[News] Baertschi assigned to Abbotsford. Backlund activated off IR

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

What's wrong with what Hartley said?
Man the knives are OUT right now aren't they?

I think that it's better to say nothing sometimes

[sa226]

Sounds good to me. The kid takes his career seriously.

He will do nothing less than work his butt off.

Off the top of my head the last young guy who was accused of putting too much pressure on himself was Iginla.

He turned out alright.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I think that it's better to say nothing sometimes

Baertschi feels he disappointed the fans. Hartley is conferring to the media that he did not let the team down.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

What's wrong with what Hartley said?
Man the knives are OUT right now aren't they?

As the head coach he's responsible for communicating with his players.

Hartley put the player in this situation.

Calgary played a game with a 5 minute major and a double minor and Baertschi didn't see a single second of icetime during those powerplays.

He's been grossly mismanaged by a coach with a reputation for being hard on young players in a season where the Flames are currently dead last in the whole conference.

Sure, it's a top down organizational problem, but unless Hartley has a mic in his ear from King telling him what line Combos to throw out, he's responsible for mismanaging one of 3 promising young players in the organization.

Amazing how the Flames started the season middle of the road in average age and are now the oldest team in the league again?

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Yeah, there's nothing wrong with what Hartley said.

I just feel pretty bad for Baertschi. I think a huge part of it is Flames fans putting a massive amount of pressure on him. I mean, let's face it. After last year's callup, we were all ridiculous excited to see what he could do for an encore.

He's 20 years old. There's no way he doesn't read the internet, newspapers, maybe even Calgarypuck.

I'm not saying the fans are wrong for getting excited about Baertschi, because hell, he's an exciting prospect, but I just think we may have set the bar a little too high for him this year.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

As the head coach he's responsible for communicating with his players.

Hartley put the player in this situation.

Calgary played a game with a 5 minute major and a double minor and Baertschi didn't see a single second of icetime during those powerplays.

He's been grossly mismanaged by a coach with a reputation for being hard on young players in a season where the Flames are currently dead last in the whole conference.

Sure, it's a top down organizational problem, but unless Hartley has a mic in his ear from King telling him what line Combos to throw out, he's responsible for mismanaging one of 3 promising young players in the organization.

Amazing how the Flames started the season middle of the road in average age and are now the oldest team in the league again?

I agree with you that Baertschi was handled very poorly by coaches and management, but talking to the media about this has no influence on that situation.

[Phanuthier]

What Hartley should have said : "Sven has been struggling a bit, every player goes through struggles at some point in their career. We sent him down to get some ice time and get his confidence up so he can play at the level everyone knows he can play at"

instead of "let down this, let down that"

Thats probably what people are criticizing Hartley for

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

As the head coach he's responsible for communicating with his players.

Hartley put the player in this situation.

Calgary played a game with a 5 minute major and a double minor and Baertschi didn't see a single second of icetime during those powerplays.

He's been grossly mismanaged by a coach with a reputation for being hard on young players in a season where the Flames are currently dead last in the whole conference.

Sure, it's a top down organizational problem, but unless Hartley has a mic in his ear from King telling him what line Combos to throw out, he's responsible for mismanaging one of 3 promising young players in the organization.

Amazing how the Flames started the season middle of the road in average age and are now the oldest team in the league again?

Fine. But even if that's true. What's wrong with what Hartley said?
Not sure how any of that answers that question.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

What Hartley should have said : "Sven has been struggling a bit, every player goes through struggles at some point in their career. We sent him down to get some ice time and get his confidence up so he can play at the level everyone knows he can play at"

instead of "let down this, let down that"

Thats probably what people are criticizing Hartley for

But he said none of that was true.
Seemed like it was a statement supporting Sven.

I think people are just looking for anything to jump on right now.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

What Hartley should have said : "Sven has been struggling a bit, every player goes through struggles at some point in their career. We sent him down to get some ice time and get his confidence up so he can play at the level everyone knows he can play at"

instead of "let down this, let down that"

Thats probably what people are criticizing Hartley for

Did you stop reading the quote halfway through?

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

But he said none of that was true.
Seemed like it was a statement supporting Sven.

I think people are just looking for anything to jump on right now.

Yes it was... just explaining why others have their pitchforks out.

FTR, I think it was the right move ... as for words, meh... actions speak louder then words. As I said in a earlier post, I hope when he comes back up, he gets more of an opportunity (PP time, top 6) - that is whats important to me.

[Tinordi]

If Brent said/did something like this this board would go Fukushima.

[sa226]

I think there is very little evidence to support him being mismanaged by the organization. Its a very subjective term

Young players need a bit of momentum to spring them into the NHL. Baertchi was coming off of a concussion prior to the season. I think his play was consistent with a player coming off of a concussion, ie: hesitant. Rookies can't be hesitant.

He did show flashes from time to time, but he also failed to impress in the opportunities he received.

He is a kid who has lost his confidence at a time when it should be his strongest asset.

The blood is certainly in the water with this franchise, but in my opinion the handling of Baertchi is the wrong topic to gnash your teeth about.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

As the head coach he's responsible for communicating with his players.

Hartley put the player in this situation.

Calgary played a game with a 5 minute major and a double minor and Baertschi didn't see a single second of icetime during those powerplays.

He's been grossly mismanaged by a coach with a reputation for being hard on young players in a season where the Flames are currently dead last in the whole conference.

Sure, it's a top down organizational problem, but unless Hartley has a mic in his ear from King telling him what line Combos to throw out, he's responsible for mismanaging one of 3 promising young players in the organization.

Amazing how the Flames started the season middle of the road in average age and are now the oldest team in the league again?

How are you coming to the conclusion that Sven has been grossly mismanaged? Pretty tough call to make from the stands, so I'm assuming you are making that call because you had Sven penicled in your top 6 at the begining of the year, and because he hasn't lived up to that billing you are dissapointed and have decided to blame the coach rather than the player.

Impossible to know for sure, but we do know, is Sven accomplished a lot last year in a 5 game call up, where he wasn't exactly given the most ice time or the best line mates if I recall correctly. This year he was given the same if not more of an opportunity to start, and he didn't come through. Again, tough to say but that doesn't seem like mismanagement to me, it seems like he didn't make the most of his opportunity. If this kid is going to be the player we all hope, he'll make himself stand out in limited ice and opportunity, just like he did last year. If he's gonna require top line minutes next to Iginla and Tanguay all year, that's not really saying much. He'll be fine, but he didn't meet expecations this year is far more likely than he was mismanaged.

Also, "hard on young players" doesn't equal "mismanaging young players". Kovy and Tangs both came through Hartley, they seem fine. I think it's been so long since we've seen a decent prospect around here that we get confused about one looks like, and we get so concerned about their feelings we want them treated like fragile children who can't handle a little adversity. If Sven is going to be good, he'll be able to handle some rough patches in his development and a coach that has high standards.

[SuperMatt18]

Yeah he was supporting Sven there...not sure what the backlash is.

Sven put too much pressure on himself this year and that is part of the problem. He was always squeezing the stick a little too tight from the start and once the struggles started, and then the injuries, you could tell his confidence was just shot.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by kehatch

That is scary. Hopefully he pulls it together and gets his confidence back. An injury right now could really derail his career. Lets hope he stays healthy and it starts going in.

being disappointed =/= a lack of confidence

In fact it sounds to me like he knows it will turn around for him and he just needs to keep it up. That does not sound like a lack of confidence.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Fine. But even if that's true. What's wrong with what Hartley said?
Not sure how any of that answers that question.

Well, he's copping to not communicating things effectively to Baertschi, for one.

If Baertschi is feeling down on himself for not competing effectively, then it's the coaches responsibility to make sure he knows what the coaches expect of him and whether he is living up to those expectations.

If he isn't, then he needs to be reminded and given an opportunity to redeem himself.

Through 10 games, he's played about 8 minutes on the powerplay. Through 19 games, Cervenka has played nearly 38. However, the worst part is his minutes are cobbled together, disjointed and lack continuity of linemates.

In a season where the team is competing for pride rather than success, it's the farkin' organization's job to put their young promising players in positions to succeed. A 5 minute major penalty up by a goal is the time to do that just as ONE example.

Kevin Dinenn did an interview about Huberdeau where he made a point of stating he does not remind Huberdeau after many mistakes because he knows the guy understands it and doesn't need the extra pressure. The team is putting him in a position to succeed, even though he's a much better candidate to be given a shorter leash to learn the two-way aspects of the game as a big-body two-way centre. Huberdeau averages more than 2 full minutes more per game on the powerplay.

Conversely, the Flames expect Sven to learn a grinder's game at the pro-level as an undersized rookie.

Sven is a powerplay player and the Flames refuse to give him the necessary experience to help him grow.

Now he's down in the minors feeling sorry for himself, surrounded by more than a couple of other guys who also don't feel like they got a fair shake from the organization, on the coaches call.

That's what's wrong with what he said.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Well, he's copping to not communicating things effectively to Baertschi, for one.

If Baertschi is feeling down on himself for not competing effectively, then it's the coaches responsibility to make sure he knows what the coaches expect of him and whether he is living up to those expectations.

If he isn't, then he needs to be reminded and given an opportunity to redeem himself.

Through 10 games, he's played about 8 minutes on the powerplay. Through 19 games, Cervenka has played nearly 38. However, the worst part is his minutes are cobbled together, disjointed and lack continuity of linemates.

In a season where the team is competing for pride rather than success, it's the farkin' organization's job to put their young promising players in positions to succeed. A 5 minute major penalty up by a goal is the time to do that just as ONE example.

Kevin Dinenn did an interview about Huberdeau where he made a point of stating he does not remind Huberdeau after many mistakes because he knows the guy understands it and doesn't need the extra pressure. The team is putting him in a position to succeed, even though he's a much better candidate to be given a shorter leash to learn the two-way aspects of the game as a big-body two-way centre. Huberdeau averages more than 2 full minutes more per game on the powerplay.

Conversely, the Flames expect Sven to learn a grinder's game at the pro-level as an undersized rookie.

Sven is a powerplay player and the Flames refuse to give him the necessary experience to help him grow.

Now he's down in the minors feeling sorry for himself, surrounded by more than a couple of other guys who also don't feel like they got a fair shake from the organization, on the coaches call.

That's what's wrong with what he said.

Lots of assumption in there. Perhaps one of his reasons to publicly say this is to communicate to Sven in a very clear manner that he hasn't disappointed anyone. Perhaps he's also told him that directly.

You are reading an awful lot into one quote.

[Flash Walken]

It's more of the same crap, Jiri.

Tinordi is 100 percent correct. If Brent had sent down Brodie last year and then offered the same explanation, this place and some posters in particular would've gone nuclear, and you could probably include me in that as well.

Edit

It's also pretty dismissive to say this is the reaction to the quote. It's a reaction after watching every game this year and seeing the mismanagement with my own eyes. The teams best prospect is, reportedly, feeling down on himself and lacking confidence after not being put in a position to succed and subsequently being relegated to the minors after making the team out of camp. The coach, in reaction to a question about the lack of confidence effectively says he's wrong. I'm not up in arms about that, but if that is the gist of what's being (mis)communicated to the player, then it's a problem.

Again, I'm not saying give icetime to players that aren't earning it, but if you're 13th in the west and are playing a team with porous defense, maybe throw the kid a bone the day the 20 year old from Europe's family flies in to watch him play professionally. Maybe that might do something for his confidence.

Instead, they threaten to scratch him, then barf him over the boards to play 4 minutes with a two or three guys who would struggle to score 15 goals in the AHL. He gets sent down and now sits in the lockeroom with more than a couple of other guys who also don't think they got a fair shake with the organization, while guys on the big club cash their nhl paycheques going through the motions on a cellar dweller?

"That's not the case."

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

It's more of the same crap, Jiri.

Tinordi is 100 percent correct. If Brent had sent down Brodie last year and then offered the same explanation, this place and some posters in particular would've gone nuclear, and you could probably include me in that as well.

Of course they would have. No doubt about that.

Doesn't make it right.