I remember learning about Vimy Ridge in school. Didn't the French donate the land to Canada? It seems to me it is now actually Canadian territory or something like that.
Also, I remember hearing that there were rumours in Canada during WW2 that Hitler had blown up the monument at Vimy Ridge, but even he had so much respect for the battle that he had actually fortified the monument to protect it from damage.
Both points above might be totally wrong, just faint memories from high school social class...
I remember learning about Vimy Ridge in school. Didn't the French donate the land to Canada? It seems to me it is now actually Canadian territory or something like that.
Also, I remember hearing that there were rumours in Canada during WW2 that Hitler had blown up the monument at Vimy Ridge, but even he had so much respect for the battle that he had actually fortified the monument to protect it from damage.
Both points above might be totally wrong, just faint memories from high school social class...
Point one is true, see above. Also as an aside around Vimy, Dieppe, Courselle sur Mer (where Juno Beach is) and pretty much any place in Normandy you are treated warmly as a Canadian. The French recognize our contributions and from what I've seen appreciate them.
Absolutely. I have to shake my head when people say that Canada's history is boring. We have a very interesting military history and we've always accomplished a lot despite many disadvantages.
I shake my head when people talk about what a peaceful people we are.
"Canada is about peacekeeping"
No we are about kick butt and taking names. All conflicts which have involved Canadian soldiers, have always shown them to be fierce fighters.
Battle of St. Julian wood. Canadians were the only ones that didn't break and run.
Only a fool says we are not a nation of warriors.
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Wow. Thanks for that link. I've been there and I had never heard that story before--it's unsettling to think I can appreciate anything Hitler did.
You probably would appreciate much of the same things that Hitler did, just because he was a horrible person doesn't mean that he didn't find beauty in art or a sunrise.
In fact I think it is almost important to remember that he was just a man, nothing more... placing people like that on a mythical pedestal in some ways forgives what he did and what he was in charge of because he wasn't human.
That being said a conversation for another thread. Vimy Ridge is revered in our nations history and for good reason, it really is one of the instances in which Canada first became a nation, the Canadian identity was forged as we were fighting for Britain on French land.
I shake my head when people talk about what a peaceful people we are.
"Canada is about peacekeeping"
No we are about kick butt and taking names. All conflicts which have involved Canadian soldiers, have always shown them to be fierce fighters.
Battle of St. Julian wood. Canadians were the only ones that didn't break and run.
Only a fool says we are not a nation of warriors.
I thanked this but it deserves more then that. People latched onto the "peacekeeper" label and totally forgot about everything that came before it. Canada was a battleground long before it officially became a country. We're a nation that was forged by war and WW1 was our Independence Day.
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You probably would appreciate much of the same things that Hitler did, just because he was a horrible person doesn't mean that he didn't find beauty in art or a sunrise.
I agree with you as it relates to the things that are common--music, food, art, nature, beauty.
But, a strong appreciation for a peace monument ... yah, I didn't see that coming.
Cynically, I will also add that it was probably a politically motivated action. The author does suggest it was important to Hitler that as many press as possible were involved.
A very interesting quote by General Andrew McNaughton in Nov 1918 regarding the Germans
November
: "We have them on the run. That means we will have to do it over again in another 25 years." (In 21 years, Germany will again be at war with the West.) [129.21]
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Will be in Dieppe this summer for the 70th Anniversary. My Dad who passed last year on August 28 was a Dieppe Veteran. There will be a ceremony to re-dedicate the momument to his Regiment, The Essex Scottish. We will also be touring many of the Regiment's important battle sites in France and Holland, as well as seeing Vimy and ending up in Normandy and the Juno Beach Centre.
I'm bringing my two sons, it will be their first time seeing these places that shaped so much of who their grandfather was, a lot of which they didn't fully realize until he died and so many people came and told them stories and paid their respects. To them he was their Grandpa, but the respect he had in the wider community really took them by surprise and it meant a lot.
A trip we should have taken together when my Dad was still here . . .
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I found Dieppe to be very moving. Walking on that "beach" is pretty damn hard, I can't imagine trying to maneuver on it while taking fire. The sacrifice your father and his comrades made was, in my mind, a key to the success of D Day. I'm very glad to here about the re-dedication.
I got chills comparing my pic to this one I found
and no discussion about Dieppe can be complete without what I think is one of the greatest commercial's ever created. This one gets me every time.
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The Dieppe raid was a disaster of monumental proportions, and created a great deal of resentment between Canadian Military Leadership and Lord Mountbatten.
It was as prime of an example of how not to do a amphibious invasion that the only positive that came out of it were the lesson's learned and applied later at Juno beach.
From a very poor showing by the seaborne destroyers to bad spotting for the allied supporting aircraft to the disasterous use of the Churchill tanks on a shale and sand beach, nothing went right that day.
It was a weird concept that in a mission that ended in a monumental butt kicking that three victoria Crosses were handed out.
A lot of innovations came from the Dieppe raid though. The intelligence gathering for the D-Day invasion was much more in depth even though they still failed to pin point the German fortifications and most of the shore bombardment and air support completely failed.
It also lead to the creation of specialized tanks called "Funnies".
Because of the Canadian binding of German prisoners it lead to very harsh treatment of Canadian POW's who were ordered to be shackled in retaliation. This also lead to a German uprising at a Canadian POW camp which became know as the battle of Bowmanville.
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Meaningless battle in a meaningless war. Germany was at war with almost every nation on earth and nearly won in 1918. Vimy ridge is a skirmish in the big picture.
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Originally Posted by cDnStealth
We're a nation that was forged by war and WW1 was our Independence Day.
Fighting a war for the largest empire in world history, thousands of miles from our shore, is not independence, no matter who is in command.
Meaningless battle in a meaningless war. Germany was at war with almost every nation on earth and nearly won in 1918. Vimy ridge is a skirmish in the big picture.
Fighting a war for the largest empire in world history, thousands of miles from our shore, is not independence, no matter who is in command.
You're just an awesome ray of sunshine in every thread you touch. Just go away already.
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Meaningless battle in a meaningless war. Germany was at war with almost every nation on earth and nearly won in 1918. Vimy ridge is a skirmish in the big picture.
Fighting a war for the largest empire in world history, thousands of miles from our shore, is not independence, no matter who is in command.
You're right about one thing. That it was a small battle and on the larger scale of the war it didn't mean much. But to Canada, that was a defining moment in our history and our participation in that war is what allowed Canada to become a nation independent of Britain. That was one of the concessions we demanded and were subsequently granted following the war. That is a fact.
Meaningless battle in a meaningless war. Germany was at war with almost every nation on earth and nearly won in 1918. Vimy ridge is a skirmish in the big picture.
Fighting a war for the largest empire in world history, thousands of miles from our shore, is not independence, no matter who is in command.
LOL wow just wow!!!
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You're just an awesome ray of sunshine in every thread you touch. Just go away already.
Wtf? I know I'm not the savviest or funniest poster, but i don't think that's deserved. I just have some strong opinions about early 20th century history. Sorry if you don't agree .
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Originally Posted by cDnStealth
You're right about one thing. That it was a small battle and on the larger scale of the war it didn't mean much. But to Canada, that was a defining moment in our history and our participation in that war is what allowed Canada to become a nation independent of Britain. That was one of the concessions we demanded and were subsequently granted following the war. That is a fact.
This is true, but there are far better ways to achieve independence, and I dont think its something to be proud of.
This is true, but there are far better ways to achieve independence, and I dont think its something to be proud of.
So you're saying Canada should have followed the USA's lead and followed a policy of isolationism?
And it isn't like we had a choice - at that time the entire Commonwealth was technically automatically at war as soon as Great Britain declared it. It wasn't until the Statute of Westminster in 1931 that Canada was able to decide if we were at war.
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