A Song of Ice and Fire **Spoilers** Now more TV talk!

[Matata]

My prediction regarding Syrio

Spoiler!

Syrio can change is face and has not left Arya's side. He was the nice guy in the cage from last nights episode and is currently training her in Braavos. All 3 of these characters have guided her along the same path.

[GP_Matt]

Originally Posted by Matata

My prediction regarding Syrio

Spoiler!

Syrio can change is face and has not left Arya's side. He was the nice guy in the cage from last nights episode and is currently training her in Braavos. All 3 of these characters have guided her along the same path.

I hadn't considered it before, but I like the idea. I can't remember if they showed him die in the series?

I wonder if Martin has had to reveal any of his future plans to the screen writers so that they don't close a story line that he purposely left open? If that is the case, they may be able to finish the series even if GRRM doesn't.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Matata

My prediction regarding Syrio

Spoiler!

Syrio can change is face and has not left Arya's side. He was the nice guy in the cage from last nights episode and is currently training her in Braavos. All 3 of these characters have guided her along the same path.

Originally Posted by GP_Matt

I hadn't considered it before, but I like the idea. I can't remember if they showed him die in the series?

I wonder if Martin has had to reveal any of his future plans to the screen writers so that they don't close a story line that he purposely left open? If that is the case, they may be able to finish the series even if GRRM doesn't.

We never saw Syrio die in the show or in the novel. Although it was strongly hinted at with sounds and the setting.

As far as the books are concerned, Jaqne H'agar (sp?) is not Syrio. In the TV show, I guess it could be possible but it doesn't make a lot of sense.

[d_phaneuf]

I think there has been so much stuff going around about Syrio still being alive that even if it was planned it may get changed

[Bigtime]

In the books (and I guess the TV series) Syrio has become a sort of fan favorite, so I'm not surprised to see theories about him still being alive are out there. I guess HBO *could* make it so Syrio is in fact Jaqne, it may simplify things for the TV viewers and not really affect the Jaqne plot in any way. I still think it would be best to leave it as in the novels, you can choose to believe Syrio lived or died as you wish.

I always thought Syrio was a great way to introduce us to Braavos, their people, and some customs (like how they fight).

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

I just read in book 3 a quote from one of Jon's wildling friends that I found interesting. Mentioned that they dug up so many graves looking for the Horn of Whatever-It's-Called and said something like "and we loosed all them shadows". Shadows wasn't the word used though. Almost made me think like they thought they were responsible for the wights/others and that they'd released them when they were searching for the horn.

Now this is something that I thought was obvious - that the search for the horn had released the white walkers. It is interesting what different people pick up from books.


Just as an aside, I know some books that I enjoy; I end up reading so quickly that I miss some stuff and upon a re-read I is almost like another book.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

Now this is something that I thought was obvious - that the search for the horn had released the white walkers. It is interesting what different people pick up from books.


Just as an aside, I know some books that I enjoy; I end up reading so quickly that I miss some stuff and upon a re-read I is almost like another book.

I agree so much with the aside part. These books are so deep, especially with characters, that things are a lot clearer the second time around. I always used to confuse the two rebel groups. Lord Baric's Brotherhood without banners and the Bluddy Mummers/Brave Companions. It was especially bad when Book 3 is switching between Arya being caught by Lord Baric's friends (Harwin) and when Brienne and Jaime were captured by the Mummers. The first time around I kept on thinking, how has Jaime not seen Arya by now?, and why do they seem so much nicer in Arya's chapters? Yeah, it's actually 2 different groups of outlaws.

Oh, except the story that Meera tells bran about the Tourney at Harrenhal in the False Springs in Bran II in book 3. That would be the tourney that Rhaegar won and gave Lyanna the rose and when Jaime was named to the Kingsguard. It tells the story of Howland Reed (at least we are led to believe it is him) who was made fun of by some squires before the tourney, kicked their master's asses in the joust and then disappeared much to Aery's dismay. The Starks are mentioned but only through nicknames (young wolf, shy wolf etc). I had check out the SOIAF wiki for that one.

Another thing I noticed was the difference between wights and true Others. In fact I'm certain that I mentioned it last time I read book 3 in the other GoT thread but had forgotten.

Also very creepy was at the end of book 2 when Dany visits the House of the Undying, one of the visions she has is of a wolf head on a man's body. Crazy foreshadowing that I never picked up on the first time. Did I mentione that too already?

As for how the Others were released, I guess it could be common knowledge. I seem to have missed many obvious things. When I first read the books I had no idea Renly was gay, despite all the hints.

[J epworth]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

I agree so much with the aside part. These books are so deep, especially with characters, that things are a lot clearer the second time around. I always used to confuse the two rebel groups. Lord Baric's Brotherhood without banners and the Bluddy Mummers/Brave Companions. It was especially bad when Book 3 is switching between Arya being caught by Lord Baric's friends (Harwin) and when Brienne and Jaime were captured by the Mummers. The first time around I kept on thinking, how has Jaime not seen Arya by now?, and why do they seem so much nicer in Arya's chapters? Yeah, it's actually 2 different groups of outlaws.

Oh, except the story that Meera tells bran about the Tourney at Harrenhal in the False Springs in Bran II in book 3. That would be the tourney that Rhaegar won and gave Lyanna the rose and when Jaime was named to the Kingsguard. It tells the story of Howland Reed (at least we are led to believe it is him) who was made fun of by some squires before the tourney, kicked their master's asses in the joust and then disappeared much to Aery's dismay. The Starks are mentioned but only through nicknames (young wolf, shy wolf etc). I had check out the SOIAF wiki for that one.

Another thing I noticed was the difference between wights and true Others. In fact I'm certain that I mentioned it last time I read book 3 in the other GoT thread but had forgotten.

Also very creepy was at the end of book 2 when Dany visits the House of the Undying, one of the visions she has is of a wolf head on a man's body. Crazy foreshadowing that I never picked up on the first time. Did I mentione that too already?

As for how the Others were released, I guess it could be common knowledge. I seem to have missed many obvious things. When I first read the books I had no idea Renly was gay, despite all the hints.

The House of the Undying episode is going to be sooo good if they do it well, which I have complete confidence they will.

The one thing I still don't understand is how they are going to move Bran's storyline along without introducing Meera and Jojen. They are such critical characters for Bran, yet they've been written out in the show.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by J epworth kendal

The House of the Undying episode is going to be sooo good if they do it well, which I have complete confidence they will.

The one thing I still don't understand is how they are going to move Bran's storyline along without introducing Meera and Jojen. They are such critical characters for Bran, yet they've been written out in the show.

And I noticed bran only has something like 6 chapters in book 3. Major characters have 10-13 each. We'll see him for 10 mins in 3 episodes.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

And I noticed bran only has something like 6 chapters in book 3. Major characters have 10-13 each. We'll see him for 10 mins in 3 episodes.

Which is pretty good. If there's one character I wish who WOULD get the GRRM special treatment, it's him. Never did like the character or his arc.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

Which is pretty good. If there's one character I wish who WOULD get the GRRM special treatment, it's him. Never did like the character or his arc.

I'll admit I'm not a big fan of the Bran stuff (except for Hodor, he rules. Hodor hodor hodor), but I think we'll see some big payoff with him in the final two books.

[Chump]

Originally Posted by J epworth kendal

The House of the Undying episode is going to be sooo good if they do it well, which I have complete confidence they will.

The one thing I still don't understand is how they are going to move Bran's storyline along without introducing Meera and Jojen. They are such critical characters for Bran, yet they've been written out in the show.

They haven't been casted for season 2 but I suspect they will show up next season. The show writers have said that some characters have just been delayed and not cut outright.

[Bobblehead]

So the show last night combined the 2 "births" by Melisandre.

The first is the one that kills Renly.
The second one is the one that was depicted last night, although in the books the one that Davos saw born went into Storms End to kill the Ser Penrose and allow Stanis to seize Edric Storm.

I have no problem with that change, it moves the story along although I suppose this means Edric won't be in the show.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

So the show last night combined the 2 "births" by Melisandre.

The first is the one that kills Renly.
The second one is the one that was depicted last night, although in the books the one that Davos saw born went into Storms End to kill the Ser Penrose and allow Stanis to seize Edric Storm.

I have no problem with that change, it moves the story along although I suppose this means Edric won't be in the show.

I don't have HBO so I'm not watching season two yet, so they have gone and put Renly at Storms End to combine the two shadow deaths?

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I don't have HBO so I'm not watching season two yet, so they have gone and put Renly at Storms End to combine the two shadow deaths?

Yes, I believe so. Renly and Stannis had their meeting with Cat in attendance, and as Renly rode away Stannis and Ser Davos talked about his finger bones around his neck then Stannis said he would have need of Davos' smuggling skills. Next you saw Davos rowing and then guiding Melisandre into a cave where she revealed herself as very pregnant and gave birth. It was one heck of a scene! So if I am recalling correctly, that is combining the two events.

[Tinordi]

They aren't at Storm's End though. There's no indication of where they are but it is not near a huge castle.

[photon]

They mention they're in the Stormlands when Stannis and Renly meet.

[Tinordi]

I also have no problem cutting out Edric Storm. What a waste of a story he is. GRRM needs a much better editor.

[Bobblehead]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

I also have no problem cutting out Edric Storm. What a waste of a story he is. GRRM needs a much better editor.

Perhaps, but Edric showed the battle going on in Stannis between the need for power he would potentially get by sacrificing Edric for the king's blood and protecting him because he is an innocent. It also shows Ser Davos willing to put his own life on the line to smuggle Edric away, thereby removing the temptation.

Plus we have no idea any future role Edric may play.

I think Martin adds some characters for no reason other than to show the motivations of the main characters while he isn't in their POV.

[photon]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

I think Martin adds some characters for no reason other than to show the motivations of the main characters while he isn't in their POV have something to write about after he kills everyone else.

Ftfy