The 2012 UEFA European Championship - Poland/Ukraine - The Thread!

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Locke

Disaster strikes if he sees the field. Do you remember Robert Green?

My point is, how thin is English goaltending when you're still taking Robert Green and Ruddy, a guy who only has one season of PL experience? Granted, I'd put Ruddy in net well before Green.

And I agree, the lowered expectations are a positive step for England, but I'm not exactly convinced on how long those will stay down.

How often do we see reserve goalkeepers used in these tournaments? Not very. That's my point, it's like saying that the Flames goaltending is suspect because everyone behind Kipprusoff is a question mark (or worse) while ignoring the fact that the odds of any of them playing is pretty darn slim.

[NBC]

valo, you are absolutely right. Outside of the odd tabloid article, I've not come across many people, be they TV personalities, pundits, former players, current players, or your average Englishman(woman) that has any sort of expectations this time round. Basically no one does. I'd bet that if England put in some decent performances, get out of the group and give a good account of themselves in the QF, no one will think it was a disaster.

Robert Green is still a decent keeper that could easily be the no.1 on a Premiership side. In fact he'll be in the EPL next year. I also admire him for sticking with the Hammers and not wanting to run off to a club in the top flight like so many relegated players do - which inevitably makes it harder for the recently relegated side to gain re-promotion to the PL.

While I think my good friend Locke is trying to wind up the England contingent on CP, they do have some problems, but I don't think that they are the ones he's highlighted. The real problem that I see is with the strikers. Outside of the White Pele, none of the other forwards have a regular place in their club side and Defoe hasn't been around the England camp since Autumn 2010. The lack of another CM outside of Parker could be an issue, but looking at the team Roy has chosen, he's placed a lot of emphasis on versatility. He's got a bunch of guys that can play multiple positions, which in a tournament like this will probably come in handy. He's got a lot of wide men too, possibly at the cost of another CM or CF. But who knows. If they give a good account and play well, then it was a success. But rest assured, very few here in England have any sort of expectations going into Euro 2012.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by Locke

Disaster strikes if he sees the field. Do you remember Robert Green?

My point is, how thin is English goaltending when you're still taking Robert Green and Ruddy, a guy who only has one season of PL experience? Granted, I'd put Ruddy in net well before Green.

And I agree, the lowered expectations are a positive step for England, but I'm not exactly convinced on how long those will stay down.

Who cares. We have the best English keeper in eons between the pegs. He handles big games as well as anybody. Hart is a game changer, the others (past and present) are par for the course.

Originally Posted by NBC

valo, you are absolutely right. Outside of the odd tabloid article, I've not come across many people, be they TV personalities, pundits, former players, current players, or your average Englishman(woman) that has any sort of expectations this time round. Basically no one does. I'd bet that if England put in some decent performances, get out of the group and give a good account of themselves in the QF, no one will think it was a disaster.

Robert Green is still a decent keeper that could easily be the no.1 on a Premiership side. In fact he'll be in the EPL next year. I also admire him for sticking with the Hammers and not wanting to run off to a club in the top flight like so many relegated players do - which inevitably makes it harder for the recently relegated side to gain re-promotion to the PL.

While I think my good friend Locke is trying to wind up the England contingent on CP, they do have some problems, but I don't think that they are the ones he's highlighted. The real problem that I see is with the strikers. Outside of the White Pele, none of the other forwards have a regular place in their club side and Defoe hasn't been around the England camp since Autumn 2010. The lack of another CM outside of Parker could be an issue, but looking at the team Roy has chosen, he's placed a lot of emphasis on versatility. He's got a bunch of guys that can play multiple positions, which in a tournament like this will probably come in handy. He's got a lot of wide men too, possibly at the cost of another CM or CF. But who knows. If they give a good account and play well, then it was a success. But rest assured, very few here in England have any sort of expectations going into Euro 2012.

Agreed. You have great insight, when it isn't polluted by insults and vitrol.

First couple games, will test forwards to see who can be a late sub. Hopefully one of them shows some brilliance.

[NBC]

But cam, Manchester United makes me soooo mad!

Actually I don't really care that much about the club stuff, outside of Brighton.

Oh and thanks for the compliment. I'll try hard not to be as condescending throughout the Euros.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by NBC

But cam, Manchester United makes me soooo mad!

Actually I don't really care that much about the club stuff, outside of Brighton.

Oh and thanks for the compliment. I'll try hard not to be as condescending throughout the Euros.

I'm going to wear my Cantona jersey on Saturday just to spite west London.

Edit: Also, for those not on the Hart bandwagon.. He should have been Capello's #1 last time aruond. (duh). Watch the replay of him with Bham City vs Chelsea Boxing Day 2009. That's 3 years ago, and he blanked Chelsea.. their ONLY time that season. Brilliant is an understatement.

[NBC]

Why West London? I think I missed something.

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by NBC

Why West London? I think I missed something.

Surely, they dont draw the entire city.

Or is it all of those worldly bandwagoning blues lovers.

[NBC]

Hart, A. Cole, Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, these guys are world class. Terry, Lescott, Parker, I'd have in my squad based purely on football acumen (Terry no because he's a jerk). True there are some guys who may not inspire much confidence, but when you look back to that star-studded 2006 WC side, they didn't perform - at all. Rooney, Owen, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, Ferdinand, Terry, A. Cole, Neville, all top players. And as usual for England the total was less than the sum of the parts. Reduced expectations, and blooding youngsters, (AOC, Jones) will be good in the long run.

[NBC]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

Surely, they dont draw the entire city.

Or is it all of those worldly bandwagoning blues lovers.

Ah right. Their big draw would be in the outer boroughs. Less so in the heart of the city. Outside the M25, absolutely. But I digress...

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by NBC

Hart, A. Cole, Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, these guys are world class. Terry, Lescott, Parker, I'd have in my squad based purely on football acumen (Terry no because he's a jerk). True there are some guys who may not inspire much confidence, but when you look back to that star-studded 2006 WC side, they didn't perform - at all. Rooney, Owen, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, Ferdinand, Terry, A. Cole, Neville, all top players. And as usual for England the total was less than the sum of the parts. Reduced expectations, and blooding youngsters, (AOC, Jones) will be good in the long run.

2006. Hargreaves was the only one who rose to the challenge.

2006 we should have been semis. I blame that on Carragher, Rooney and an unbelievable PK performance by Ricardo. Of course English pk luck factors in.

From Carragher to Glen Johnson. sigh.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by valo403

How often do we see reserve goalkeepers used in these tournaments? Not very. That's my point, it's like saying that the Flames goaltending is suspect because everyone behind Kipprusoff is a question mark (or worse) while ignoring the fact that the odds of any of them playing is pretty darn slim.

It depends. Go back to the World Cup in 2010 and David James was the reserve keeper and after Green let the beach ball through he played the rest of the tournament.

Yes, Joe Hart is really good, no argument from me, but should anything happen, he gets hurt or allows a Green-esque howler, the pickings behind him are a little slim.

Originally Posted by NBC

valo, you are absolutely right. Outside of the odd tabloid article, I've not come across many people, be they TV personalities, pundits, former players, current players, or your average Englishman(woman) that has any sort of expectations this time round. Basically no one does. I'd bet that if England put in some decent performances, get out of the group and give a good account of themselves in the QF, no one will think it was a disaster.

Robert Green is still a decent keeper that could easily be the no.1 on a Premiership side. In fact he'll be in the EPL next year. I also admire him for sticking with the Hammers and not wanting to run off to a club in the top flight like so many relegated players do - which inevitably makes it harder for the recently relegated side to gain re-promotion to the PL.

While I think my good friend Locke is trying to wind up the England contingent on CP, they do have some problems, but I don't think that they are the ones he's highlighted. The real problem that I see is with the strikers. Outside of the White Pele, none of the other forwards have a regular place in their club side and Defoe hasn't been around the England camp since Autumn 2010. The lack of another CM outside of Parker could be an issue, but looking at the team Roy has chosen, he's placed a lot of emphasis on versatility. He's got a bunch of guys that can play multiple positions, which in a tournament like this will probably come in handy. He's got a lot of wide men too, possibly at the cost of another CM or CF. But who knows. If they give a good account and play well, then it was a success. But rest assured, very few here in England have any sort of expectations going into Euro 2012.

A few things here:

Rile up the English contingent? Of course. Its so much fun.

They do have problems, up front in particular, those guys havent been in great form and Rooney is notoriously poor for England, especially in big tournaments. He went into the World Cup on the back of his best season ever and he only managed one goal for England. Asking more than that from Carroll or Welbeck or Defoe could be tough.

But they also have injury problems and the ones I named are currently injured. Not to mention Cole, Lampard and a semi-injured Cahill are all likely going to be playing in a huge CL match on Saturday. What happens if they get injured there similar to what happened to Micheal Ballack in the FA cup?

And finally, in regards to expectations. Right now they are where they should be, but people's expectations change depending on results. If England barely crawl out of the group stage then expectations will be tempered, if England blow their group away then expectations will likely soar once again.

[NBC]

^ Typical German.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Locke

It depends. Go back to the World Cup in 2010 and David James was the reserve keeper and after Green let the beach ball through he played the rest of the tournament.

Yes, Joe Hart is really good, no argument from me, but should anything happen, he gets hurt or allows a Green-esque howler, the pickings behind him are a little slim.

The only reason James replaced Green was that Green was never the clear choice. If Hart gives up a weak goal he's still the clear choice, he's head and shoulders ahead. If there's an injury then yes, the pickings are slim, the same could be said of most teams.

It's just an incredibly odd point to latch onto. Your backup goalies are weak? Who cares?

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by valo403

The only reason James replaced Green was that Green was never the clear choice. If Hart gives up a weak goal he's still the clear choice, he's head and shoulders ahead. If there's an injury then yes, the pickings are slim, the same could be said of most teams.

It's just an incredibly odd point to latch onto. Your backup goalies are weak? Who cares?

This ones for Locke.
Hart > Neuer.

[M*A*S*H 4077]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

This ones for Locke.
Hart > Neuer.

In what world is that in? Neuer is the best keeper in the world

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by M*A*S*H 4077

In what world is that in? Neuer is the best keeper in the world

shh. I know he is.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by M*A*S*H 4077

In what world is that in? Neuer is the best keeper in the world

Thats fine. Turnabout is fair play.

[cam_wmh]

Anyyyyyyyyyyyyyway

Carrick stated to the FA a few months ago, that he'd only go as first string.

With Parker hurt, looks like they better ring him. I'm biased obviously, but I like Carrick over Henderson

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/foo...Euro-2012.html

[M*A*S*H 4077]

Originally Posted by Locke

Thats fine. Turnabout is fair play.

Completely missed the jokes. Carry on gentlemen

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

Anyyyyyyyyyyyyyway

Carrick stated to the FA a few months ago, that he'd only go as first string.

With Parker hurt, looks like they better ring him. I'm biased obviously, but I like Carrick over Henderson

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/foo...Euro-2012.html

do not need to be biased

just need to have eyes

there's about 20 English CM's I'd take over Henderson right now, he may be fantastic in the future but this year he was beyond poor