10-17-2012, 04:19 PM
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#41
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Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Crowsnest Pass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
I can't speak for very many countries but Canada doesn't get behind their athletes like other countries do.
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What is the basis for this opinion? Anecdotal? What is the attendance/ratings for sports other than soccer in European nations?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...sports_leagues
Let's look at Germany:
Ice Hockey - average attendance = 5,867
Handball = 4,543
Basketball = 3,813
Italy:
Basketball = 3,862
Volleyball = 2,512
Hockey = 632
Last edited by troutman; 10-17-2012 at 04:26 PM.
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10-17-2012, 04:21 PM
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#42
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#1 Goaltender
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Richmond, BC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
I wish the IBAF reported their demographics like the IIHF.
If one or two countries make up the vast majority of players, is it really a "global" sport?
I think a better measure would be how many countries are either baseball or Ice Hockey within the top 3 or 4 or 5 biggest sports.
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Baseball is a special case, because two of the top four countries in the world at the sport (Japan and Cuba) have their own extremely high level leagues. It's not like the KHL or the Elitserien either - these leagues are better.
In basketball it seems it's always USA. Best on best in baseball, tons of countries have a shot to win. Cuba, Japan, USA, Korea, Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Canada, Mexico, Puerto Rico. Hell, even Australia and the Netherlands have a shot.
Just an FYI, Canada is currently ranked 5th in the world, its highest ranking ever as far as I know.
Where is baseball a top sport (number 1 or close to it)? Cuba, Japan, USA, Korea, DR, Venezuela. USA is close I'd imagine, and I'm not entirely sure how soccer ranks in those countries, but baseball is certainly huge.
Where is hockey close to number one? Canada and maybe Finland.
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10-17-2012, 04:23 PM
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#43
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Spartanville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
Really, the only sports that have any sort of fan support outside of the olympics are Hockey and Football. If Canada is playing an important Hockey game or if international football existed, those would be the only sports where the country would "stop" to watch.
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I have no idea what your point is.
It seems like you want to make the argument that it isn't a sporting country by saying .... take away the 2 most supported sports and it isn't a sporting country.
Well do that for any country and you have the same argument.
e.g. England. Take away soccer and most people don't stop to watch the games. Sure they'll follow cricket and rugby results but as far as the country stopping to watch? No. So by your logic England isn't a sporting country.
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10-17-2012, 04:24 PM
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#44
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Calgary AB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frinkprof
What we have here is soccer fans saying that because Canada doesn't do well in international soccer events that this means it is not a sporting country. Again, what this means is that Canada is not a strong soccer nation, relatively. It is a strong sporting nation.
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I hate this attitude too. Personally I played hockey, baseball, and football growing up and have Flames and Stamps season tickets. I'm definately a 'sports' guy. However, when it comes to soccer I just don't have the time of day for it. Somehow the soccer lovers translate people like me as some sort of a 'problem' or as 'lacking passion' for sports. I would reckon that it's not that Canadians aren't passionate for sports but rather they aren't passionate for their sport. Which really isn't a problem worthy of national dialoge.
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10-17-2012, 04:25 PM
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#45
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In the Sin Bin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagor
e.g. England. Take away soccer and most people don't stop to watch the games. Sure they'll follow cricket and rugby results but as far as the country stopping to watch? No. So by your logic England isn't a sporting country.
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I garuntee you they support Cricket and Rugby and their individual stars in sports like Tennis and Cycling far more then Canadians support any other teams or athletes.
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10-17-2012, 04:29 PM
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#46
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Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Crowsnest Pass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
I garuntee you they support Cricket and Rugby and their individual stars in sports like Tennis and Cycling far more then Canadians support any other teams or athletes.
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You should start backing-up your opinions with some facts, because everything I have researched so far, shows you are wrong (see post #41).
Average attendance for CFL = 28,103
England Rugby Union = 12,925
Last edited by troutman; 10-17-2012 at 04:31 PM.
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10-17-2012, 04:31 PM
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#47
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by undercoverbrother
I have a bit of a passing interest in the sport.......
Show me how basketball is any different/more competative. The US wipes the floor with anyone they play in international play. Other than the US it is a crap shoot.
I would suggest the are extremely similair games.
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That's simply not true
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10-17-2012, 04:31 PM
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#48
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In the Sin Bin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by troutman
What is the basis for this opinion? Anecdotal? What is the attendance/ratings for sports other than soccer in European nations?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...sports_leagues
Let's look at Germany:
Ice Hockey - average attendance = 5,867
Handball = 4,543
Basketball = 3,813
Italy:
Basketball = 3,862
Volleyball = 2,512
Hockey = 632 |
Thats their average attendence for their domestic leagues.
Take a look at the World Championship attendence for Ice hockey:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._by_attendance
Canada isn't even #1.
It's hard for those domestic leagues to have big attendence #'s when they're not a top league.
Last edited by polak; 10-17-2012 at 04:34 PM.
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10-17-2012, 04:34 PM
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#49
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First Line Centre
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Alright polak, I think there would be a lot less confusion and arguing here if you just stated what your gripe is instead of asking a general question about the topic and then arguing with everybody that posts a response.
What is it exactly? What is your ideal situation for Canada with regards to sports? Also, where did the World Cup Qualification fit into all of this? How did it spur what seems to be dissatisfaction in this area for you?
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10-17-2012, 04:34 PM
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#50
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Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Crowsnest Pass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
Thats their average attendence for their domestic leagues.
Take a look at the World Championship attendence for Ice hockey:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._by_attendance
Canada isn't even #1.
It's hard for those domestic leagues to have big attendence #'s when they're not a top league. |
Lame argument. IIHF holds the tournament during the Stanley Cup playoffs.
If the tournament was held in Canada after the NHL season, you can bet average attendance would be 18,000+ in Canada.
Last edited by troutman; 10-17-2012 at 04:43 PM.
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10-17-2012, 04:37 PM
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#51
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
I garuntee you they support Cricket and Rugby and their individual stars in sports like Tennis and Cycling far more then Canadians support any other teams or athletes.
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The average attendance for the Twenty20 Cup, which is a form of cricket meant to be easy for spectators, was just under 7,000 in 2005 (the most recent number I could find). For the standard domestic league it was 3,215.
The average attendance for the Aviva Premiership was just under 13,000.
I think you may need to reform your argument.
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10-17-2012, 04:38 PM
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#52
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frinkprof
Alright polak, I think there would be a lot less confusion and arguing here if you just stated what your gripe is instead of asking a general question about the topic and then arguing with everybody that posts a response.
What is it exactly? What is your ideal situation for Canada with regards to sports? Also, where did the World Cup Qualification fit into all of this? How did it spur what seems to be dissatisfaction in this area for you?
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That's from me responding to posts slamming Canada in that thread
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10-17-2012, 04:44 PM
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#53
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valo403
That's from me responding to posts slamming Canada in that thread
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For a guy who visits of the best cities in the world and eats Sbarro and Papa John's Pizza, it seems like he embraces and seeks out the mediocre aspects of Canadian culture wherever he might go.
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10-17-2012, 04:48 PM
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#54
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In the Sin Bin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valo403
The average attendance for the Twenty20 Cup, which is a form of cricket meant to be easy for spectators, was just under 7,000 in 2005 (the most recent number I could find). For the standard domestic league it was 3,215.
The average attendance for the Aviva Premiership was just under 13,000.
I think you may need to reform your argument.
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England has never hosted the Rugby world cup (they will in 2015), but do you believe it will have worse attendence then France or Wales? Both of whom had +40,000 people on average per game.
Wimbledon draws hundreds of thousands of people for the week.
The Tour De France and Formula 1 are HUGE ratings draws in England ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012...r-de-france-tv, http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012...-grand-prix-4m)
I bet 90% of Canadians have no idea that a Canadian won the Giro D'Italia which is the same level as the tour.
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10-17-2012, 04:49 PM
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#55
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First Line Centre
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^Cool story.
Answer your own question since it seems you are dissatisfied with what everyone else has to say.
What does being a "sports" nation entail to you polak?
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10-17-2012, 04:57 PM
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#56
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Calgary
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IMO, it's not that Canada is lacking athlete's or people passionate about sports. It's that people are not willing to support it with government money, and there are not enough sponsorship dollars to go around. It takes money to properly train an athlete. Canadians will cheer their hearts out for their athletes, they just don't like financially backing them with their tax dollars.
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10-17-2012, 05:08 PM
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#57
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Scoring Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valo403
Outside of soccer find me a more global sport than basketball
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Golf
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10-17-2012, 05:14 PM
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#58
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Spartanville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
England has never hosted the Rugby world cup (they will in 2015), but do you believe it will have worse attendence then France or Wales? Both of whom had +40,000 people on average per game.
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That's an INTERNATIONAL tournament.
Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
Wimbledon draws hundreds of thousands of people for the week.
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The Stampede drew 1.4M.
Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
I bet 90% of Canadians have no idea that a Canadian won the Giro D'Italia which is the same level as the tour.
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And I can guarantee you 2 weeks before Bradley Wiggins was returning to Paris for their first tour winner in 70 odd years 95% of Brits wouldn't have known his name.
And please stop making stuff up to try and bolster your argument. No it's not. It's a tough race but nowhere near on the same level as the tour both in competitiveness or prestige. It's porbably best described as a warm up for the tour.
Let's cut to the chase Polak. I put it to you that Canada is x10 more of a sports country than your Poland. I couldn't name you one sport that Poland is good at.
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10-17-2012, 05:43 PM
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#59
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Lifetime Suspension
Join Date: Oct 2012
Exp: 
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Curling.
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10-17-2012, 06:43 PM
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#60
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polak
England has never hosted the Rugby world cup (they will in 2015), but do you believe it will have worse attendence then France or Wales? Both of whom had +40,000 people on average per game.
Wimbledon draws hundreds of thousands of people for the week.
The Tour De France and Formula 1 are HUGE ratings draws in England ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012...r-de-france-tv, http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012...-grand-prix-4m)
I bet 90% of Canadians have no idea that a Canadian won the Giro D'Italia which is the same level as the tour.
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Why are you referencing the world cup? How is that relevant? Should I reference the attendance at the Vancouver Olympics?
Now about that guarantee you made regarding cricket and rugby, how do you explain the 3,000 person attendance for their domestic league?
Btw, England hosted a number of the games at the 1999 World Cup, something you'd know if you had any interest in doing any research.
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