Hot Water Tank

[Smartcar]

It depends on what you need. The tankless heaters are great unless you and 5 other family members are taking a shower in the space of 1 hour. For just 2 they're fine and save a lot of energy if you care about global warming etc.

[Buff]

I live in Lethbridge and I shopped around. Some of the more bigger name places around town were charging around $900. I phone another guy who used to live down the street from me, and he sold me the same tank as the most expensive place and installed it for $600.

So shop around.

[speede5]

I don't believe for a second that on demand will save enough energy to notice on your bill, at least not enough to offset the cost over the life. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea, but when they are on they burn way more gas than a conventional. Endless hot water will lead to increased consumption. I am putting in a pv tank going from electric and it will be awesome but as much as I love the pluses to an on demand I just can't justify the cost.

If your gonna go on demand, be honest with yourself and do it for the conveniences, otherwise you may be disappointed.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by speede5

I don't believe for a second that on demand will save enough energy to notice on your bill, at least not enough to offset the cost over the life. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea, but when they are on they burn way more gas than a conventional. Endless hot water will lead to increased consumption. I am putting in a pv tank going from electric and it will be awesome but as much as I love the pluses to an on demand I just can't justify the cost.

If your gonna go on demand, be honest with yourself and do it for the conveniences, otherwise you may be disappointed.

It takes the same amount of energy to heat water to the same temperature, whether you do it slowly or quickly. On demand saves energy because you aren't losing heat through the insulation in the side of the tank 24 hours a day. It will easily save enough money to notice on your bill.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Smartcar

It depends on what you need. The tankless heaters are great unless you and 5 other family members are taking a shower in the space of 1 hour. For just 2 they're fine and save a lot of energy if you care about global warming etc.

Why does it matter how many have a shower within an hour. Tankless would be better in that case, as all 5 could have a hot shower, instead of two people having a hot shower and the last three people having a cool shower.

[Northendzone]

Unfortunately I felt like I did not have time to shop around. Went with Calvary water heaters and the total was $1,000......ugh I love home ownership......

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Smartcar

It depends on what you need. The tankless heaters are great unless you and 5 other family members are taking a shower in the space of 1 hour. For just 2 they're fine and save a lot of energy if you care about global warming etc.

Durrr

Tankless is superior for exactly that purpose. The hot water is ON DEMAND, meaning it will not run out.

[MoneyGuy]

My tank is 10 years old. Time to replace it before it gives up?

[Northendzone]

Based on what I have read tanks are supposed to last between 8 and 15 years.

Hard to justify replacing it if it is working......

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

My tank is 10 years old. Time to replace it before it gives up?

drain it, and replace the anode rod(I think it's called) and the look inside and see if it looks OK. Actually you might have to take off the part that the water either enters or exits too, then look inside one hole with a flashlight pointed in the other.

[speede5]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

It takes the same amount of energy to heat water to the same temperature, whether you do it slowly or quickly. On demand saves energy because you aren't losing heat through the insulation in the side of the tank 24 hours a day. It will easily save enough money to notice on your bill.

The heat you lose from the tank is pretty minimal. I agree with you that if all things are equal you will see savings, but is it enough to offset what could easily be triple the cost? I doubt it. And I'm not trying to be a thorn, I love the idea and have almost put one in two homes. They just aren't the be all end all. I'm building a basement suite for a friend right now and we are debating putting one in there. It's going to be almost 3x the cost of a powervent 50 g tank. Your water heater is not the main consumer of gas in your house, even if conventional cost you $50 a month ( which is outrageous) if you save 50%, which is generous, it would be many years before you saw your roi. Plus the unit is way more complex, you fry one cct board and your done.

There's also annual maintenance. You can kill a unit pretty quick of you ignore it like most people do a tank.

All I'm really trying to say though is buy it cause you want endless hot water, not energy savings.

http://www.thestar.com/article/64313...eat-not-so-hot

[You Need a Thneed]

Yeah, tankless costs more, and full life cycle will still cost more. The reason we have one in our house is that we were going to put in a separate furnace for the basement suite, and our chimney size meant that either the new furnace had to exhaust out the wall, meaning either high efficiency furnace, or tankless water heater. The tankless water heater also saved a little bit of space, in a room where space was at a premium.

We do love it, with a suite, we have no worries about running out of hot water. The water volume will go down sometimes if a couple of other things are using hot water, which never lasts very long.


The one small disadvantage is that you can't get a slow trickle of hot water. A slow trickle of water through the unit doesn't turn on the burner.

[billybob123]

I costed out tankless for our new infill but like speede5 said above, the ROI was never going to happen. Our plumber told me he didn't recommend it. If you're looking to spend coin to save energy, a solar recirculating system is an idea. Ours was going go cost too much with no rebates from government, but I heard from a few users (one in our neighbourhood) that a family of 4 was getting 90%+ of their hot water from solar in the summer and 50-60% in the winter. Not bad. I recall the price was in the range of $5000 for the system and $2000 for the setup. Ours was going to be twice that because I wanted it on the garage since our house roof didn't have good angles on the sun.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by speede5

even if conventional cost you $50 a month ( which is outrageous) if you save 50%, which is generous, it would be many years before you saw your roi. Plus the unit is way more complex, you fry one cct board and your done.

There's also annual maintenance. You can kill a unit pretty quick of you ignore it like most people do a tank.

All I'm really trying to say though is buy it cause you want endless hot water, not energy savings.

I would agree that $50 is quite generous. If you look at your summer gas bills, take just the gas usage. The other fees don't change all that much. I know in the summer I maybe use about $15 in gas; and part of that is the BBQ. Assuming that a tankless unit will save you that $15 per month, that is $180 per year. So even after 10 years you have not realized your ROI.

Agreed- the reasons for tankless are for environmental or for large families.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Never really fully agreed with the environmental argument for tankless. Consider the concept of hearing your overall house as a balancing of heat sources and losses. Open the window or door and you lose heat, your furnace has to make up for it. If your tank loses heat, it loses that heat in to the interior of your house. As long as it is within the insulated portion of your house, that heat goes in to the overall heating equation. With a tankless, your furnace potentially fires more to make up for that missing heat source.

The argument in favour is really unlimited hot water supply, not overall energy savings. Unless you are in a hot climate using a decent amount of air conditioning.

[sclitheroe]

Somewhat on topic, are the sacrificial anode rods a universal size/fit, or you do need to buy a part that is specific to your make and model of hot water heater? If you are comfortable doing simple maintenance like a yearly flush, is replacing the rod similarly simple?

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by sclitheroe

Somewhat on topic, are the sacrificial anode rods a universal size/fit, or you do need to buy a part that is specific to your make and model of hot water heater? If you are comfortable doing simple maintenance like a yearly flush, is replacing the rod similarly simple?

It's real easy. I got a universal one, or at least one that was made for a tank that was not the same kind I had. Call a plumbing type place like Bartle and Gibson, they'll let you know. I had to cut it down too. you just need some teflon tape and a pipe wrench type thing.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Never really fully agreed with the environmental argument for tankless. Consider the concept of hearing your overall house as a balancing of heat sources and losses. Open the window or door and you lose heat, your furnace has to make up for it. If your tank loses heat, it loses that heat in to the interior of your house. As long as it is within the insulated portion of your house, that heat goes in to the overall heating equation. With a tankless, your furnace potentially fires more to make up for that missing heat source.

The argument in favour is really unlimited hot water supply, not overall energy savings. Unless you are in a hot climate using a decent amount of air conditioning.

Unless your hot water heater is right beside the couch, the heat lost to the area immediately around your heater is completely useless to the overall heating of your house. Just like the argument that incandescent lightbulbs help heat the house. They do, but extra heat up by the ceiling if of no use to the occupants of the house.

It helps heat your house, but who really cares if your furnace room is a degree warmer than it would otherwise be?

[speede5]

Originally Posted by sclitheroe

Somewhat on topic, are the sacrificial anode rods a universal size/fit, or you do need to buy a part that is specific to your make and model of hot water heater? If you are comfortable doing simple maintenance like a yearly flush, is replacing the rod similarly simple?

Be careful, those rods are quite often stick in there really tight. I've had to use an impact to get them out before, with a pipe wrench you can spin the tank causing all sorts of problems. They are universal. I had to cut one down once because there was not enough room above the tank, just use a hacksaw.

And don't forget to bleed the pressure off before you start. Lol

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

Unless your hot water heater is right beside the couch, the heat lost to the area immediately around your heater is completely useless to the overall heating of your house. Just like the argument that incandescent lightbulbs help heat the house. They do, but extra heat up by the ceiling if of no use to the occupants of the house.

It helps heat your house, but who really cares if your furnace room is a degree warmer than it would otherwise be?

Sure, you have temperature gradients in your house and long time constants in thermal processes but ultimately the lost heat is really not lost, that was the train of thought. Once you are at that steady state, the heat goes in to the house, often from the center and bottom.