Quebec Riots start up again

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by jammies

The question is if their "entitlement" is reasonable. Maybe a couple classes in inductive logic would've helped you parse that argument.

Ohhh snap!

Well no, their entitlement is not reasonable...thought i was clear on that.

They already have the least expensive post-secondary education in Canada and rioting over a 70 dollar increase makes it beyond absurd.

Or is that " reductio ad absurdum ". I guess my "inductive logic" classes would help?

Either way...bottoms up!!

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Umm, I could be wrong be I think you mean if you did a study of police (and COs and anyone related) they'd tell you keeping drugs illegal is good because it keeps a lot of them employed. Junkies are gonna get high either way; some cops may no longer be employed if drugs became legal.

Either way works, every trade is convinced they are essential, the difference is only with education do we then ask the trade itself to do the research showing us how good they are, honestly I dispair of the field as I work with 'alternate kids' who will never make it to uni and so are completely ignored by the education industry, as are about 50 percent of all kids in high school.

Essentially we are putting every kid in the country through a system that works towards only one outcome deemed succesful, uni, that is inapplicable to the majority and plain impossible to a large minority of kids within it, on top of that the universities themselves are based on an reletively unchanged model from the 16th century that is inapplicable to much of what we want it to do.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Got to disagree profoundly here, the lesson we should learn is from Germany, half the kids that are at uni right now would be better off learning how to auto cad and tig weld, the money is not in science or math, it is in exploiting science or math and that requires trades and a manufacturing base.

We're not going to out-German the Germans in any reasonable amount of time. "Canadian-made" isn't exactly a byword for quality. On the other end, we aren't going to out-cheap the Chinese, either. So I'd say investing in manufacturing and trades is at least 40 years too late.

The biggest companies in the world are in computers, oil, and autos. The biggest growing of those, who mostly weren't even around 40 years ago, are in computers and related high-tech industries. That is where the opportunities for economic expansion are both highest and easiest to find.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Ohhh snap!

Well no, their entitlement is not reasonable...thought i was clear on that.

Your saying it doesn't make it so.

Originally Posted by transplant99

They already have the least expensive post-secondary education in Canada and rioting over a 70 dollar increase makes it beyond absurd.

You're either purposely being obtuse or are just unable to think outside your opinion. IF higher education should be free THEN any amount of tuition is not reasonable, AND raising that tuitiion is even more unreasonable, regardless of the amount.

It's arguable whether or not this is true, but characterizing the argument as closed by simply repeating yourself or making assertions doesn't advance your cause. Do you not see that someone with different premises than yours can come to a different conclusion without being "entitled"?

[Canehdianman]

Originally Posted by Makarov

Hooray for you?



Clearly you do not live in Quebec. Therefore, students protesting in Montreal have no impact your life in anyway. Quebec allocating its provincial budget one way or another does not impact your life in any meaningful way.

With all of this in mind, when you hope that people die in a fire, it makes you look like an ranting, frothing lunatic.

Clearly I don't live in Quebec, I lack the sense of entitlement and superiority required.

You, however, seem to have it down nicely. I suggest you move.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by peter12

So, what exactly are these magic returns from post-secondary education that jammies seems to think our future depends upon? What about large classes, grade inflation? Do you have any answers?

The direct link between education and prosperity has been shown by many studies, of which http://www.milkeninstitute.org/publi...395&cat=resrep is one example I found in all of 3 seconds of searching. Feel free to find studies showing the opposite or negligible effect.

As for your other questions: build more universities to help with large classes. I am unsure what grade inflation has to do with anything, perhaps you could be more specific?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by jammies

We're not going to out-German the Germans in any reasonable amount of time. "Canadian-made" isn't exactly a byword for quality. On the other end, we aren't going to out-cheap the Chinese, either. So I'd say investing in manufacturing and trades is at least 40 years too late.

The biggest companies in the world are in computers, oil, and autos. The biggest growing of those, who mostly weren't even around 40 years ago, are in computers and related high-tech industries. That is where the opportunities for economic expansion are both highest and easiest to find.

We aren't a byword for either, of the two, manufacturing and high tech one is steady and employs a crap load of well paid workers, the other is all market capitalisation with its actual production and related jobs being done in China

[peter12]

Originally Posted by jammies

We're not going to out-German the Germans in any reasonable amount of time. "Canadian-made" isn't exactly a byword for quality. On the other end, we aren't going to out-cheap the Chinese, either. So I'd say investing in manufacturing and trades is at least 40 years too late.

The biggest companies in the world are in computers, oil, and autos. The biggest growing of those, who mostly weren't even around 40 years ago, are in computers and related high-tech industries. That is where the opportunities for economic expansion are both highest and easiest to find.

Dude, you should manage all of the world's hedge funds.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by Canehdianman

Clearly I don't live in Quebec, I lack the sense of entitlement and superiority required.

So you show your lack of superior feeling by mentioning how Quebecers have negative characteristics to which you feel superior? Nice.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by peter12

Dude, you should manage all of the world's hedge funds.

You mean the hedge funds of which 88% underperform the market average? Yeah, I'd really be in tough there - it's something even a PolySci major could probably be at least average doing.

[MarchHare]

The biggest companies in the world are in computers, oil, and autos. The biggest growing of those, who mostly weren't even around 40 years ago, are in computers and related high-tech industries. That is where the opportunities for economic expansion are both highest and easiest to find.

Not everyone who works in the technology sector needs a university degree. In fact, most of the jobs don't require one. An aspiring young IT professional would be better served by a two-year program from SAIT (or similar) in which they earn a few Cisco, Microsoft, or *nix certifications than they would by completing a 4-year computer science degree. If they're sufficiently motivated and have access to a home lab environment, they don't even need post-secondary at all and could just buy a few books and train themselves.

Someone wanting to get into software development or hardware design would be well-advised to pursue a CS or EE degree, respectively, but those aren't the only possible technology jobs. Most technology careers don't require that level of higher education.

[crazy_eoj]

Originally Posted by jammies

So you show your lack of superior feeling by mentioning how Quebecers have negative characteristics to which you feel superior? Nice.

Pot?

[Red Slinger]

What an odd thread.

There are basically three arguments going on simultaneously:

1) The value of education
2) The supposed 'entitlement' culture of Quebec
3) The objective and practicality of civil disobedience

If nothing else it is outing the capitalist pigs and the commie scum and pitting them in a pitched battle based on ideas that were likely originally planted in their post-secondary educations.

I do wonder who is going to pay for the hospital bills for the protestor and cop that were injured. I also wonder who will pay for the damages to vehicles and property. Lastly, I wonder who will pay for the police resources used during this latest riot, which, I assume is probably close to about $70 per protestor, give or take. Fortunately for me, I don't live in Alberta anymore so these 'clean up' funds won't be coming from me (this time). I suspect that some of the protestors weren't students at all but rather "professionals" in the field of shat disturbing.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by crazy_eoj

Pot?

Yes please

[peter12]

Hey, why is jammies trying to take my job as resident snob around here? I've got at least 2 more years of schooling on him.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by jammies

I knew nobody would bother arguing that education is, in and of itself, a net benefit over its cost.

There's no need to argue that.

The reason that post-secondary should not be 100% subsidized is that surely some of that net benefit goes to the student (otherwise, there wouldn't be students), and therefore it makes sense that the student should pay part of the cost. Accessability can be acheived through loans.

[Canehdianman]

Originally Posted by jammies

So you show your lack of superior feeling by mentioning how Quebecers have negative characteristics to which you feel superior? Nice.

Not at all, I show my lack of superior feeling by not expecting everything to be handed to me on a silver platter and then having a temper tantrum like a petulant child when I find out that the platter is only plated silver instead of solid.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by Canehdianman

Not at all, I show my lack of superior feeling by not expecting everything to be handed to me on a silver platter and then having a temper tantrum like a petulant child when I find out that the platter is only plated silver instead of solid.

Oops, you did it again.

[Boxman]

General ideas:
- universities are a racket
- many graduates aren't useful and can't find work
- Quebecers are lazy thieves

Constructive ideas:
- abolish universities
- construct work camps
- send everyone who's claiming EI to camp, along with the protesters

In all seriousness - every civilized country educates their children. But if they're spending money un-educating people I can't stand for it. I'm in favor of everyone reading and writing, but beyond that you're on your own kiddo. Canada's a land of opportunity enough without my tax dollars being opportunities all on their own.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by Boxman

I'm in favor of everyone reading and writing, but beyond that you're on your own kiddo. Canada's a land of opportunity enough without my tax dollars being opportunities all on their own.

Fata me. I give up on this thread.