Toronto Raptors 2011/2012 Season

[moon]

Originally Posted by fleury

Nash is a bum. I'm not overreacting at all. He had the chance to be a legend in Toronto, but instead goes to a stacked team to "win", just the way Bosh and Lebron did. I say it's a tainted win when they do get it. Granted we don't know the inside story of how this transpired, but the fact is the Raptors ponied up the cash, he led them on, and they got played by one of their own. Bum(mer).

First of all unlikely the Lakers win as they are at the very best the 3rd best team in the league and pretty old even going into next year.

Second how did Nash lead the Raptors on? I didn't see any reports where it said he was coming to TO. In fact every report said he was always considering multiple teams. The Nash to TO "certainty" was created by fans and TO media.

Finally, he is a jerk for wanting to go to a contending team but would have been cool to go for the big bucks that TO was offering instead? Good for him for doing what LeBron and Bosh did. They did the right thing and it worked out perfectly for them.

I understand that fans may be disappointed but Nash did nothing wrong and made the right decision. Him going to Toronto makes sense for Canadian basketball fans but doesn't make much sense for him as a basketball player and competitor.

[calumniate]

Originally Posted by fleury

Nash is a bum. I'm not overreacting at all. He had the chance to be a legend in Toronto, but instead goes to a stacked team to "win", just the way Bosh and Lebron did. I say it's a tainted win when they do get it. Granted we don't know the inside story of how this transpired, but the fact is the Raptors ponied up the cash, he led them on, and they got played by one of their own. Bum(mer).

How would he become a legend in TO? Just like Bosh did? Bosh had enough, and I don't blame him.

[flames_1987]

Don't often agree with Moon but he's right. The only thing Lebron did wrong was the stupid Decison and Chris Bosh tweeting like a 6 year old. They made it easy to hate them. But they all played out their contracts and signed with a team.

The one thing I hate is that this will bring up that awful argument that athletes don't want to play in Toronto. No....athletes don't want to play for bad teams. Chris Bosh stays if the Raptors had given him anything resembling talent around him. The athletes who have played in Toronto love it here and players will still play in this city. It's a pretty tough sell for Steve Nash to come to Toronto and play in what could be an incredibly tough division, with almost no shot at a title. Steve Nash battled every year for Phoenix and put his heart and soul on the line for that team. He didn't turn his free agency into a big thing, he signed on to be the GM of Canada basketball and it sounds like a big part of signing with the Lakers was to be close to his children. Steve Nash deserves no blame or hate for what he did.

I'm still a huge Raptors fan and even more so now that I live in Toronto. I'll support them and still think they can make the playoffs next year. I don't see why in the world they are still actively pursuing a point guard with Bayless and Calderon.

[flames_1987]

Originally Posted by calumniate

How would he become a legend in TO? Just like Bosh did? Bosh had enough, and I don't blame him.

Chris Bosh couldn't lead the Raptors to one playoff series win. Had Nash got the Raptors past the first round, e would've been immortalized. Just playing here, he would've been. He knew that, and talked about it in interviews. The best Canadian player of all time, playing in Canada. Who knows what would have happened if they had a better team around him to offer him to play with.

[flames_1987]

"He was either going to go to NY or Toronto," Duffy said. "He was comfortable with either situation." (then LA came)

Yahoo Sports NBA. Pretty much the best basketball source out there.

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by flames_1987

I'm still a huge Raptors fan and even more so now that I live in Toronto. I'll support them and still think they can make the playoffs next year. I don't see why in the world they are still actively pursuing a point guard with Bayless and Calderon.

Alright, I may be overreacting, but I did read an article (maybe on TSN), before the FA period began, which Nash specifically made it clear Toronto was an intriguing possibility. He knew what situation the Raps were in, and I'd have been much more happy if he said, "the Raptors are in a rebuilding mode, and I'm looking to go to a team where my chances are higher". Granted he acknowledged they struggled, but with him at the helm, they could have signed/traded for better players to surround him. He knew what the situation was before, and he led it on. I don't know if they were a bargaining chip or not, but to me, it hurts that he wasn't upfront with them. The Raps needed him bigtime and there's nothing more they could have done to entice him in the near future.

As for why the Raptors are pursuing Nash or another PG? Simple. Bayless absolutely has no court vision - he's a backup for life; and Calderon can't play defence if his life depended on it. I'm not a Calderon hater. I actually think he's a top 20 PG, but Calderon is not a game changer (as good as his offence is). Forget the business aspect of bringing in Nash. Nash would've been able to attract others to come to TO. I don't think the other names out there are that much of an upgrade now, so I don't mind sticking with Calderon for this season.

[flames_1987]

Originally Posted by fleury

Alright, I may be overreacting, but I did read an article (maybe on TSN), before the FA period began, which Nash specifically made it clear Toronto was an intriguing possibility. He knew what situation the Raps were in, and I'd have been much more happy if he said, "the Raptors are in a rebuilding mode, and I'm looking to go to a team where my chances are higher". Granted he acknowledged they struggled, but with him at the helm, they could have signed/traded for better players to surround him. He knew what the situation was before, and he led it on. I don't know if they were a bargaining chip or not, but to me, it hurts that he wasn't upfront with them. The Raps needed him bigtime and there's nothing more they could have done to entice him in the near future.

As for why the Raptors are pursuing Nash or another PG? Simple. Bayless absolutely has no court vision - he's a backup for life; and Calderon can't play defence if his life depended on it. I'm not a Calderon hater. I actually think he's a top 20 PG, but Calderon is not a game changer (as good as his offence is). Forget the business aspect of bringing in Nash. Nash would've been able to attract others to come to TO. I don't think the other names out there are that much of an upgrade now, so I don't mind sticking with Calderon for this season.

Turns out Nash was fine with coming to Toronto and was going to choose between them and New York and then the Lakers swooped in and it sounds like being close to his kids played a huge part. Nash didn't lead them on at all.

Calderon is easily a top 20 PG, his advanced statistics make him look really realllly good. There was a great article on the upgrade Nash gives the Raptors, not being that great. Now mind you, the revenue, the players Nash could bring in, the excitement and everything else would've been worth it. Nash cannot defend well at all either. Bayless is still just fine with me as a backup PG, not a natural passer but he can be a positive player for the Raptors when playing.

The one good part of this all, is we have Dwayne Casey. And Casey has a lot more to work with then last season and if this team can stay healthy, they may be able to still get into those playoffs.

[octothorp]

I've got no problem with this. Of the teams making offers (Toronto, Dallas, New York, LA), the Lakers were by far the closest to being a contender, and gave Phoenix a pretty decent long-term package. Combine that with personal reasons, and it makes a compelling situation. It'll certainly make the Lakers fascinating to watch, but I'm not going to make any predictions about how they'll do. While I've never really cheered for the Lakers before and have occasionally rooted against them, my disdain is mild enough that I'd be able to root for them for Nash's sake. That wouldn't have been the case with New York.

I don't see them getting past OKC in the next three years without some really significant improvements to that roster, but having one good playoff run to the western finals is a decent possibility.

From a Raptors fan perspective, I never really believed he was the best choice from a purely basketball standpoint, but I was hoping that they would get him just because it really didn't look like they had any plan B. Now we'll see whether or not they've got anything else in the works. Rolling with Calderon this year then overpaying on an RFA PG next year (Holliday, Collison, Lawson, Jennings) is the most likely backup plan at this point.

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by octothorp

I've got no problem with this. Of the teams making offers (Toronto, Dallas, New York, LA), the Lakers were by far the closest to being a contender, and gave Phoenix a pretty decent long-term package.

I know you're a basketball fan, but I think in this case you're thinking of a hockey return. The 2 firsts and 2 seconds are nothing and never will be, unless Phoenix has amazing scouts to exploit 2 25+ picks and 2 50+ picks. I believe Bosh only got us a 1st, but those were two different situations. If he wanted to come to Toronto, I'm sure Colangelo would have offered up next years' 1st, which would have been much higher, but alas, Captain Canada decided to take LA. Phoenix is screwed as well, now and for the future.

[flames_1987]

Kyle Lowry is about to become a Raptor.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by flames_1987

Kyle Lowry is about to become a Raptor.

LMAO, great news for Toronto since it is for a "future lottery pick". Do they plan on sucking that bad the next few years?

[flames_1987]

As Bruce Arthur tweeted, it's going to be nice to have a point guard that can finally play defense. Irving is a big time talent. Long term, this might be better then plan A

[PeteLFan]

Originally Posted by flames_1987

As Bruce Arthur tweeted, it's going to be nice to have a point guard that can finally play defense. Irving is a big time talent. Long term, this might be better then plan A

The Raptors are getting Kyle Lowry, not Kyle Irving.

[flames_1987]

Originally Posted by PeteLFan

The Raptors are getting Kyle Lowry, not Kyle Irving.

Always get the last names confused but yes it will still be awesome to have a point guard that can finally defend. Huge talemt

[Senator Clay Davis]

I like Lowry as a player, but giving up a guarenteed lottery pick is beyond risky. If I was the Raps I'd make sure I finish 13th the year that pick is due, God forbid they finish in the top 5 picks, that would make this a totay debacle.

[Drake]

Gary Forbes is headed to Houston with the lottery pick.

https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/stat...53393026445312

[flames_1987]

The pick is protected. It's not guaranteed as I understand it.

[flames_1987]

Sources with team confirm: Lowry to Raptors for Forbes and a first that is protected both ways. Will continue working to get details down.

[flamingreen]

This is a better deal for the Raptors long term then Nash.

[St. Pats]

BC working hard to keep his job. Couldn't swing Nash so plan B went into action. Lowry at least fits with Casey as he plays defense. Calderon has to be out the door now either via trade or the amnesty route. I figure BC next moves two or three of them for a SF. I can live with them having a tough to play against MO. Casey will have an actual training camp and better defensive players to work with.

They should be in a lot of games which should keep it interesting which will be a nice change.