First nations will blockade roads as part of 'Idle No More' protest

[CaptainCrunch]

Of course the leaders want more money, its always about money, hopefully the government says that they'll work with them to I don't know properly spend what they get.

I can live with the resources on their land since stopping the exploitation of them is more harmful to those communities finacially.

More respect from the Feds, sure I have no problem with that, but with respect should come more attention from the Feds something that some of the dirtier chiefs like Spence wouldn't want.

I'm surprised at Atleo's stance and a little disappointed,

As for the thought that they can bring the economy to its knees, by stopping trains and traffic etc, if Idle No More radicalizes and goes from peace full protests to something worse then the RCMP and provincial police's policy of standing by and letting them protest will change.

I'm disgusted that any of Native leaders are standing behind Spence, with some reserves they have become the architects of destructive poverty.

[First Lady]

Wow... didn't think I would see this.....

https://twitter.com/WBrettWilson/sta...72827265015808

[DuffMan]

Sure, we'll give you more money, just show us proof of where all of the money we already give you goes.

[RubberDuck]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I'm surprised at Atleo's stance and a little disappointed

And I thought he was supposed to be a "moderate".

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Really? Outside of the Japanese during World War II, which group has seen the majority of discrimination, hate crimes, racist sentiment, etc., during the 20th and 21st century?

Doukhobors, German Canadians during WWII, Roma, Catholics.

[CaptainCrunch]

to me Atleo was the great hope for Native causes, he's a guy that's stressing education and accountability.

For him to get swept up in the way that he is dissapoints me a bit.

If there's going to be dialogue its going to have to be between moderates on both sides, not ranting and raving and demanding more money.

They can negotiate on the resources, the respect does to an extent at this point have to be earned on both sides.

But to throw your lot in with people like spence and to start parroting them is an approach that's going to turn off the average tax payers to their cries for help.

[ripTDR]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

Doukhobors, German Canadians during WWII, Roma, Catholics.

a little ot, but we were pretty bad to the jewish people in the second world war as well...

[killer_carlson]

This is what a complete lack of leadership amongst successive generations of first nation communities will lead to. Extortion, threats, blackmail and demands for moe handouts.

[1stLand]

Originally Posted by RubberDuck

"You cannot ignore what is happening with Idle No More... We will drive the final stake in the heart of colonialism and it will happen in this generation," Shawn Atleo told a separate news conference.

Native Canadian leaders say they want more federal money, a greater say over what happens to resources on their land and more respect from the federal Conservative government.

"These are demands, not requests," said Nepinak. "The Idle No More movement has the people - it has the people and the numbers - that can bring the Canadian economy to its knees."

"We have the warriors that are standing up now, that are willing to go that far. So we're not here to make requests, we're here to demand attention," he said.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/angry-canad...172701390.html

When are they going to realize that threats, blackmail, extortion, fraud etc. are not how you get people to support your cause?

This sounds like a Terrorist Threat. I am sorry, but if anyone else other than an Indian made this speech, CSIS would have treated it as a Terrorist Threat.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

Doukhobors, German Canadians during WWII, Roma, Catholics.

Chinese got it probably the worst, and are now one of the more successfully integrated ethnic groups in Canada.

In the case of aboriginals, this is not about racism, but about political and social institutions that benefit elites, and cripple reserves from obtaining real economic growth.

[Azure]

I honestly have no problem helping them out as long as they account for the money properly, and are able to show results.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Azure

I honestly have no problem helping them out as long as they account for the money properly, and are able to show results.

How about we just look at it as payment for goods received.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Azure

I honestly have no problem helping them out as long as they account for the money properly, and are able to show results.

The currant system of administering first nations through a balkanised series of bands each run by a small (often one or two families) ruling elite that are well paid to ensure the increasingly smaller number of 'status' members basically comply with our wishes vis a vis access to resources roads etc has been in our interest for a hundred years but is and will always be utterly unable to promote growth or change.

What we should do is either pay the individual band members their 'share' of what we now give to the bands, regardless of where they live, so that the band council has to ask its people for money like any other elected goverment, and has a vested interest in keeping people on the res.
As it stands right now it is in the band councils interest to push members off the res, they still get the same money but have to divide it less ways.

Alternatively we should go the other way and pay the money to an elected provincial native administration that would then have to provide services to all natives in the province, status or non status, I would also suggest that at both the national and provincial level a number of seats should be allocated to a province wide 'riding' that would elect a number of representatives who would be solely concerned with native issues and, in all likelyhood, would be natve themselves.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

The currant system of administering first nations through a balkanised series of bands each run by a small (often one or two families) ruling elite that are well paid to ensure the increasingly smaller number of 'status' members basically comply with our wishes vis a vis access to resources roads etc has been in our interest for a hundred years but is and will always be utterly unable to promote growth or change.

What we should do is either pay the individual band members their 'share' of what we now give to the bands, regardless of where they live, so that the band council has to ask its people for money like any other elected goverment, and has a vested interest in keeping people on the res.
As it stands right now it is in the band councils interest to push members off the res, they still get the same money but have to divide it less ways.

Alternatively we should go the other way and pay the money to an elected provincial native administration that would then have to provide services to all natives in the province, status or non status, I would also suggest that at both the national and provincial level a number of seats should be allocated to a province wide 'riding' that would elect a number of representatives who would be solely concerned with native issues and, in all likelyhood, would be natve themselves.

Or treat the band councils in the same way as municipalities and Provincial governments, have oversight rules in place and require proper financial reporting before they can get their next allotment of cash.

I also think that thier needs to be a native ethic committee and a whistle blowing program. When you hear stories of band councils withholding peoples welfare checks and other services is disgusting. Spence should have been reported a long time ago, but as a government they have too much power.

Realistically though, it seems like the First Nations think that Self Government means give us the money and don't interfere, while fault lies on both sides its clear that Self Governing without oversight is a failure and Indian Affairs needs to take a bigger role. Maybe an Auditor General needs to be put in place at the First Nations and an ethic commission with annual reports to the Canadian taxpayers and First Nations members.

Spence and a lot of other Chiefs and Councilors should be in jail, not marginalizing Idle no more.

If Spence is a government then she's failed to deliver on the social contract that she's obligated to stand by. Housing, proper medical and other services etc. In the same note the leadership at the FN assembly has also failed to deliver on that social contract as has to an extend the Federal Government.

The answer is not more money, you can't keep throwing money into a well if its not going to be used effectively. When your spending $7.9 billion dollars for a population of 1.1 million per year, there's a problem with disbursement not budget.

[Sr. Mints]

I didn't see this article posted, but among all the hunger strike distraction, I may have missed it.

It's a convincing piece, and I think it illustrates the harm Spence is doing to the credibility First Nations groups are trying to bring to the table.

Dear Canada: First Nations don't want to be wards of the state

I am the chief of the Whispering Pines/Clinton Indian Band. Our reserves are located near Kamloops and Clinton, B.C., and our community strongly supports the proposal for first nation property ownership legislation, a position which some in the Idle No More movement have criticized.

Since Confederation, Canada has faced two principal challenges as a nation – finding a place in the federation for Quebec and finding a place for us, the original inhabitants. Others can speak about the success of Quebec within Canada, but I think I can illustrate the failure to bring us fully into the federation.

(. . .)

Not owning our land has been an economic catastrophe. We have little of the equity in our homes that is needed to build wealth, gain access to credit and start businesses. We don’t have wealth to bequeath to the next generation so it can do better than us. We need the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and our band government to guarantee our mortgages.

We don’t want to be wards of the state. Dependency is not our way. More than 60 per cent of my community’s population is younger than 30. I am proud that many of our young adults are educated and employed. They want to stay, live and prosper in our community.

The proposed property ownership legislation is both first nation-led and optional. It will give us hope that we can own our lands collectively and exercise our jurisdictions forever. We can provide ownership to our members so their lands and homes are as valuable as any other in the region. We can register our title in a modern system instead of the costly and unreliable deeds system we currently have.

(. . .)

After 140 years of the Indian Act, we are ready to take on this responsibility. We will work with our first nation institutions to provide government that raises and maintains property values, builds equity in our homes and creates strong self-sufficient communities. I am confident that, with legislation affirming our jurisdiction, our land will forever remain ours, just like Ontario remains Ontario even if I, a resident of British Columbia, buy land there.

I am not talking about granting us special rights. We want the same property rights that all other Canadians take for granted. We want ownership of our lands and recognition of our governments. After 140 years, we want to be a true partner in the Canadian federation.

Full piece

On on hand, I read a piece like this and my sympathy and support falls back behind First Nations, and on the other hand Theresa Spence's very name graces my ears and I chuckle at what a clown she--someone who has become the face of all this--has become. That shouldn't be the focus here.

[CaptainCrunch]

But he is right and he is the anti-spence.

I think property ownership going forward is the key. First of all it breaks the power monopoly of the Band Councillers. They can no longer hang your housing over your head.

Second of all, it allows them to have ownership and with that collateral, its a right that should have been granted a long time ago.

[RubberDuck]

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/01...comes-to-them/

Harper has to come to them now. This is ridiculous.

[Minnie]

Yeah, it's time to just tell them to sod off.

[Resolute 14]

The only solution when dealing with an attention whore is to ignore them.

The PM should simply say, "I am prepared to meet whenever you get serious", and then just walk away until they do.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

But he is right and he is the anti-spence.

I think property ownership going forward is the key. First of all it breaks the power monopoly of the Band Councillers. They can no longer hang your housing over your head.

Second of all, it allows them to have ownership and with that collateral, its a right that should have been granted a long time ago.

I think they tried that in the US at one time. Some band members sold there land to non aboriginal farmers and the reserve started to erode away. So the government had to put a stop to it.

I do agree however. Let the band members use their land as collateral or sell it out right. The reserves will slowly disappear and they will be integrated into Canadian society.