2012/2013 English Premier League thread

[d_phaneuf]

I don't think he has been a malcontent at all, he signed a deal at Inter, they told him he wouldn't play unless he renegotiated to take less

he is injury prone, and the wage thing must have been dropped if the reports are true, there's no way Levy would break the wage structure for anyone

[d_phaneuf]

[GirlySports]

Never quite seen a game like this. Spurs on the road have gotten 13 corners in the first half.

Total domination but no goals.

[Locke]

I would never eat anything called a 'Pukka Pie.'

That sounds like what happens after eating a 'Pukka pie.'

It sounds revolting.

[Bagor]

I'm guessing Fergie might get a ban for educating Dean via hairdryer on the rules of the game. Horrible decision. If you're going to over-rule your linesman you better be sure you've got it right.

Oh, and yes .... Valencia should have been gone at the end

[d_phaneuf]

just saw the highlights

Fergie has to get a touchline ban for that, absolutely ridiculous

and Dean got the call right

[d_phaneuf]

A player is in an offside position if he is nearer to his opponents’ goal-line than the ball and the second last opponent (usually the last defender), unless he is in his own half. If the attacker is level, he is onside.
Most people also realise that a player cannot be offside from a goal kick, a throw-in or a corner, so now all we need to do is define when the offside position becomes an offence:
It is when, in the referee’s opinion, at the moment the ball is played or touches one of his team, a player is either interfering with play or an opponent, or gaining an advantage by being in that position.
The interpretation of those three points led to misunderstanding and inconsistent application and so the International FA Board made decisions which defined those criteria. They decreed that:
Interfering with play means playing or touching the ball passed or touched by a team-mate.
Interfering with an opponent means preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision or movements or making a gesture or movement which, in the opinion of the referee, deceives or distracts an opponent.
Gaining an advantage by being in that position means playing a ball that rebounds to him off a goal-post or the crossbar having been in an offside position or playing the ball that rebounds to him off an opponent having been in an offside position.
So, unless a player touches the ball he is not interfering with play. It’s that simple and whether referees or assistants agree with that definition is irrelevant, they have to apply the law. Moreover, whether you or managers or pundits like it, that is how FIFA insist the offside law is applied.

thats the rule

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

thats the rule

Except you bolded the wrong part.

Interfering with an opponent If an attacker interferes with an opponent by either preventing them from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent's line of vision or movements or making a gesture or movement which deceives or distracts an opponent, then they are offside.

Explain to me by the definition of the rule how Cisse tugging at Evans hand/arm whilst in an offside position is not a textbook example by the above definition, interference and therefore offside?

[d_phaneuf]

that's a foul though, and a weak one at that, if it's the other way and the Toon are given a Pelanty than Fergie is screaming bloody murder

If United fans want to complain about the foul that is fine, but it wasn't offside

[Bagor]

Regardless of whether it's a foul or not is not the point (for the record it's jostling). The point is he can't do that in an offside position because then he is considered by FIFA law to be interfering with an opponent.

If Cisse is not jostling with Evans I have no problem. But the law clearly states that:

Whilst in an offside position there are 3 things a player cannot do.
1. Interefere with play
2. Interfere with an opponent
3. Gain an advantage by being in the offside position

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afde...e_en_47383.pdf

Cisse clearly does #2 as defined in my earlier post. Doesn't have to be deemed a foul. He's jostling with Evans which at the very least is distracting and therefore is considered offside.

Graham Poll needs to re-read FIFA rules. It's not that simple as he says above. By the letter of the law, you CAN interfere WITHOUT touching the ball.
http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/worl...n_law11_en.pdf

Also, his article in the Mail today saying why Dean made the correct call shows a complete ignorance and lack of understanding towards the argument put forward by SAF. He makes zero effort to address the jostling with Evans. Whoosh!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...ffside-correct.

[GirlySports]

Even if he's not jostling, just by his mere presence he's 'distracting' the defender. Passive offside means you're not interfering with play and usually quite a few yards away from a defender.

If the linesman missed it then fine but there's no way a ref can overrule a linesman on something like that. I'm with Fergie.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

If United fans want to complain about the foul that is fine, but it wasn't offside

I didn't see a foul, but to me it was offside, without a doubt ... he didn't touch the ball, but in a case like that, you can't possibly argue that he didn't interfere the play. Dean overruling his assistant because of whatever was again an example of how bad English referees really are. I'm normally not a guy that complains a lot about referees, but the number of huge mistakes have been overwhelming this season.

Having said that, I'm pretty sure Fergie will receive a ban for that - and I don't have a problem with that. He deserves it.

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Regardless of whether it's a foul or not is not the point (for the record it's jostling). The point is he can't do that in an offside position because then he is considered by FIFA law to be interfering with an opponent.

If Cisse is not jostling with Evans I have no problem. But the law clearly states that:

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afde...e_en_47383.pdf

Cisse clearly does #2 as defined in my earlier post. Doesn't have to be deemed a foul. He's jostling with Evans which at the very least is distracting and therefore is considered offside.

Graham Poll needs to re-read FIFA rules. It's not that simple as he says above. By the letter of the law, you CAN interfere WITHOUT touching the ball.
http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/worl...n_law11_en.pdf

Also, his article in the Mail today saying why Dean made the correct call shows a complete ignorance and lack of understanding towards the argument put forward by SAF. He makes zero effort to address the jostling with Evans. Whoosh!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...ffside-correct.

He actually does address the jostling

For the goal to have been disallowed for offside, the Newcastle striker would have had to be deemed to be interfering with an opponent. This is nothing to do with affecting his positioning or making him play the ball. In this case it would have been standing in the line of vision between keeper David de Gea and the ball as Simpson crossed it.

I don't agree with the rule, but it is the rule and it was called correctly

[GirlySports]

I think he addresses it wrong.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

He actually does address the jostling

No he doesn't. He addresses Cisse's position in relation to the keeper and that's it. In fact he absolutely ignores that there is jostling. For whatever reason he only gives half the FIFA definition of interfering with an opponent.

He makes zero mention of Cisse tugging (i.e. "making a gesture or movement which deceives or distracts an opponent") Evans arm and being by by the letter of the law considered to be interfering with an opponent and by default therefore offside. That's the other half of the definition that Poll seems to have forgotten.

He's got this thing in his head that the only way you can interfere with an opponent is to block a goalies field of vision, and that's it. That's only half the definition of player interference.

Without doubt a blown call. Holy merde, Poll doesn't even address Fergie's argument ...... at all.

[d_phaneuf]

Fergie's argument was addressed on MOTD as "Evans was the one holding Cisse", which is possible, there's not an angle that shows who initiates contact

either way if that's a foul, or distracting an opponent, than Penalties need to be given on every corner, every single corner

[d_phaneuf]

new favorite twitter account

https://twitter.com/RAWK_Meltdown

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

either way if that's a foul, or distracting an opponent, than Penalties need to be given on every corner, every single corner

Why do you persist in continuing to confuse a foul within the game with interference by distracting or deceiving an opponent whilst offside. No-one has suggested that screening the goalie whilst onside is a foul. To simplify and clarify, there is nothing wrong with jostling whilst onside. You CANNOT do it in an offside position.

Anyways .... Shearer cleared the whole thing up as only Shearer can on MOTD.

"He is technically offside .....you could say he is interfering with play." Then goes on to say it was a good decision.

And Fergie argument was Cisse holding Evans.

But if you see it again, and the referee can't, the guy is in an offside position, then he pulls Evans' arm.'If that is not interfering what is?

Anyways regardless ..... As soon as Cisse made contact with Evans he became active in an offside position. Quite simple really.

[cam_wmh]

Awful blown call. The lesser thans love to cry foul, yet this is the second time in a week, a goal was waived in favor of the opponent and almost cost united the game.

Fergie won't be suspended for the same hairdryer treatment the F.A behind closed doors will be giving him. Cisse tugged on Evans, from an offside position.

Interfering with an opponent means preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s line of vision or movements or making a gesture or movement which, in the opinion of the referee, deceives or distracts an opponent.

Detailed in the rule above, he obstructed Evans movements. Linear logic here. None of this selective one portion of the rule, makes it valid like Dianne posted.

Dean won't ref til March.

Book it.

Originally Posted by Bagor

As soon as Cisse made contact with Evans he became
active in an offside position. Quite simple really.

Simple to some, rocket surgery to others.

[rubecube]

I think that Gareth Bale kid might be pretty good.