Edmonton child found in locked car on hot day

[Table 5]

I was talking about child seats with my mom the other day, and I asked her what type they had when we were babies (since I don't ever remember being in one). She just laughed and said "Oh we didnt have them back then. We just laid you down in the back seat".

I'm pretty sure they didn't even have seat-belts in the back at the time (this was Europe in the early 80's though, maybe it was different here), as I remember always remember wandering around as a toddler back there. I also remember taking naps spread out on the back floor, while my brother was taking a nap on benchseat itself.

Funny how what we deem irresponsible now, was pretty normal back in the day. Not saying that I was ever left in a hot car though....

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Funny how what we deem irresponsible now, was pretty normal back in the day. Not saying that I was ever left in a hot car though....

We also used to drill holes in peoples heads as a medical proceedure at one time. Let's not change this into a "good old days" discussion.

[La Flames Fan]

Originally Posted by fotze

Perhaps the kid was being a dick and deserved this. And yes, some kids do deserve this, and more. Perhaps he was like my kid who has taken to saying the phrase 'fataing a$%hole' lately.

Well, at least he's not lying...

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

We also used to drill holes in peoples heads as a medical proceedure at one time. Let's not change this into a "good old days" discussion.

Where exactly did i say that it was any better? I'm all for car seats.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Where exactly did i say that it was any better? I'm all for car seats.

Fair enough, I took it as implied, that was wrong.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by Table 5

I was talking about child seats with my mom the other day, and I asked her what type they had when we were babies (since I don't ever remember being in one). She just laughed and said "Oh we didnt have them back then. We just laid you down in the back seat".

I'm pretty sure they didn't even have seat-belts in the back at the time (this was Europe in the early 80's though, maybe it was different here), as I remember always remember wandering around as a toddler back there. I also remember taking naps spread out on the back floor, while my brother was taking a nap on benchseat itself.

Funny how what we deem irresponsible now, was pretty normal back in the day. Not saying that I was ever left in a hot car though....

My mom kept us in a laundry basket in the front seat.

As a young child I remember standing on the backseat as we drove down Deerfoot.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Rathji

My mom kept us in a laundry basket in the front seat.

As a young child I remember standing on the backseat as we drove down Deerfoot.

Hmm, a baby roll-cage. Safe, performance-oriented, and yet so affordable.

[Byrns]

To the people downplaying this "mistake"... From today's news.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...70072920120710

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by fotze

In the good ole days, no one took things as implied. There was a heightened respect back in those days.

back in the old days an appology was respected and the matter was dropped.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Daradon

Dude... wha?

If the kid is unconscious the damage is probably already done. Especially to a child as opposed to an adult.

You've been watching to many action movies where people wake up from being unconscious with just a headache. In real life there are significant risks to any event like that.

Perhaps you'd just wait until the kid was panicking and banging on the glass?

It's a window man. Wow.

What I meant was if I saw a kid left in a car who was sleeping I would probably bang on the window. If the kid wakes up I wouldn't smash the window unless the child was in distress. I think you can tell if a child is in distress or just waiting for his parents to get back.

Smashing the car window at that time was not neccessary.

And I think as pointed out in the above story where the child ties, the time was 3 pm, it was an infant, and was 100 F and in the sun. These factors all make a huge difference between what is gross negligence and what is taking a slightly greater risk than most parents would take. Now these factors don't report well in the media so the story becomes, Man saves kid locked in hot car.

[4X4]

In the good old days, CC and pylon would have come into this thread and told us about the good old days.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by GGG

What I meant was if I saw a kid left in a car who was sleeping I would probably bang on the window. If the kid wakes up I wouldn't smash the window unless the child was in distress. I think you can tell if a child is in distress or just waiting for his parents to get back.

Smashing the car window at that time was not neccessary.

And I think as pointed out in the above story where the child ties, the time was 3 pm, it was an infant, and was 100 F and in the sun. These factors all make a huge difference between what is gross negligence and what is taking a slightly greater risk than most parents would take. Now these factors don't report well in the media so the story becomes, Man saves kid locked in hot car.

You can spin it all you want. Fact is the child is your responsibility. If you take in the car to the store, bring the child into the store with you. Simple as that. It's called being a parent.

Children should not be left alone in vehicles.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Table 5

I was talking about child seats with my mom the other day, and I asked her what type they had when we were babies (since I don't ever remember being in one). She just laughed and said "Oh we didnt have them back then. We just laid you down in the back seat".

Car seats are orthodoxy, but that doesn't necessarily make them more effective than seatbelts. Just because people perceive their chidlren to be safer doesn't make them actually safer.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2005/07/...vs-seat-belts/

[Knalus]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Car seats are orthodoxy, but that doesn't necessarily make them more effective than seatbelts. Just because people perceive their chidlren to be safer doesn't make them actually safer.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2005/07/...vs-seat-belts/

I like that word, Orthodoxy. It seems to describe very well the attitude of many on here who "know" what they are talking about.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Car seats are orthodoxy, but that doesn't necessarily make them more effective than seatbelts. Just because people perceive their chidlren to be safer doesn't make them actually safer.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2005/07/...vs-seat-belts/

The link in the article to the orignal paper does not work. Do you have a link for that?

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Car seats are orthodoxy, but that doesn't necessarily make them more effective than seatbelts. Just because people perceive their chidlren to be safer doesn't make them actually safer.

http://www.freakonomics.com/2005/07/...vs-seat-belts/

Now, that article only talks of " the death rates or incapacitating injuries for children in car seats versus children using adult seat belts", does not talk about minor injuries. Are these injuries not relevant to the discussion?

I was in an accident a couple month ago. Everyone who was in car seats had no injury, everyone who was not in car seats was injured.

I had a car of mine written off (I was not in it), rolled 6 times across the Trans Canada and landed in the meridian. Everyone who was in car seats was fine, everyone who was in seat belts sustained fairly major injuries.

I do realize this in ancodental, but a perfect example of situations where that 'study' would have found car seats to have worked just as well as seatbelts, since none of the people were killed or incapacitated.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

The link in the article to the orignal paper does not work. Do you have a link for that?

Try: http://pricetheory.uchicago.edu/levi...s_farsdata.pdf

and

http://www.mit.edu/~jjdoyle/doyle_levitt_ei_aug2008.pdf

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Rathji

Now, that article only talks of " the death rates or incapacitating injuries for children in car seats versus children using adult seat belts", does not talk about minor injuries. Are these injuries not relevant to the discussion?

I was in an accident a couple month ago. Everyone who was in car seats had no injury, everyone who was not in car seats was injured.

I had a car of mine written off (I was not in it), rolled 6 times across the Trans Canada and landed in the meridian. Everyone who was in car seats was fine, everyone who was in seat belts sustained fairly major injuries.

I do realize this in ancodental, but a perfect example of situations where that 'study' would have found car seats to have worked just as well as seatbelts, since none of the people were killed or incapacitated.

The difference in minor injuries in his data set wasn't statistically significant between seat belts and car seats.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Knalus

I like that word, Orthodoxy. It seems to describe very well the attitude of many on here who "know" what they are talking about.

It definitely annoys me when people act like their way is the only way to correctly do things, with absolutely no evidence.

I'd be interested to know what percentage of the people who would be horrified by someone not having a car seat have their car seat installed incorrectly.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

It definitely annoys me when people act like their way is the only way to correctly do things, with absolutely no evidence.

I'd be interested to know what percentage of the people who would be horrified by someone not having a car seat have their car seat installed incorrectly.

If I had to guess without going over to win a million bucks, I would be picking 90%.

To put this in perspective, I have always consider our car seats to be installed correctly. We did some pre-natal training where they explained it all and another related training afterwards. In addition, our car seats and their installation are inspected yearly by Child and Family Services.

My wife went through a 'car seat' check last year. We failed, IIRC badly on one seat, and minor issues with the other 2. According to the cop, almost everyone who was pulled over (and had car seats) also failed. As an alternative to do paying the fine, she went through some car seat training at the Children's Hospital, where she saw many of her friends from the community who hit the same check stop.

Despite being fairly confident in our use of the car seats, and my complete OCD nature when it comes to this stuff especially since we have Child Services inspect them yearly, she learned a ton about car seats that day. Stuff that was never mentioned in the training we have both been in, or stuff we obviously completely misunderstood.

tl;dr You probably are not using your car seat correctly.