NFL player kills girlfriend then shoots himself in front of GM and coach

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Neurologists think CTE leads to violent behavior, but God forbid anyone on here think so...

I don't think anyone is saying that at all, it may well turn out he was hiding massive concussion symptoms from team doctors coach's etc but at this point we have a young man with, according to the team, little concussion history.

I am also very wary when a friend or family makes claims in situations like these as it is natural they would prefer there to be an external reason why their loved one gunned someone down, no one wants to think their son, friend or cousin is just a plain murderer.

It is entirely possible at his young age he may not have had any concussion problems but was just a young man unable to cope with his relationship breaking down, the sad reality of most pro sports players in the US is they sacrifice almost everything to reach the pros, including, all to often, healthy emotional growth.

[Brannigans Law]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Doctors can take their "science" and shove it. My neighbor got a concussion while playing hockey in junior, he has not killed anyone yet and is not violent to the best of my knowledge, therefore these neurologists (sounds like a fancy word for someone who does not know that which they speak of) are probably full of it.

Did you forget green text or is this the worst post in the thread by a country mile?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Doctors can take their "science" and shove it.

Signature worthy.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Doctors can take their "science" and shove it. My neighbor got a concussion while playing hockey in junior, he has not killed anyone yet and is not violent to the best of my knowledge, therefore these neurologists (sounds like a fancy word for someone who does not know that which they speak of) are probably full of it.

[EddyBeers]

Originally Posted by Brannigans Law

Did you forget green text or is this the worst post in the thread by a country mile?

I am personally on a jihad against green text, I think the dripping sarcasm speaks for itself, particularly in conjunction with my post right before that citing the fact that in 20 years we will look back and chuckle at people who think that head injuries do not have a direct relationship with violent behavior the same way that we chuckle at those who thought smoking did not cause lung cancer.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Doctors can take their "science" and shove it. My neighbor got a concussion while playing hockey in junior, he has not killed anyone yet and is not violent to the best of my knowledge, therefore these neurologists (sounds like a fancy word for someone who does not know that which they speak of) are probably full of it.

The funny part is that while this mocking is fitting if people were making that exact argument, it's just as fitting if you flip it back on people who are trying to immediately link this to head injuries despite there not being anything to substantiate that argument.

There are hundreds of causes of mental illness, there are many we know little about. There are many possible reasons for someone to take these actions, not all of them related to mental illness. And yet, because he played in the NFL, and despite having no known history of concussions, the immediate reaction from a lot of people seems to be that this is head injury related. It very well could be, but it could very well be hundreds of things, and the fact is that we will likely never know the answer. Saying that doesn't mean you don't believe that head injuries are linked to mental health issues, it means that you don't think that playing that card without anything more than a guess is a reasonable answer.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Guns do not kill people, people kill people.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Brannigans Law

Did you forget green text or is this the worst post in the thread by a country mile?

It was sarcasm, TylerSVT.

[Plett25]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Doctors can take their "science" and shove it

Originally Posted by Brannigans Law

Did you forget green text or is this the worst post in the thread by a country mile?

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

I think the dripping sarcasm speaks for itself

Even dripping sarcasm is indistinguishable from stupidity

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by AR_Six

... Seriously, is speculation everyone's hobby around here, or what?

CP's obsession with a tv-crime-drama theory after incidents like this is unsettling.

Many threads, including one about a woman murdered on a cruise ship a while ago, have my stomach churning from the morbid group-think engaged in.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I don't think anyone is saying that at all, it may well turn out he was hiding massive concussion symptoms from team doctors coach's etc but at this point we have a young man with, according to the team, little concussion history.

I am also very wary when a friend or family makes claims in situations like these as it is natural they would prefer there to be an external reason why their loved one gunned someone down, no one wants to think their son, friend or cousin is just a plain murderer.

It is entirely possible at his young age he may not have had any concussion problems but was just a young man unable to cope with his relationship breaking down, the sad reality of most pro sports players in the US is they sacrifice almost everything to reach the pros, including, all to often, healthy emotional growth.

Concussions aren't necessary for CTE. This unfortunate series of events IS multifactorial. No one said anything was certain except one poster said it had NOTHING to do with it.

It simply isn't very debatable that CTE is likely to increase violent behavior, or that Football players without history of concussions may very well develop CTE. Concussions are not the issue.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Concussions aren't necessary for CTE. This unfortunate series of events IS multifactorial. No one said anything was certain except one poster said it had NOTHING to do with it.

It simply isn't very debatable that CTE is likely to increase violent behavior, or that Football players without history of concussions may very well develop CTE. Concussions are not the issue.

At this stage, absent of any information what so ever, nothing is debatable, had some of the posters pondered 'I wonder if he was suffering from CTE or concussion?' I expect we would all have agreed this was a possability.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

At this stage, absent of any information what so ever, nothing is debatable, had some of the posters pondered 'I wonder if he was suffering from CTE or concussion?' I expect we would all have agreed this was a possability.

I think all most people were doing was saying it was a possibility or wondering aloud if it played a role. With what they've discovered about head trauma and deperession and voilent behavior, and the fact that he does what he does for a living, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if it played a role, but I'm also not definitly saying it did, just specualting. The same way a lot of guys in this thread are speculating that it likely didn't play a role.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

At this stage, absent of any information what so ever, nothing is debatable, had some of the posters pondered 'I wonder if he was suffering from CTE or concussion?' I expect we would all have agreed this was a possability.

So no one should ever ask or insinuate?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

So no one should ever ask or insinuate?

Insinuate after a girl has been shot dead? hell no, I aint cutting the sob any kind of slack until a doctor says it was a factor.

ask though, fair enough.

Take football, sports in general, out of the story, a guy guns down the mother of his kid, do we start by asking why he might not be a #######, perhaps he was hearing voices etc.

[jayswin]

I think we have to remember that this is a message board, it's for discussion. This is something that happened and people are speculating/wondering aloud about what may have happened.

I'm not sure what the issue is, as we would have to close most of the threads on CP if we weren't allowed to speculate. We're not the media, we're not people close to the case, we're not team officials or NFL players. We're a bunch of dudes on a random message board who log on to discuss things.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Iginla

Probably none.

Murder suicides happen all the time outside of the sports world.

This is the quote that most are responding too. It's on the opposite side of logic

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Insinuate after a girl has been shot dead? hell no, I aint cutting the sob any kind of slack until a doctor says it was a factor.

ask though, fair enough.

Oh ok, that's explains your posts a bit. You think that by insinuating that head trauma may have played a role, which there is a very good chance it did with what we know about the link between head trauma and depression/voilence, people are excusing it or cutting him slack.

To that, I'd say exactly what I said in my last post. No one is excusing it or cutting him slack, we're just speculating based on other incidents and the growing medical evidence in this area. So again, I would point out that we are just a bunch of dudes on a random message board and what we say has no bearing on anything.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by flameswin

I think we have to remember that this is a message board, it's for discussion. This is something that happened and people are speculating/wondering aloud about what may have happened.

I'm not sure what the issue is, as we would have to close most of the threads on CP if we weren't allowed to speculate. We're not the media, we're not people close to the case, we're not team officials or NFL players. We're a bunch of dudes on a random message board who log on to discuss things.

Fair enough. I havce nothing against speculation, what rubs me the wrong way is because it is a sports figure we treat this story differently from if some scum bag had shot his wife in any other circumstance, it is true of the media as well, there isn't the outrage you would expect if it was just some dude wasting a girl, no it is a double tragedy etc etc, we ask what could cause him to be so troubled and the like.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by flameswin

Oh ok, that's explains your posts a bit. You think that by insinuating that head trauma may have played a role, which there is a very good chance it did with what we know about the link between head trauma and depression/voilence, people are excusing it or cutting him slack.

To that, I'd say exactly what I said in my last post. No one is excusing it or cutting him slack, we're just speculating based on other incidents and the growing medical evidence in this area. So again, I would point out that we are just a bunch of dudes on a random message board and what we say has no bearing on anything.

I have to disagree, I think the whole tenor of this thread is very different than, say the Ryan Lane thread, no one over their is speculating as to what possible mitigating circumstance could there be for them killing Mr Lane