Calgary's $8 BILLION Transit Plan - The RouteAhead

[moncton golden flames]

i really hope the north crosstown brt goes all the way the childrens hospital and not terminate at the university. leaving a large employment hub and critical care facility off that route would be a large oversight, imo.

[Jimmy Stang]

Originally Posted by charper

Haha. I already did.

I tried to vote out the old dinosaur, I really did.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by charper

Haha. I already did.

Hope you run again!

[rayne008]

Originally Posted by Joborule

No doubt. Figure there would be some sort of crosstown BRT that'll connect you to the airport line.

EDIT: Woah, I just realized the timeline on the 8th Ave Subway. No way that is a realistic timeline. We need that tunnel now.

Serious question...

Why is the 8th Ave subway a requirement at all?
(other than mowing over people?)

Isn't the idea still to reduce DT vehicular traffic? Wouldn't $ be better spent on
building new lines into downtown?

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by rayne008

Serious question...

Why is the 8th Ave subway a requirement at all?
(other than mowing over people?)

Isn't the idea still to reduce DT vehicular traffic? Wouldn't $ be better spent on
building new lines into downtown?

I think the biggest hinderance to increasing the capcity of existing C-Train lines during rush hour (after the move to 4 cars) is how slow the trains take to get into and out of downtown with so many level crossings. Making it a subway downtown would probably allow for more trains at peak hours. If you've spent any time at a train station downtown between 4:30-5:30, you'd figure it would be hard to add any additional trains due to all the crossings.

[HELPNEEDED]

Originally Posted by rayne008

Serious question...

Why is the 8th Ave subway a requirement at all?
(other than mowing over people?)

Isn't the idea still to reduce DT vehicular traffic? Wouldn't $ be better spent on
building new lines into downtown?

It is building of a new line

[Knalus]

Bunk: did you remove the timeline on purpose? cause I can't see it anymore.

Another question: the SELRT/North line are planned to be linked, correct? up 3rd st? Would that potentially be a subway, or a level crossing? With the short N/S blocks, I would think this route would be best done with a subway, no?

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by Knalus

Bunk: did you remove the timeline on purpose? cause I can't see it anymore.

Another question: the SELRT/North line are planned to be linked, correct? up 3rd st? Would that potentially be a subway, or a level crossing? With the short N/S blocks, I would think this route would be best done with a subway, no?

No, it's something wrong with my photobucket - in theory it's still there and shows up (for me) after a minute or so). hmmm.

2nd street SW is the planned N-S route downtown (yes, underground) for the SELRT - anticipated to connect, if feasible, to a NCLRT that would run either Centre Street (likely in my view) or Edmonton Trail.

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by moncton golden flames

i really hope the north crosstown brt goes all the way the childrens hospital and not terminate at the university. leaving a large employment hub and critical care facility off that route would be a large oversight, imo.

The "West campus route" is meant to solve that problem with one technology or another. The Crosstown itself might not circulate throughout the campus/hospitals (the road pattern is really inefficient), but there will be some form of Rapid Transit connecting people to those institutions.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by rayne008

Serious question...

Why is the 8th Ave subway a requirement at all?
(other than mowing over people?)

Isn't the idea still to reduce DT vehicular traffic? Wouldn't $ be better spent on
building new lines into downtown?

Right now, two lines share the 7th Ave right of way. Right now, adding more trains along the line during rush hour is pretty much impossible, due to the lights, and the places where the lines split apart at either end of downtown.

As many know, the South line is very full. It's likely that the city's coming move to 4 car trains instead of three car trains will barely change the situation on the south line. The additional capacity may be all used immediately. After that, there is nothing the city can do other than add more trains, but adding trains is functionally impossible due to the 7th Ave bottleneck. The 8th Ave Subway moves the NW-S line off of 7th Ave, meaning that there no longer is any interlocking with another line, as the NE-W line would remain on 7th Ave, and almost all of the level crossings with cars would be gone (It's likely that at least 1 might stay at 4th Ave). Functionally, you can probably run three times as many NW-S trains at that point. Also, the city could run a little more than twice as many NE-W trains along 7th Ave.

If we combine going to 4 cars, with the ability to run twice as many trains (just for simple math), each line would have a capacity 266% of what the capacity is right now.

Also, the city is planning to build more lines into downtown. The SE-NC line will have a completely new right of way through downtown - also a subway - under 2nd St West and 10th Ave.

At some point in the distant future, a subway under 7th Ave may be required for the NE-W line.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

At some point in the distant future, a subway under 7th Ave may be required for the NE-W line.

I can't even being to imagine the pain that building that would cause.

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by FireFly

God forbid you live in the NW and want to get to the airport easily... WTF?

There will be ways to get from NW calgary to the airport. It may require a connection, but there will always be the BRT or LRT connecting from the North Central line. Keep in mind also that this map represents rapid transit routes - there may be other bus routes, including frequent "Primary Transit" routes that connect to the airport. There likely will never be demand for, say a Crowfoot direct to Airport Rapid Transit line.

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

So what do you think is the NCLRT going up Centre street or in the valley with stations near nobody?

It's extremely unlikely that the City will return to the Nose Creek alignment. Transit's latest study and public consultation pretty much confirmed it will be either Centre Street or Edmonton Trail.

Which should it be?

In my view it would be very difficult, if not impossible, to connect the SELRT to NCLRT on an Edmonton Trail alignment - it's too far east of 2nd Street where the SELRT will run through downtown. Assuming Centre street - there's the difficult question of vertical alignment - underground (for a segment), at grade (modern-dedicated ROW - not 36th), or above grade (SkyTrain style)?

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Rathji

I can't even being to imagine the pain that building that would cause.

To do it the cheapest way, likely a period of two years without downtown service on the NE-W line.

You could MAYBE shorten that period to 6 months to a year by constructing/engineering differently. This would certainly be quite a bit costlier.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by rayne008

Serious question...

Why is the 8th Ave subway a requirement at all?
(other than mowing over people?)

Isn't the idea still to reduce DT vehicular traffic? Wouldn't $ be better spent on
building new lines into downtown?

The bums need a warm place to live in the winter and a place to urinate since they can no longer do it at the SAIT parkade.

I miss that smell of urine in the mornings.

[goodyear]

Just a question regarding the the C-train in the downtown:

Is it possible to create underpasses (similar to those underneath the CP line downtown) to 7th Avenue? That way, the transit corridor can flow through without lights?

I know the disadvantage is that there are a lot road crossings starting from 8 St W all the way to the other side of downtown. But would this still be a more cost effective alternative to the subway?


I like both the RouteAhead and TransitCamp plans...and I think these new plans would work great if Calgary has the pouplation density to support these networks.

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by Bunk

It's extremely unlikely that the City will return to the Nose Creek alignment. Transit's latest study and public consultation pretty much confirmed it will be either Centre Street or Edmonton Trail.

Which should it be?

In my view it would be very difficult, if not impossible, to connect the SELRT to NCLRT on an Edmonton Trail alignment - it's too far east of 2nd Street where the SELRT will run through downtown. Assuming Centre street - there's the difficult question of vertical alignment - underground (for a segment), at grade (modern-dedicated ROW - not 36th), or above grade (SkyTrain style)?

I think going up Centre, above ground only seems affordable option. There are a ton of slumlord duplex's and eye sore co-op housing they could buy without a problem for space.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by goodyear

Just a question regarding the the C-train in the downtown:

Is it possible to create underpasses (similar to those underneath the CP line downtown) to 7th Avenue? That way, the transit corridor can flow through without lights?

I know the disadvantage is that there are a lot road crossings starting from 8 St W all the way to the other side of downtown. But would this still be a more cost effective alternative to the subway?

Possible yes, but it would probably cost more than tunnelling the whole thing. And if not more, very close to the same amount, with more cons and less pros.

[Tron_fdc]

That's a nice plan, but it seems to me all that City Hall has done is connect existing neighbourhoods. What about the outlyers and future growth?

In 30 years Okotoks will be a part of the city (likely High River as well) and people are going to be complaining about connecting those, wondering why it wasn't discussed 30 years ago.

[Rathji]

No way that we expand to Okotoks in 30 years. I think you are really underestimating how far away it is.