Obligation to prune Trees?

[Ducay]

Thanks for all the help.
What frink/Rathji said essentially mirrors what I thought before posting.

a) He has the right to trim up to the line (as his property extends from top of soil to space I believe), but if he kills my tree he is liable.
b) I have to ensure my tree isn't a danger.


The gentleman in question is a ~90 year old retired farmer who spends his days building various things out of 2x4s. That said, he sure as shoot won't be trimming any of the branches himself (see size below), my concern is if he gets Joe Blow Kijiji Inc. to come and they irreperably damage my tree. (Sure I could sue him, but odds of collecting (and doing so before....the inevitable) are low.)

His daughter runs a small dayhome out of the house and claims because of that, they arn't allowed to have branches over the property, which is why they want the branch trimmed. Given it sounds marginally like a legit excuse (never heard of such a thing before but I digress), is the reason why I was willing to trim the tree at all (and again, offered to pay for half).


Bonus Pic; as you can see its a huge tree (compare it to the scale of the standard size fence)

[Table 5]

That's a nice looking tree.

I guess I'm ignorant on the matter, but does it really take $500 dollars to saw that branch off? Maybe I'm not seeing the full extent of the branch, but it seems like something that would be possible to do yourself if you had a ladder and wood saw.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Just don't let it fall on the fence.

[Ducay]

Originally Posted by Table 5

That's a nice looking tree.

I guess I'm ignorant on the matter, but does it really take $500 dollars to saw that branch off? Maybe I'm not seeing the full extent of the branch, but it seems like something that would be possible to do yourself if you had a ladder and wood saw.

Thats essentially the thing. I have a stretch ladder that could get up there and a handsaw that could cut it; but what happens when it falls? Its quite a large branch and would take out the fence for sure if it fell straight down. I also have no way of disposing of a metric tonne of poplar scrap. I'd say $4-500 is a reasonable price given it would take a crew of 3 a couple hours to take it down in manageable pieces and then haul it to the front to be chipped.

I figured if we split the bill, it would be $250 each, and everyone could go on their merry way....but no, that would be too simple.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by Table 5

That's a nice looking tree.
I guess I'm ignorant on the matter, but does it really take $500 dollars to saw that branch off? Maybe I'm not seeing the full extent of the branch, but it seems like something that would be possible to do yourself if you had a ladder and wood saw.

Make sure to capture that on film: Save $500 cutting branch yourself and then pay $1000 for new fence! Plus kill neighbor at same time!

If you really don't know what you are doing, hire a pro, especially for heavy loads like this.

Oh yeah, pics of daughter.

[GreatWhiteEbola]

Originally Posted by Nage Waza

Oh yeah, pics of daughter.

If her dad is 90, I don't think pics would be recommended.

[Ducay]

Originally Posted by GreatWhiteEbola

If her dad is 90, I don't think pics would be recommended.

This.

Really silly situation. Oh wells, thanks to CP to ensuring Im not in the legal wrong. I figure if I can get a quote thats cheaper, I might just pay it and get it over with. We'll see though, if not, tough tits for grandpa.

Oh, and anyone heard of this dayhome rule that you can't have trees over your yard? All the "Alberta Dayhome standards" mention is a secure outdoor play area is required, as is safe. I mean surely, all trees cannot be evil, this isn't Cranston afterall.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Ducay

Thats essentially the thing. I have a stretch ladder that could get up there and a handsaw that could cut it; but what happens when it falls? Its quite a large branch and would take out the fence for sure if it fell straight down. I also have no way of disposing of a metric tonne of poplar scrap. I'd say $4-500 is a reasonable price given it would take a crew of 3 a couple hours to take it down in manageable pieces and then haul it to the front to be chipped.

I figured if we split the bill, it would be $250 each, and everyone could go on their merry way....but no, that would be too simple.

$250 sounds reasonable to have someone else do it....$500 definitely gets into territory where I'd rather put up with the hassle.

Definitely think you'd have to cut it in pieces, not in one shot. Start on his side of the fence to make sure it clears the fence, and work your way inward. We've trimmed (admittedly smaller) trees than this in my parents yard, and it wasn't too hard.

Btw, if you have a fireplace, you can use the scrap wood.

[Knalus]

If you do want to cut down the branch yourself, throw a rope over a higher branch, then tie the rope to the offending branch. When you cut it, keep the rope taut to keep it from falling, then lower it to the ground.

Once it's on the ground, it's easy.

Of course, if you don't feel comfortable, that's something else. But for almost a grand? That is worth considering if it's possible.

[VO #23]

I think he would have a hard time proving an unreasonable use/enjoyment of the property using the current test for private nuisance in Canadian tort law. "Unreasonable" is a fact-driven assessment, and the act would: a) not be tolerated by ordinary occupier; b) materially interfere with ordinary comfort; c) be unreasonable in light of all the circumstances. To defend against this, you'd want to demonstrate that your use of the land is reasonable.

If the branch does in fact interfere with the day home license that could be a pretty big issue, but I don't know if that's the case here. I think this guy would have difficulty proving all this on a balance of probabilities.

[GP_Matt]

Two things to consider. The first is that it is a poplar tree. They seem to die from the inside out. The tree can look extremely healthy with no outward signs that several of the limbs are rotting on the inside. This means that the branches could fall off in a wind storm even though it is full of green leaves. From my understanding they start to die after thirty to forty years so you may have an issue there. We cut down a ton of trees at work and poplars have a tendency to break off limbs as they start to fall. Also, I would be pretty reluctant to limb a large tree if you don't know what you are doing. Those branches can have a ton of pressure built up in them.

The other point is that if your neighbor gives you too much grief you can complain about the traffic from the day home, especially if it isn't registered. If it is, you likely signed off on their plan.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Canada 02

somehow I doubt home owners own the air space over their property. It seems excessive to have to cut down trees or branches that are not contacting your neighbors home, or in danger of causing damage to the home. Also, if the branch is significantly out of arms reach, it shouldn't need to be cut down either.

This is just my opinion, based on the bylaws governing trees that extend over city property, streets or sidewalks

Way back in school I remember learning about land rights. I should probably know this already but there was something my prof referred to as the "heaven to hell" concept and alluded to mineral vs. surface title. We'll see how good my poor man's memory is but I recall surface ownership including the air rights... I will see if I can find specifics tomorrow in my old binder, I very well might be out to lunch here as I don't really deal with surface rights ever. But I think you might have a right to the "air" space in theory...

As to the OP, I had a similar situation with my neighbour who seems like he is older than dirt. Who asked me 2 or 3 times last summer to take out some plants bordering his property, reason providing that the roots were going to damage his pipes. Eventually I complied after about the 3rd request.

These were weeds. I wasn't really sure either way, I wasn't really thrilled to do the work, I wasn't too excited or happy to do any of it (in fact I got my bro to help cut them down haha).

He didn't offer to pay, help, do anything. He just demanded I did it, but he was decent enough in asking, and he's a couple days from his death bed. So I just did it and spent a bunch of time cutting everything down and taking it to the dump, etc etc. It took time and money.

My point, more or less, and I'm not saying this to be a jackass and I don't think any worse of you at all and 100% understand where you are coming from- but my point is that sometimes it's just good to do nice things for people even if it's outside of your normal courtesy limits. Particularly for an elder gentleman. If $500 makes or breaks you, no worries I get it. But at the same time, it might not kill you to just do it for the guy. I'm honestly not judging, just sayin.

[saskflames69]

What does operating a daycare out of one's home have to do with not being able to have branches hanging over the yard of the said home?

The daycare I attended (it was ~9 years ago, so shut up!) was operated out of a private residence and had this sweet tire swing hanging from one of the branches of a huge tree that was in the next yard over. She seemed to be okay with the branch hanging over her yard, and they allowed her to hang a tire swing from it. Everybody was happy.

If my babysitter could hang a tire swing from a tree branch that wasn't her's, and those things can be dangerous, believe me, then your neighbor's daughter shouldn't complain.

Besides, she has all those kids sitting around the house. When the leaves begin to fall, she has unlimited access to free child labor! My babysitter made me rake leaves more than once..

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Way back in school I remember learning about land rights. I should probably know this already but there was something my prof referred to as the "heaven to hell" concept and alluded to mineral vs. surface title. We'll see how good my poor man's memory is but I recall surface ownership including the air rights... I will see if I can find specifics tomorrow in my old binder, I very well might be out to lunch here as I don't really deal with surface rights ever. But I think you might have a right to the "air" space in theory...

http://www.servicealberta.ca/589.cfm

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

http://www.servicealberta.ca/589.cfm

victory

[Buff]

I have a neighbour along the back fence (no back lane) and he has a tree in his yard that is only about two feet from the fence. I'm willing to bet that the tree existed well before his house was even built, which would have to be 15-20 years ago.

That tree has several branches extending over into my back yard. Some even come over top of my deck, and one just barely extends over my roof. I do have concerns that the tree is going to fall or have some branches break in a heavy spring snow storm or during very heavy winds... I do live in Lethbridge afterall. However, that tree gives my back yard some very nice shade from the sun and it also helps to shelter us from some of the wind. My only complaint is that it has a massive caterpillar infection, so last spring and this past spring I wasn't able to enjoy my backyard without killing hundreds of caterpillars.

My wife saw him in the backyard one day so she talked to him about it and he actually had looked into getting it pruned, but it was going to cost nearly $2000. We agreed that it was too much to bother with, but he did tell us to prune any branches we want, and spray the tree from our side to take care of any caterpillars or other infestations, and you know what? We were fine with that because we received benefits from his tree. Your neighbour is merely a jerk.

Now, I am still concerned about a spring snow storm breaking some branches... well, not anymore because I'm moving next week.

[Daradon]

There's plenty of reasons why a neighbor might want you to cut your tree if it's infringing on their property. Perhaps leaves, needles, or bark are clogging their cutters (it is taller than their house/garage. Perhaps they don't want to pick up the leaves/needles/pine cones on their yard. Perhaps it's blocking a view, or sunshine. As many people have mentioned maybe he is worried about damage should there be a storm or the tree gets sick.

Refusing to take care of your own tree sounds kinda irresponsible IMO. Sure it may be a nice tree and some people might like it, but some people just might not. As its on his yard at that point I think the responsible thing to do would be to accommodate his wishes or find a solution you both can agree on.

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by Daradon

There's plenty of reasons why a neighbor might want you to cut your tree if it's infringing on their property. Perhaps leaves, needles, or bark are clogging their cutters (it is taller than their house/garage. Perhaps they don't want to pick up the leaves/needles/pine cones on their yard. Perhaps it's blocking a view, or sunshine. As many people have mentioned maybe he is worried about damage should there be a storm or the tree gets sick.

Refusing to take care of your own tree sounds kinda irresponsible IMO. Sure it may be a nice tree and some people might like it, but some people just might not. As its on his yard at that point I think the responsible thing to do would be to accommodate his wishes or find a solution you both can agree on.

I'll have to point-form this one.

- The law sees that needles, leaves, bark, cones, fruit, etc. will fall where they may from trees (however consistently in quantity and ground area for any given tree), and that they become the property and responsibility of whoever holds title to the surface they land upon.

- You don't own a view nor have a right to a corridor through which the rays of sunlight must be able to pass unimpeded.

- The care the tree owner is responsible for goes only as far as keeping the tree healthy and alive and preventing reasonably foreseeable (given the health of the tree) damage to adjacent properties and residents.

- The tree is not on his yard, its limbs are over his yard. As society has been presented with these situations over the decades and centuries, the law has adapted to a position that is reasonable for the parties involved, which sees that there is an important difference between the two.

[Ducay]

We'll have to see how this plays out. The more I think about it, he moved in less than a year ago knowing full well there was a giant tree. Makes me less thrilled about spending hundreds of dollars to appease him.


Oh, and he's off to the races this morning; cutting down a 10ft blue cedar-like tree along the fence. Who hates trees this much?

[TheGrimm]

Originally Posted by Ducay

We'll have to see how this plays out. The more I think about it, he moved in less than a year ago knowing full well there was a giant tree. Makes me less thrilled about spending hundreds of dollars to appease him.


Oh, and he's off to the races this morning; cutting down a 10ft blue cedar-like tree along the fence. Who hates trees this much?

Farmers. He needs that area to herd the children around the yard.