New video shows Vancouver Police shooting injured, unarmed man in the head

[metallicat]

I have some first hand dealings with the Vancouver police and numerous members of the department, and I can't say one bad thing. The officers I dealt with were of the upmost professionalism and competence. Not speaking to this incident specifically, it's a shame when all police officers get tarred by the same brush because of a few bad apples. There are bad apples in every profession, policing just happens to be in the public spotlight so we hear more about them. Good stories of what the police do need to be spread around more, but they aren't newsworthy enough.

[VO #23]

Originally Posted by oilers_fan

I have some first hand dealings with the Vancouver police and numerous members of the department, and I can't say one bad thing. The officers I dealt with were of the upmost professionalism and competence. Not speaking to this incident specifically, it's a shame when all police officers get tarred by the same brush because of a few bad apples. There are bad apples in every profession, policing just happens to be in the public spotlight so we hear more about them. Good stories of what the police do need to be spread around more, but they aren't newsworthy enough.

You know why they're in the spotlight? Because they're supposed to be protecting our security, not actively working to undermine it as paramilitary groups that act with impunity. Between the VPD and their counterparts in the RCMP, the Vancouver police forces are in serious trouble right now.

[HPLovecraft]

Originally Posted by oilers_fan

I have some first hand dealings with the Vancouver police and numerous members of the department, and I can't say one bad thing. The officers I dealt with were of the upmost professionalism and competence. Not speaking to this incident specifically, it's a shame when all police officers get tarred by the same brush because of a few bad apples. There are bad apples in every profession, policing just happens to be in the public spotlight so we hear more about them. Good stories of what the police do need to be spread around more, but they aren't newsworthy enough.

People still use this "a few bad apples" excuse? And that's just what it is, an excuse.

Corruption in Policing: Causes and Consequences, a review made on behalf of the RCMP

The notion of what has come to be known as the “bad apple” paradigm has often been used,
especially by senior police officers, as an easy way out when they are called upon to explain
corruption within their organization (Newburn, 1999:15; Kersten, 2000: 241). It is a simplistic
explanation that permits the organization and senior management to blame corruption on
individuals and individual faults – behavioural, psychological, background factors, and so on,
rather than addressing systemic factors.

[ . . . ]

The bad apple idea essentially sees police corruption as a moral failure or a defect of individuals
and hence it becomes treated as an administrative problem (Klockars et al., 2000:1). However,
this explanation is inadequate in terms of the reality of the organizational and occupational
culture of policing in contributing to the development and continuation of corruption(Klockars
et al., 2000:1; Kersten, 2000: 241).

[Vulcan]

My sister liked to tell this story. She walked into the downtown Vancouver cop shop and asked to speak to an honest cop. They started laughing and one cop pointed at this other cop sitting at his desk in the corner and said he's the only one.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

My sister liked to tell this story. She walked into the downtown Vancouver cop shop and asked to speak to an honest cop. They started laughing and one cop pointed at this other cop sitting at his desk in the corner and said he's the only one.

HAHA - what a fantastic and completely plausible anecdote!! I bet those crooked #######s were 100% serious too.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by HPLovecraft

People still use this "a few bad apples" excuse? And that's just what it is, an excuse.

So what is it then? 50%? 90% You honestly believe that the percentage of cops out there that are 'dirty' is that much?

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by VO #23

You know why they're in the spotlight? Because they're supposed to be protecting our security, not actively working to undermine it as paramilitary groups that act with impunity.

Sweet baby jesus that is the most drama I've seen in a long time. Time for a bandanna mask and brick, buddy -hit the streets and fight the machine.

[Wormius]

Hard to believe that the police thought he was that much of a threat after one office walked right up to him and took the chain away. Really hard to side with that particular officer.

Probably didn't want to be the only one that didn't get to shoot at him.

[VO #23]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Sweet baby jesus that is the most drama I've seen in a long time. Time for a bandanna mask and brick, buddy -hit the streets and fight the machine.

This week alone, we've had this story as well as the revelation that the Winnipeg police force have engaged in evidence fabrication to build stronger Crown cases and create false convictions.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/loc...155264025.html

Honestly, you'd be an idiot to trust the police 100% considering the shady maneuvers they pull.

[ricosuave]

pretty easy viewpoint to have from your comfortable seat.

you would prefer the alternative of all-out anarchism then?

[OffsideSpecialist]

Originally Posted by VO #23

This week alone, we've had this story as well as the revelation that the Winnipeg police force have engaged in evidence fabrication to build stronger Crown cases and create false convictions.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/loc...155264025.html

Honestly, you'd be an idiot to trust the police 100% considering the shady maneuvers they pull.

I also heard a story today out of Toronto about a Toronto cop being shunned and outcast by his peers for arresting a Halton officer for drunk driving. He actually got suspended for some reason too I heard, more of a suspension than those that ridiculed him.

[VO #23]

Originally Posted by ricosuave

pretty easy viewpoint to have from your comfortable seat.

you would prefer the alternative of all-out anarchism then?

Nice false dichotomy. I prefer the option you didn't mention: a police force that respects the rule of law and the role it fulfills within society, and front-line officers that show the same courtesy to the citizens it protects.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Sweet baby jesus that is the most drama I've seen in a long time. Time for a bandanna mask and brick, buddy -hit the streets and fight the machine.

Have you had any dealings with the Vancouver police, do you know what you are talking about? We're not condemning all police, at least I'm not but the Vancouver police have a deserved bad reputation with an attitude far removed from what you would get from the Calgary police.

[Senator Clay Davis]

It might only be a TV show, but many cops agree the Wire is the most realistic portrayal of police and the buracracy behind it (likely because one of the head writers is a former 20-year homicide detective), and virtual all officers engage in some form of shady behavior, including notably letting fellow officers get away with drunk driving and in general drinking on the job. That doesn't make them "dirty" cops per se, but it doesn't strike me as particularly noble either. It is in essence an abuse of power.

[ricosuave]

Originally Posted by VO #23

Nice false dichotomy. I prefer the option you didn't mention: a police force that respects the rule of law and the role it fulfills within society, and front-line officers that show the same courtesy to the citizens it protects.

the same front line officers that have to deal with situations and horrors that no one can possibly imagine? that follows the rules of law within the boundaries that the citizens demand as protection? against criminals that oh so obviously doesn't play by anywhere near the same rules or level playing field?

funny you use the work 'courtesy'. wonder if people on the wrong side of the law worry about showing that.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by ricosuave

funny you use the work 'courtesy'. wonder if people on the wrong side of the law worry about showing that.

Probably not. That's part of the reason they are called "criminals".

[VO #23]

Originally Posted by ricosuave

the same front line officers that have to deal with situations and horrors that no one can possibly imagine? that follows the rules of law within the boundaries that the citizens demand as protection? against criminals that oh so obviously doesn't play by anywhere near the same rules or level playing field?

funny you use the work 'courtesy'. wonder if people on the wrong side of the law worry about showing that.

Police officers have tough jobs, no doubt about that. Regardless of that fact, in no way should they be given free passes to engage in this type of behaviour nor should it be tolerated as "the ends justifying the means". This flies completely in the face of the rule of law.

It reasonable to expect that those entrusted by the state with broad powers, including the legal use of deadly force, to uphold law and order should conduct themselves in a manner consistent with the values they are protecting.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by VO #23

It reasonable to expect that those entrusted by the state with broad powers, including the legal use of deadly force, to uphold law and order should conduct themselves in a manner consistent with the values they are protecting.

Romantic notion I'd say. You're not only asking, you're expecting them to not be human. Doctors who push friends up wait lists, lawyers downloading music, mechanics fixing something they shouldn't - we all have slip ups, perks, things that aren't 100% kosher. I don't think it's as common as you think. I'm good friends with a couple of cops, ('big surprise' I'm sure you're all thinking) and the discussions we've had don't lead me to believe there is a large percentage of the force abusing their power and the 'cowboys' out there are looked down on.

[VO #23]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Romantic notion I'd say. You're not only asking, you're expecting them to not be human. Doctors who push friends up wait lists, lawyers downloading music, mechanics fixing something they shouldn't - we all have slip ups, perks, things that aren't 100% kosher. I don't think it's as common as you think. I'm good friends with a couple of cops, ('big surprise' I'm sure you're all thinking) and the discussions we've had don't lead me to believe there is a large percentage of the force abusing their power and the 'cowboys' out there are looked down on.

None of these things directly impact the liberty interests of citizens though, or contribute to their lives being ended. I don't think it's a 'romantic notion' to hold police officers to the highest of standards, IMO.

I know some cops too and I've heard different things - letting the dogs loose on suspects who are already surrendering, punching suspects who are already in handcuffs, etc. That's not the type of behaviour I can get onboard with or turn a blind eye to.

[nik-]

It's not the Vancouver police that are the problem, it's a professional group of agitator police and police from Surrey