted by Super Nintendo Chalmers

Your fired what?

[Super Nintendo Chalmers]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I just look at the depth off Vancouvers forward group and its pretty patchwork, they have a decent blue line and very good goaltending.

It seems todays NHL depth and especially the bottom 6 up front is a huge factor for any kind of success.

It almost seems that its easier to find the scoring up front through trades, draft and free agency then building a cohesive checking and energy line.

Someone else said it pretty succinctly; BPA works at the draft, not the trading deadline.

[Super Nintendo Chalmers]

Originally Posted by red sky

Your fired what?

It's the internet. Using "you're" makes you a weirdo.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Red John

You do trade the Sedins. They aren't great skaters and can't elevate their games in the playoffs - they are great players but not elite and their value is still high. The canucks have big money and term tied up in too many players (like Darryl Sutter's Flames) so if there's any chance of re-shaping the core you have to move guys that still carry good value.

As a Canuck hater, I would be interested in watching them re-sign the Sedin's so that they get large dollars as their skills decline.

But as an outsider looking in (and shelving my hate for a minute), the time to trade the Sedin twins and get very good value back is now. But would a GM have the balls to do it? Would be a very interesting move.

[d_phaneuf]

so I assume Kevin Bieksa accusing Couture and Thornton of embellishment is going to go over well on CP?

"Two so called Canadians, who are supposed to play the game with integrity"

[dammage79]

I laugh at any Canuck who complains about embellishment.

[jschick88]

Bieksa completely throwing Thornton & Couture under the bus, accusing embellishment. "This is about integrity"

Bieksa physically demonstrated: Couture lets mitts fly to draw penalties, Thornton removes glove to check hand & helped draw slashing call

https://twitter.com/brodiebrazilCSN

Unbelievable. God I hate Bieska.