[News] Friedman: Feaster/Flames are not going to blow it up

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by Nasty

I dont think its safe to say the leafs are turned around... hard to base success on such a short season, the canadiens are in first place in the east for gods sake

True. I guess I have just lost faith in Feaster already. I assumed with Wiesbrod from Boston on board we would be trying to get big and skilled not smaller. I'm not liking his acquisition strategy so far.

[Bar-Down]

Originally Posted by nik-

Are the mods still in the process of checking out that source or was it determined to be suspect?

I looked through the whole thread and couldn't find this "rumour" posted about Burke.

Maybe the Mods deleted it as it wasn't legit...??

[Dagger]

Burke is not the right GM for us. He's the definition of a win-now general manager.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Bar-Down

I looked through the whole thread and couldn't find this "rumour" posted about Burke.

Maybe the Mods deleted it as it wasn't legit...??

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=125687

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Dagger

Burke is not the right GM for us. He's the definition of a win-now general manager.

What are you basing this on? Look at his work in Vancouver and Toronto. There is a good book on GMs called Behind the Moves which has a lot of content on Burke and his views. I am comfortable suggesting you explore these before making such a declaration

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Wow. And it's not often I get to talk to an anonymous Flames insider who gets his info from the radio. What an honor!

The truth of the matter is you don't know any more than the rest of us, and we don't know anything. But go ahead, enjoy your inside-track that you get from Twitter and talk shows. I'll stay under my rock and recognize that I don't know jack-$hit that goes on behind the scenes, and oddly enough I'll know just as much as you do.

Well not exactly. I know somebody that works in fairly high position for the Hitmen and while he's somewhat disconnected from the day to day operation of Flames and doesn't know exactly what's going on in Feaster and Kings office he knows the company talk like someone would working at any corporation.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by browna

Possible reasons:
-Burke has a deep respect for the Flames organization, I think. He was with the NHL while Hotchkiss was still there, and everyone at the NHL has respect for him, so that's where it probably started.

-Recall him with the full page ad, thanking the Flames fans and organization, after the Ducks 2006 win? **EDIT** Ok not full page add, a letter: http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/...9-458c1fcfbbd6

-Pretty good friends with Sutter as colleagues, cut from the same cloth. I am sure in talking with Sutter, and especially the Phaneuf trade, he saw how, directly or indirectly, the Flames owners and organization acted, and worked to get that deal done.

This in addition to Burke and his ego, taking on a challenge and having full control. Not much else he has left to do Canada with other team, he's likely not working for the Oilers, and any of the big clubs in the US that he'd like are stable at the moment.

Not making a case for him, but I think Burke would know exactly what he's getting into with the owners here and so would the owners, both if he was considering, or being considered here. He would want full control though, as he had in Toronto.

Maybe but I recall Burke lashing out at Flames ownership when Al Coates was canned and while that was a long time ago the Flames ownership group is still intact. Just not sure how he feels about the organization as a whole especially given the talk of too many cooks in the kitchen. The Flames really look like an organization to avoid at the present time.

[Vinny01]

I honestly think Burke would be Edwards ideal candidate. Burke is impatient and wants to win now he is not afraid to aggressively try to improve his team. Burke would also like Calgary as it is a passionate fanbase with a passionate owner who wants nothing more than a winner. Burke would then get the resources to make the moves he wants. I think the fit makes sense

Feaster has clearly screwed up building a soft team and also made a potential massive blunder with the RoR saga. I wouldn't be shocked to see King and Feaster replaced with Burke

[Poe969]

And it would give Burke a chance to back up his words from the other day, saying he built the leafs and now someone else is taking credit. If he came in and made changes asap, this team could turn around in a couple of years and he'd be given a lot of credit. I think someone new has to come in if they're going to make big changes.

[BigFlameDog]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I wonder when we are going to stop blaming the coach. How many more do we have to go through?

No kidding...there is zero chance Hartley is fired for at least another year so these conversations are stupid.

[moon]

Originally Posted by BigFlameDog

No kidding...there is zero chance Hartley is fired for at least another year so these conversations are stupid.

If King and Feaster are fired (or King moved upstairs) and a new hockey operations staff is brought in I could easily see Hartley being fired after one year.

A new group would likely want to bring their own guy in and if the person they want is available then see you later Hartley.

However, keeping him to fire him later may be an easy piece for them to hold on to when things are rough during the rebuild and then bringing in the guy you want after some of the tough times are over.

[Poe969]

I don't think these conversations are stupid, I think it's stupid to be closed minded and say there is zero chance something happens or doesn't happen.

If the owners bring in someone like Burke and he doesn't like Hartley, Hartley will be gone. I'm not saying it's going to happen but it could.

As for blaming the coach, he's the one putting the lines together and is responsible for what the team does. He has to shoulder some of the blame. The GM has assembled a bad team and made some bad moves, he's to blame. The owners might be meddling in the teams best interest, they're to blame. The president is only concerened with making money and not in winning games, he's to blame. The players aren't playing well on most nights, they have to be held accountalbe too.

Point is, the Flames are 15th in the west and 2 points out of 30th in the league. There is enough blame to go around.

[BigFlameDog]

Originally Posted by moon

If King and Feaster are fired (or King moved upstairs) and a new hockey operations staff is brought in I could easily see Hartley being fired after one year.

A new group would likely want to bring their own guy in and if the person they want is available then see you later Hartley.

However, keeping him to fire him later may be an easy piece for them to hold on to when things are rough during the rebuild and then bringing in the guy you want after some of the tough times are over.

We are on the same page....they won't fire ops until summer, new guys will give Hartley at least 2/3 of next season...so talking about it now is using up other venting energy and bytes.

[BigFlameDog]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I don't think these conversations are stupid, I think it's stupid to be closed minded and say there is zero chance something happens or doesn't happen.

If the owners bring in someone like Burke and he doesn't like Hartley, Hartley will be gone. I'm not saying it's going to happen but it could.

As for blaming the coach, he's the one putting the lines together and is responsible for what the team does. He has to shoulder some of the blame. The GM has assembled a bad team and made some bad moves, he's to blame. The owners might be meddling in the teams best interest, they're to blame. The president is only concerened with making money and not in winning games, he's to blame. The players aren't playing well on most nights, they have to be held accountalbe too.

Point is, the Flames are 15th in the west and 2 points out of 30th in the league. There is enough blame to go around.

I am just waiting until you get to the usher's and the ticket takers....unfair to pin anything on the coach after 2 friggin' months.

He's trying to make chicken noodle out of chicken crap.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by BigFlameDog

I am just waiting until you get to the usher's and the ticket takers....unfair to pin anything on the coach after 2 friggin' months.

He's trying to make chicken noodle out of chicken crap.

Hey come on now.

Although it may not be fair to throw Hartley under the bus, if we do get different leadership, and his 'guy' becomes available, they'd be pretty dumb not to make that move to get them.

Say the Phoenix situation blows up this summer, you're a new GM and Dave Tippet becomes available. Do you make that move?

[Clever_Iggy]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Hey come on now.

Although it may not be fair to throw Hartley under the bus, if we do get different leadership, and his 'guy' becomes available, they'd be pretty dumb not to make that move to get them.

Say the Phoenix situation blows up this summer, you're a new GM and Dave Tippet becomes available. Do you make that move?

I would rather walk blindly in a state of constant mediocrity for 10 years than have watch a season worth of Dave Tippet hockey. At a certain point, entertainment has to play a factor.

Otherwise, I agree. If a new GM/President gets brought in, everyone is vulnerable, first season or not.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Say the Phoenix situation blows up this summer, you're a new GM and Dave Tippet becomes available. Do you make that move?

I think you have to although the owners will have to be comfortable paying Hartley not to coach for a couple of seasons. The facts are that despite spending $$$ on free agent upgrades in the offseason the team has badly regressed under Hartley. Team defense is 30th and it wasn't even that bad under Keenan and his roster managment has been abysmal. He simply looks like a guy that was justly not working in this league for years.

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by Dagger

Burke is not the right GM for us. He's the definition of a win-now general manager.

you should go look up the phaneuf, beachamin and kaberle deals he made, and determine if you still believe he's not good at asset management to get younger and improving prospect quality.

other than the kessel deal which was unjustfiable, he's been a pretty damn good GM in my opinion if we focus on his work with just the leafs.

in any case, he's smarter and more experienced, brings more pedigree, than the guy he'd be replacing, so i'm very excited by the drive-by rumour dropped on CP yesterday.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Clever_Iggy

I would rather walk blindly in a state of constant mediocrity for 10 years than have watch a season worth of Dave Tippet hockey. At a certain point, entertainment has to play a factor.

Tippett has the unique ability to work with an adapt to what he has.
Those Dallas teams weren't that awful to watch, I think he plays what it takes to win.

Terrible ice surface in Dallas / Goalie who can handle the puck? Force them to dump it in and have your goalie clear it with ease.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I think you have to although the owners will have to be comfortable paying Hartley not to coach for a couple of seasons. The facts are that despite spending $$$ on free agent upgrades in the offseason the team has badly regressed under Hartley. Team defense is 30th and it wasn't even that bad under Keenan and his roster managment has been abysmal. He simply looks like a guy that was justly not working in this league for years.

To be fair without the Kipper of last season we likely would have been 30th in team defense too.

Our defensive zone positioning has been pretty bad but our goaltending has been terrible and not really helped in this regard.

We are actually only 8th in the league in shots against (terrible stat I know) but have a .883 save percentage which is 3rd last in the league.

I think our records are actually identical after 20 or so games last season and this team did that with Kipper out and only one actual center.