softness and skill are not mutually exclusive..... but on the Flames it is where they have ended up.
The skilled players are soft and and the hard to play against players (the few that they have) are not very skilled.
I can see Comeau and Jones muscling their way into the top 9 as they may have enough skill to play well with better linemates.
Right now with this lineup I can't see anyone except Jones playing head to head against the Thorton's of the League. As Thorton plays 20+ minutes for these games Jones gets at least top 9 minutes.
I can see Hartley explaining to Backlund and Stempniak and Stajan that they are not skillfull enough to keep a top 9 spot unless they show more grit....and show up and win a few puck battles and take the hits to make the play. These are the guys that can't be floating looking for the soft spot on the ice to cash in on someone else's hard work.
Many teams are matching skill against skill now on a regular basis. I don't see any reason to believe we won't be doing the same thing. There's a whole lot more value in playing offensively capable players against offensively capable players as opposed to checkers against offensively capable players imo but that's up to hartley and feast to decide.
If this trend continues i'll happily take a 4th line as an energy line full of blair jones/jackman/bouma type players and the other three as threats to score or make things happen. This team could at least be fun to watch for a change.
I'm kinda meh on the signings so far. Small(Hudler) and not so good defensively(Wideman) but also skilled and will both bring offense. Think a lot is going to depend on a center with no NHL experience. But I do agree with those who see more excitement and man nothing is worse than boring and losing. Might as well do some run and gun and give the fans some fun.
I think Moss was awesome, I would have rather kept him then Comeau and Stemp (I think Stemp is redundent... not so much of his contract that I dislike, just that his spot is better filled elsewhere)..... but Hudler has 100x more skill then Moss.
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Many teams are matching skill against skill now on a regular basis. I don't see any reason to believe we won't be doing the same thing. There's a whole lot more value in playing offensively capable players against offensively capable players as opposed to checkers against offensively capable players imo but that's up to hartley and feast to decide.
If this trend continues i'll happily take a 4th line as an energy line full of blair jones/jackman/bouma type players and the other three as threats to score or make things happen. This team could at least be fun to watch for a change.
Actually, most of the best teams are trying to get their checkers out against the other teams best ayers so they can get their most offensively talented players out against weaker competition so they have a better chance to score. NJ, LA, the canucks, and capitals all followed this principle.
The Flames never really had a chance to do this last year due to injuries and the lack of a true shutdown line for most of the year. If we can stay healthy this year, our forth line will likely be matching up against the other teams best on a regular basis now that we have capable possession playees like Jones and Comeau on it.
Power vs power only really works when you think your best players are significantly more capable than the other teams best players.
Actually, most of the best teams are trying to get their checkers out against the other teams best ayers so they can get their most offensively talented players out against weaker competition so they have a better chance to score. NJ, LA, the canucks, and capitals all followed this principle.
The Flames never really had a chance to do this last year due to injuries and the lack of a true shutdown line for most of the year. If we can stay healthy this year, our forth line will likely be matching up against the other teams best on a regular basis now that we have capable possession playees like Jones and Comeau on it.
Power vs power only really works when you think your best players are significantly more capable than the other teams best players.
i think its 50/50 on teams using top lines against top lines, but the Flames can't afford to do it since they can't win faceoffs, you lose puck possession right off the bat and you're hooped against top lines.
Brown
Ott
Brian Boyle
Landeskog
Callahan
Backes
Dubinsky
Doan
Brouwer
Neil
Hanzal
Lucic
Hartnell
Getzlaff
Kunitz
Clarkson
E. Kane
Folibgo
ie all guys that play in their teams top 6 and play tougher than anyone the Flames have including Iginla and Glencross.
Alll had more hits than Jackman.
I would say you could put Glencross and Iginla on the list of tough forwards for our team and Feast is likely not done at this point. The tough to play against guys we've had for the last 5 years have failed miserably. I can probably speak for a lot of fans in saying I'm sick of watching 'tough to play against' second and third liners who scored 20 goals once when the stars aligned years prior, struggle to bag a dozen on our team and ride the pine half the time.
You can never have too much skill in the lineup - unless we all want to see the likes of kolanos, desbiens and ivanans suiting up for regular shifts again this season.
People wanted a more exciting product - I was one of them. Its starting to look as though we're finally going to get it again. I see no reason to panic because we've lost a couple of oft injured players that had a very limited skill set for ones that can put the puck in the net.
Last edited by flamesaresmokin; 07-03-2012 at 11:22 AM.
^glencross isn't tough, Malkin made him look like a little boy and he never really got his confidence back
What really excites me is the insurgence of players that produce points consistently. More I say, a fast young skilled team with a few guys like Jones and Jackman would be so much more fun to watch than the crap that was last year. Probably the worst year of Flames hockey in more than a decade, I'll take last place and exciting over last years soft approach at whatever Sutter was trying to do. Imagine if the players on the top 3 lines all individually produce 50 points, Kiprusoff would no longer have to carry the team, he could take a day off here and there.
The Wings had a few more hits as team last year than the Flames.
The Wings .... out muscled by nashville got rid of Hudler and added Tootoo. The Flames got rid of TomK and added Hudler
This is where I stopped reading.
Detroit was clearly the better team than Nashville in that series and did not get "out muscled". They got outgoaltended by an elite goalie playing some of the best hockey of his career. How many games in that series were the shots around 40-20 Detroit, but the score was 2-1 Nashville?
And how would you ever come to the conclusion that losing TK and adding Hudler is a bad trade off?
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i think its 50/50 on teams using top lines against top lines, but the Flames can't afford to do it since they can't win faceoffs, you lose puck possession right off the bat and you're hooped against top lines.
It's pretty close to that as you'd statistically expect. 50 percent of the teams have above average 1st lines making it a reasonable choice and probably less than half the teams have a shutdown bottom line that can take on the other teams best. Flames could do power vs power a lot better if they could win faceoffs, that is definitely true. Here's hoping Cammalleri can return to 09 form on the dot.
^glencross isn't tough, Malkin made him look like a little boy and he never really got his confidence back
What really excites me is the insurgence of players that produce points consistently. More I say, a fast young skilled team with a few guys like Jones and Jackman would be so much more fun to watch than the crap that was last year. Probably the worst year of Flames hockey in more than a decade, I'll take last place and exciting over last years soft approach at whatever Sutter was trying to do. Imagine if the players on the top 3 lines all individually produce 50 points, Kiprusoff would no longer have to carry the team, he could take a day off here and there.
I'm not sure how this makes glencross not a tough player?
You will never have 9 players with 50 plus points on a team. The top scoring teams in the league maybe have 5/6 max in total. Its about being able to score, carry the play and generate offense as opposed to having lines 3/4 only able to dump and chase or run around and throw hits for 30 seconds.
The thing I like the most about this signing is that by the time his contract ends, he'll be the same age as Tanguay is now.
He also basically replaces Rene Bourque, so if you want to look at it, Cammalleri and Hudler replace Jokinen and Bourque (granted the first two make 3.67 million more) while getting younger, and not being in danger having one of them completely fading like Bork appears to have done.
Is there still no audio posted? That site is damn hard to navigate through.
It has a lot of technical problems, too, however, that may just be me, but I couldn't listen to the first half of the Jiri Hudler interview when it was live for some reason.
What really excites me is the insurgence of players that produce points consistently. More I say, a fast young skilled team with a few guys like Jones and Jackman would be so much more fun to watch than the crap that was last year. Probably the worst year of Flames hockey in more than a decade, I'll take last place and exciting over last years soft approach at whatever Sutter was trying to do. Imagine if the players on the top 3 lines all individually produce 50 points, Kiprusoff would no longer have to carry the team, he could take a day off here and there.
I agree, last year was easily one of the worst seasons of hockey I've ever watched from the Flames from an entertainment standpoint.
As much as people seem to be worried about the size and toughness of this team (as it stands now) I think the thing that has hurt the team more than anything is offensive awareness. I like the fact that they are bringing in some guys that seemingly will know what to do in the attacking end of the rink, even though it may be at the expense of some grit or physical play. For too long the Flames have been full of guys that had hands of stone or poor offensive hockey sense, and it hasn't worked. A change in philosophy is refreshing and I'm willing to see how it works out.
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A few weeks after crashing head-first into the boards (denting his helmet and being unable to move for a little while) following a hit from behind by Bob Errey, the Calgary Flames player explains:
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-- Frank Musil - Early January 1994
^glencross isn't tough, Malkin made him look like a little boy and he never really got his confidence back
What really excites me is the insurgence of players that produce points consistently. More I say, a fast young skilled team with a few guys like Jones and Jackman would be so much more fun to watch than the crap that was last year. Probably the worst year of Flames hockey in more than a decade, I'll take last place and exciting over last years soft approach at whatever Sutter was trying to do. Imagine if the players on the top 3 lines all individually produce 50 points, Kiprusoff would no longer have to carry the team, he could take a day off here and there.
...are you kidding me? Nice selective memory right there.
It's an absolute non-event. If the linesman jumped in to protect anyone, it certainly wasn't #20.
...and because AC rules:
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...are you kidding me? Nice selective memory right there.
It's an absolute non-event. If the linesman jumped in to protect anyone, it certainly wasn't #20.
It wasn't that, it was when Glencross tried to go attack Malkin in another incident and Malkin dismissed him completely by nailing him in the face with his elbow and Glencross gets hurt. Glencross tried to stand up for himself and he got beat down quite easily. Can't find it on youtube but I have a near eidetic memory and remember it vividly.
It wasn't that, it was when Glencross tried to go attack Malkin in another incident and Malkin dismissed him completely by nailing him in the face with his elbow and Glencross gets hurt. Glencross tried to stand up for himself and he got beat down quite easily.
