Lance Armstrong to be charged with doping?

[Nyah]

"If I thought for one moment that by participating in USADA’s process, I could confront these allegations in a fair setting and – once and for all – put these charges to rest, I would jump at the chance," said Armstrong. "But I refuse to participate in a process that is so one-sided and unfair. Regardless of what Travis Tygart says, there is zero physical evidence to support his outlandish and heinous claims. The only physical evidence here is the hundreds of controls I have passed with flying colors. I made myself available around the clock and around the world. In-competition. Out of competition. Blood. Urine. Whatever they asked for I provided. What is the point of all this testing if, in the end, USADA will not stand by it?"

Link: http://lancearmstrong.com/news-event...august-23-2012

[afc wimbledon]

there has never been a clean winner of the tour, I dont doubt Wiggins is dirty in some way, in the years Armstrong won I doubt there was a single rider that wasn't dirty in the whole race, the attempt to 'clean up' what has been a heavily drug using sport throughout its history is a pathetic waste of time.
Armstrong did no more than compete with his peers on an even playing field in a sport governed by an organisation that knew and coluded with the teams to keep things quiet and totally drugged.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Nyah

"If I thought for one moment that by participating in USADA’s process, I could confront these allegations in a fair setting and – once and for all – put these charges to rest, I would jump at the chance," said Armstrong. "But I refuse to participate in a process that is so one-sided and unfair. Regardless of what Travis Tygart says, there is zero physical evidence to support his outlandish and heinous claims. The only physical evidence here is the hundreds of controls I have passed with flying colors. I made myself available around the clock and around the world. In-competition. Out of competition. Blood. Urine. Whatever they asked for I provided. What is the point of all this testing if, in the end, USADA will not stand by it?"

Link: http://lancearmstrong.com/news-event...august-23-2012

I assume that the courts of law that have thrown out his claims were also in on some sort of campaign to ruin in him

[Nyah]

Originally Posted by valo403

I assume that the courts of law that have thrown out his claims were also in on some sort of campaign to ruin in him

What claims were thrown out? I thought he chose to drop his defense? Are you talking about a different case he was involved in?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Nyah

What claims were thrown out? I thought he chose to drop his defense? Are you talking about a different case he was involved in?

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/OtherSport.../19966951.html

A federal judge swiftly dismissed a lawsuit on Monday that retired cycling champ Lance Armstrong had filed in a bid to stop the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency from proceeding with a case charging him with using drugs during the years he won the Tour de France.

[Nyah]

In a statement issued Monday, the USADA said Armstrong’s lawsuit is “without merit” and that USADA rules “provide full constitutional due process designed to protect the rights of clean athletes and the integrity of the sport.”

Armstrong’s attorneys contend that he has “passed every drug test ever administered to him in his career - a total of 500 to 600 tests... more drug tests than any athlete in history.”

I think it would be pretty intersting to see the evidence against him. Are they able to release it even though a trial won't take place?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Nyah

I think it would be pretty intersting to see the evidence against him. Are they able to release it even though a trial won't take place?

See post # 50.

[Azure]

Lance tested clean in every single drug test, save for one. Therefore there is no legit evidence to say that he was doping.

If the equipment wasn't good enough to test for the complex doping methods athletes were using....well, whose fault is that?

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by Azure

If the equipment wasn't good enough to test for the complex doping methods athletes were using....well, whose fault is that?

You're joking here, right?

[chemgear]

Originally Posted by Azure

If the equipment wasn't good enough to test for the complex doping methods athletes were using....well, whose fault is that?

Whaaaa?

[Azure]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

You're joking here, right?

It means that even though there has been a way to test for EPO since 2002, some people still argue that it isn't consistent, which is why there is a lot of speculation and rumor about athletes getting away with doping.

Which creates a problem because athletes like Lance Armstrong and others have been testing clean for years, and people just automatically assume that he's only testing clean because the tests aren't good enough. Well whose fault is that? Should we automatically assume anyone is doping because they're good at their sport because 'rumor' has it the test methods aren't good enough?

I find it mind-boggling that any doping agency can basically go after someone long enough until they quit fighting back, and then just strip them of all their accomplishments despite the person in question never ONCE failing a drug test.

A lot of the problem with the MLB and players doping has been ridiculous doping standards that the MLB never bothered to enforce. Sosa and McGuire? It was obvious to lots that they were doping, but the MLB turned a blind eye because of the attention they got. Well whose fault is that?

If the MLB would properly invest time and money into a proper doping policy, and educate the players about it....and then actually enforce it, why would anyone dope? But like cycling, players probably know they can cheat the tests(rumors)...so they are inclined to dope.

[joe_mullen]

Originally Posted by Azure

If the MLB would properly invest time and money into a proper doping policy, and educate the players about it....and then actually enforce it, why would anyone dope? But like cycling, players probably know they can cheat the tests(rumors)...so they are inclined to dope.

why would anyone dope?! because of the tremendous gain that is available from doping. time has proven that if given the possibility of improved performance, a significant proportion of athletes will take whatever steps are necessary, including doping. furthermore, there have been numerous surveys and studies on this subject that show the same. to think otherwise is completely naive.

[Azure]

But BALCO also demonstrated another truth to the anti-doping agencies: In BALCO, a track coach anonymously sent a syringe containing the tweaked drug to doping authorities. Suddenly, finding snitches, sometimes by pressuring athletes, became an obsession for the drug cops. They also have moved aggressively into investigations à la Law and Order. When they think they’ve got the goods, whether there’s a positive test or not, they charge an athlete. If the charges stick — and they almost always do because the system favors the agencies — the athlete is hit with a “non-analytical positive.”

Marion Jones never failed a test. But she was declared to have a non-analytical positive. Her titles were taken away, and she was banned from track and field for life.

The United Kingdom’s anti-doping agency is now led by a former cop. Australia’s is part of the government, with government investigatory powers. (It once demanded athletes’ private medical records.) The U.S. Anti-Doping Agency is a nonprofit business, so it can’t issue subpoenas. But it has managed to harness the government’s power by helping instigate criminal probes like the two-year grand jury investigation of Armstrong mounted by the Los Angeles U.S. Attorney’s office.

Faced with threats of perjury, former teammates caved. Tyler Hamilton (who had passed many doping tests before failing one at the end of his career), Floyd Landis and others reportedly testified. They admitted they’d been doping all along. The U.S. attorney ultimately declined to press charges, but USADA took the evidence and issued its own charges. Because the standard in these cases is merely “comfortable satisfaction,” not “beyond reasonable doubt,” there was no reasonable doubt that Armstrong was doomed.

Last night, when Armstrong said, Roberto Duran-like, “no mas,” the doping cops were free to declare a non-analytical positive. All those tests over all those years meant nothing.

http://www.wired.com/playbook/2012/0...g-allegations/

Sounds extremely clear cut.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by joe_mullen

why would anyone dope?! because of the tremendous gain that is available from doping. time has proven that if given the possibility of improved performance, a significant proportion of athletes will take whatever steps are necessary, including doping. furthermore, there have been numerous surveys and studies on this subject that show the same. to think otherwise is completely naive.

The point was that if the MLB had a strict set of standards and tests they enforced, together with the 50 game suspension, or perhaps 100 games, chances are players wouldn't dope.....because the risk isn't worth it.

As for performance gain for baseball players, I don't agree that it makes much of a difference. Out of the thousands of top players in the game, how many were caught doping?

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Azure

The point was that if the MLB had a strict set of standards and tests they enforced, together with the 50 game suspension, or perhaps 100 games, chances are players wouldn't dope.....because the risk isn't worth it.

As for performance gain for baseball players, I don't agree that it makes much of a difference. Out of the thousands of top players in the game, how many were caught doping?

In baseball in 2003 104 platers tested positive in the anonymous test. That is knowing that they were going to be tested well in advance so you can assume that under reports tbe actual amount. That is about 7.5% of players failing a non random test.

Also track homeruns by year and watch the numbers drop off

[Azure]

And minor league players test positive all the time as well and get banned for 50 games.

That wasn't the question.

I asked how many 'top' players in the past 20 years have been caught doping. If the supposed benefit to baseball players is so great, why don't more 'top' players get caught?

[SportsJunky]

Wasn't last year's NL mvp caught? What about this year's All Star game mvp? He was just caught too. I have no point. Those are the first two that came to mind.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Wasn't last year's NL mvp caught? What about this year's All Star game mvp? He was just caught too. I have no point. Those are the first two that came to mind.

The case against Ryan Braun was overturned because his testosterone levels were high due to taking medication for a personal medical issue.

The 2nd test he took showed normal levels.

He never tested positive for any steroid use. His testosterone levels were high, and the MLB automatically assumed he had to be doping.

Melky being suspended is one player. I'm talking about over the past 20 years, all the top players in the game, how many have been caught juicing?

[CalgaryFan1988]

This sums up my thoughts

http://www.thebearrocks.com/Bestofth....aspx?PID=1674

(click on the audio of Lance Armstrong "yap")

[metallicat]

Originally Posted by Azure

The case against Ryan Braun was overturned because his testosterone levels were high due to taking medication for a personal medical issue.

The 2nd test he took showed normal levels.

He never tested positive for any steroid use. His testosterone levels were high, and the MLB automatically assumed he had to be doping.

Melky being suspended is one player. I'm talking about over the past 20 years, all the top players in the game, how many have been caught juicing?

Quite a few, no?

A-Rod, Palmeiro, Bonds, Sosa, Clemens, Pettite...just off the top of my head. All pretty much top players. Unless I'm missing your point?