Penn State football officials implicated in covering up on campus child rape by coach

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Are you kiddng?

I think they, rightfully, will get absolutely smoked by the NCAA. We may not see them in a bowl game or on TV for a decade, and will probably see them lose half their scholarship abilities for the next 3 years or so.

The NCAA simply cant come across looking weak on this thing just because its PSU.

It was sort of a joke but not really. Miami has done crazy things but get away with it. FSU was busted with a whole book scandal but got away with it. The NCAA wont hammer those who will make them money. I'm surprised that USC got what little they got. Hell OSU should of been in deep trouble but got off easy, basically giving them a 2 year bowl ban while they rebuild a little. Meyer was cheating before he was even "hired" by contacting potential recruits, he wasn't allowed to be at bowl practice but was, the NCAA allowed the school that they just put on sanctions to have 2 coaching staffs during bowl prep so they can continue to recruit while they were bowl prepping. The NCAA has no teeth, I believe PSU should be shut down for a few years and deserve it for covering up a child rapist but I wouldn't be surprised if it were just a slap on the hands.

[dirk diggler]

its really too bad Paterno died, he needed to be here to address this.. he is a senile old joke who should have gone to prison with his boy Sandusky...

[Senator Clay Davis]

Some will say these aren't harsh enough, but short of the death penalty it really can't be much harsher. Normally I find vacated wins to be a silly penalty, but in this case since it strips Paterno of the record, I think it's actually a fitting punishment.

Four year postseason ban
10 initial scholarship losses and 20 per year for four years
$60 million fine
All wins from 1998-2011 vacated
Five year probationary period

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-...69--ncaaf.html

I also now think the bar is set for whatever Miami is going to get. I could see them getting something similar (save the fine)

[Montana Moe]

The feeding frenzy for current players being allowed free transfers should be fun to watch. I'm glad they're being allowed to do so.

[Table 5]

Wow, that's quite the punishment. That should gut their football program for a good decade I would think? What star high school player is going to want to play there knowing they can never even make the post season? It's going to take a few years to recover from that, that's for sure.

[jammies]

I guess the NCAA agreed with those of us who thought that the football program should be harshly punished for the actions of the individuals involved, and not those who argued that the crimes had nothing to do with the program. Good.

[GirlySports]

In 2010, Penn State and Ohio State played a game which both teams had to vacate. If a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to hear it....

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by dirk diggler

its really too bad Paterno died, he needed to be here to address this.. he is a senile old joke who should have gone to prison with his boy Sandusky...

That is the only unfortunate part of this punishment. Paterno should have lived long enough to see how he helped destroy Penn State football.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by jammies

I guess the NCAA agreed with those of us who thought that the football program should be harshly punished for the actions of the individuals involved, and not those who argued that the crimes had nothing to do with the program. Good.

What's good about it? Does banning Penn St. players from playing in bowl games and being competitive provide any justice or solace to the people affected by Sandusky & the cover-up?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Penn St. cleaned house of everyone remotely involved with the cover-up? What exactly does killing the football program for their replacements achieve?

I agree with the fines, but killing the football program isn't any measure of justice on anyone who's in the wrong - it's a symbolic action that shifts the focus on football instead of the real criminals.

[Spuds_Buckley]

Originally Posted by JayP

What's good about it? Does banning Penn St. players from playing in bowl games and being competitive provide any justice or solace to the people affected by Sandusky & the cover-up?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Penn St. cleaned house of everyone remotely involved with the cover-up? What exactly does killing the football program for their replacements achieve?

I agree with the fines, but killing the football program isn't any measure of justice on anyone who's in the wrong - it's a symbolic action that shifts the focus on football instead of the real criminals.

It sends a strong message to other schools that they will be made accountable for their actions off the field.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by Spuds_Buckley

It sends a strong message to other schools that they will be made accountable for their actions off the field.

From Mark Emmert himself:

"We don't see this opening a Pandora's box at all. This was a very distinct and very unique set of circumstances."

To me, that clearly says that this isn't the NCAA drawing the line in the sand and taking a hard line on PSU to scare other programs into complying.

Here's the key quote from Emmert:

"While there's been much speculation about whether this fits this specific bylaw or that specific bylaw, it certainly hits the fundamental values of what athletics are supposed to be doing in the context of higher education."

Anyone who follows the NCAA closely knows this is complete BS. Apparently the precedent is set for the NCAA to come down hard on all non-football related scandals. To me, this just smells of well-timed PR that isn't going to be backed up the next time a big academic scandal comes up.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by JayP

Anyone who follows the NCAA closely knows this is complete BS. Apparently the precedent is set for the NCAA to come down hard on all non-football related scandals. To me, this just smells of well-timed PR that isn't going to be backed up the next time a big academic scandal comes up.

Maybe the NCAA is actually going to change its ways. Maybe there were discussions internally and they realized that putting the needs of athletics above everything else isn't right. Or it could be all just politics and optics, but you can't say for certain that's so until we see how future scandals are handled.

As far as what it accomplishes, if it encourages transparency - even to a small degree - in other programs where inappropriate conduct is exposed rather than covered up, it will be a success.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by jammies

Maybe the NCAA is actually going to change its ways. Maybe there were discussions internally and they realized that putting the needs of athletics above everything else isn't right. Or it could be all just politics and optics, but you can't say for certain that's so until we see how future scandals are handled.

As far as what it accomplishes, if it encourages transparency - even to a small degree - in other programs where inappropriate conduct is exposed rather than covered up, it will be a success.

20 years ago the NCAA had a major re-structuring in response to the SMU death penalty. Nothing changed. The NCAA tells us over and over that it's about more than just sports, but their actions have been the exact opposite until now. I guess you can't say for certain, but it's not in the NCAA's history to just change it's ways.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by JayP

Anyone who follows the NCAA closely knows this is complete BS. Apparently the precedent is set for the NCAA to come down hard on all non-football related scandals. To me, this just smells of well-timed PR that isn't going to be backed up the next time a big academic scandal comes up.

It is rather difficult to fathom how one could think that the football program covering up the child rape orchestrated by a football coach is a non-football related scandal.

The football program is the heart of Penn State, and the privledged position the football program enjoyed in that school is precisely why Sandusky got away with it for so long. It is this very attitude that enables the abusers. Everything the school did to protect Sandusky at the expense of his victims was done to protect the football program. It is only fitting that that very malevolence is what destroyed Penn State football in the end.

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

It is rather difficult to fathom how one could think that the football program covering up the child rape orchestrated by a football coach is a non-football related scandal.

The football program is the heart of Penn State, and the privledged position the football program enjoyed in that school is precisely why Sandusky got away with it for so long. It is this very attitude that enables the abusers. Everything the school did to protect Sandusky at the expense of his victims was done to protect the football program. It is only fitting that that very malevolence is what destroyed Penn State football in the end.

It is a football related scandal but the NCAA has no business getting involved in this sort of thing. Its mandate isn't to judge criminal behaviour, it's to maintain fairness in athletic programs and enforce NCAA rules. Persecuting those involved should have been left to the courts.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

It is rather difficult to fathom how one could think that the football program covering up the child rape orchestrated by a football coach is a non-football related scandal.

Who else in the football program aside from Paterno knew about the cover-up? It was a Penn St. cover-up - not a football program cover-up. Pretty big difference there. A football cover-up basically insinuates that staff, coaches, players, etc. all knew what was happening and all the evidence points that it was just the AD, Paterno, and university high-ups.

The football program is the heart of Penn State, and the privledged position the football program enjoyed in that school is precisely why Sandusky got away with it for so long. It is this very attitude that enables the abusers. Everything the school did to protect Sandusky at the expense of his victims was done to protect the football program. It is only fitting that that very malevolence is what destroyed Penn State football in the end.

And, again, what does this achieve? Why does an athletic governing body make a football team lose games make a university cover-up any better? The university and football program have cleaned house of everyone involved and yet the NCAA comes in on it's white-horse and stomps on all the people who had nothing to do with the cover-up.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by wpgflamesfan

It is a football related scandal but the NCAA has no business getting involved in this sort of thing. Its mandate isn't to judge criminal behaviour, it's to maintain fairness in athletic programs and enforce NCAA rules. Persecuting those involved should have been left to the courts.

One could argue that the NCAA is setting a precedent to prevent future abuses by coaches or other athletic officials. Paterno's legacy is ruined forever. If other coaches don't want to suffer the same fate, maybe they'll blow the whistle next time instead of covering up for a child-rapist in the interest of winning more football games.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by wpgflamesfan

It is a football related scandal but the NCAA has no business getting involved in this sort of thing. Its mandate isn't to judge criminal behaviour, it's to maintain fairness in athletic programs and enforce NCAA rules. Persecuting those involved should have been left to the courts.

Why does the NCAA have no business getting involved in a football related scandal?

PSU is heavily dependent on their football program. It brings them huge amounts of money, free advertising, prestige etc. With the NCAA punishing the University for putting football above the well being of children the NCAA is showing them that football is not the be all end all. I often hear that football is like a religion in these places, well it looks like some of the coaches took that a bit too literally and thought they were Catholic Priests for a second (or a few decades).

Lots of people who had nothing to do with the scandal are going to be hurt by this but you know who they should blame? The university for thinking that football is more important that outing a pedophile, not the NCAA for punishing the university.

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

One could argue that the NCAA is setting a precedent to prevent future abuses by coaches or other athletic officials. Paterno's legacy is ruined forever. If other coaches don't want to suffer the same fate, maybe they'll blow the whistle next time instead of covering up for a child-rapist in the interest of winning more football games.

This isn't really something that needs a precedent to prevent future abuses as it's against the law to begin with. In cases like SMU/USC/etc you do need some sort of precedent to prevent future abuses since what they're doing isn't illegal and won't put you in jail.

I'd argue if being charged with a crime and possible jail time aren't already detering this behaviour then nothing the NCAA hands down will do anything to further prevent this.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Why does the NCAA have no business getting involved in a football related scandal?

Because it broke none of the NCAA's rules. What does an athletic governing body have business involved in a child abuse scandal?

PSU is heavily dependent on their football program. It brings them huge amounts of money, free advertising, prestige etc. With the NCAA punishing the University for putting football above the well being of children the NCAA is showing them that football is not the be all end all. I often hear that football is like a religion in these places, well it looks like some of the coaches took that a bit too literally and thought they were Catholic Priests for a second (or a few decades)

Lots of people who had nothing to do with the scandal are going to be hurt by this but you know who they should blame? The university for thinking that football is more important that outing a pedophile, not the NCAA for punishing the university.

The university is not an entity that can think. When you say "the university" you really mean the people in charge - "the chancellor/the president/etc." - all of which are long dismissed and are going to trial for perjury. Now there's new, hopefully more reputable people in charge and what exactly does punishing them achieve?