Sven "Fricken" Bartschi!

[cKy]

Originally Posted by GettinIggyWithIt

Jarome Iginla is only worth one first round pick? I am sorry but regardless of how you feel about the change in his playing style in recent years - Iginla has a very good reputation and a lot of respect around the league. He should get you 2 1st round picks minimum from a contender. Keep in mind that a contender would have late first round picks (which are not nearly as valuable as a top 10 pick). I realize you said high first rounder but if that's the case, I say you could get at least 1 top ten pick and another top 20 pick/prospect minimum.

If Jarome only nets you one first rounder - you keep him - plain and simple. Semyon Varlamov netted a 1st and a 2nd from a contender. I am pretty sure Iginla would get you more than that.

Agree with the rest of your post about trying to find a reasonable trade partner though. That is not as easy as people think.

Weird to compare a 1st line player with a goal tender. Do you go to the grocery store and say "man, i'd like the pears but the passion fruit is cheaper". Of course they different values as it is a completely different position.

[red sky]

Originally Posted by cKy

Weird to compare a 1st line player with a goal tender. Do you go to the grocery store and say "man, i'd like the pears but the passion fruit is cheaper". Of course they different values as it is a completely different position.

Wow, am I that out of touch with our analogies now? When did it change from comparing apples to oranges? I guess I will start using the new saying, "comparing pears to passion fruit".

Thanks!

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by sworkhard

There's a reason why Management is adamant they are going to keep him, and a lot if is is because they know they will never get enough to make fans happy.

Fans base their valuation of a player on what that player has done in the past, not what he is likely to do in the future. If management is making crucial, long-term asset decisions to please fans, this franchise is in deep, deep trouble.

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by RobDoupe

Fans base their valuation of a player on what that player has done in the past, not what he is likely to do in the future. If management is making crucial, long-term asset decisions to please fans, this franchise is in deep, deep trouble.

You need to draw the fans in though. It's why I think it's important that Baertchi perform well next year. If he can get 40 points as a rookie, I think fans will adopt him as the new face of the franchise and the future of the franchise. If management isn't confident that they have someone that they can pin the future on though, then unless they can trade Iggy for such a player, it's unlikely he'll be traded. If they can develop that player internally first, it's a lot easier to move Iggy, assuming it makes sense to beyond selling tickets and acquiring players. We know fans are hungry for a skilled forward that can score, just look at the Baertchi chants at the dome for evidence. Until we have that player on the team though, Iggy is still a big attraction.

Quite often a 'Franchise' player brings more to a team than you can get back in a return, especially when that player is one of the main reasons people come to see your team. Is a single high first round pick worth acquiring in exchange for a guy that can still score 30 goals and defines the organization as a classy one? For the Flames, it's likely not. If the Flames had a couple guys that were on their way to becoming 30 goal scorers, then that would probably be a fair return.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by sworkhard

Is a single high first round pick worth acquiring in exchange for a guy that can still score 30 goals and defines the organization as a classy one? For the Flames, it's likely not. If the Flames had a couple guys that were on their way to becoming 30 goal scorers, then that would probably be a fair return.

A couple more season's of Iginla's classiness and 30 goals will be small solace when this team is in its sixth or seventh season out of the playoffs.

You know what excites fans? Winning.

[GettinIggyWithIt]

Originally Posted by cKy

Weird to compare a 1st line player with a goal tender. Do you go to the grocery store and say "man, i'd like the pears but the passion fruit is cheaper". Of course they different values as it is a completely different position.

Yeah you're absolutely right - when NHL GM's compare players and consider trades they would only consider the value of players that play the same position - which is why forwards are only traded for forwards, goalies for goalies and draft picks for draft picks...oh wait they're not..

It shouldn't matter what position the player plays - I'm talking about relative value. For example if Kessel were to get you two first rounders, one could argue that Phaneuf could have gotten us two first rounders. Different positions doesn't necessarily mean different values...what are you talking about?

For the record - I am not trying to bring up the Phaneuf trade - just a comparison...would hate to bring that debate up again.

[GettinIggyWithIt]

Originally Posted by sworkhard

I'd be surprised if Iggy has more value in the league than Varlamov did to the Avs. Age is a huge difference, and the Avs expect Varlamov to be elite and be elite for a long time.

That being said, while I don't think you'll get 2 top 10 pics for Iggy (he's worth less than Kessel was at the time of that trade for example (a trade that was made with the expectation from Boston that at least the 1st one would be top 10 and both would be top 15), you can probably get a top 10 and a late first or early second for him. There's a reason why Management is adamant they are going to keep him, and a lot if is is because they know they will never get enough to make fans happy.

I agree - I think the post just undervalued Iginla on the trade market. Trading to a contender wouldn't get you lottery picks anyways so a top ten and a late first isn't out of the question for Iginla IMO.

For Flames management, I think keeping Iginla has more intangible value for the franchise than actually trading for him. I also don't think they would trade him for picks (perhaps a couple of prospects and player in some kind of package if at all).

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by sworkhard

You need to draw the fans in though. It's why I think it's important that Baertchi perform well next year. If he can get 40 points as a rookie, I think fans will adopt him as the new face of the franchise and the future of the franchise.

He is pretty obviously already thought of as being the future of the franchise. But the face will not change until Iginla's time is done. Hopefully not for many years (and Cups. ).

[GreenLantern2814]

Iginla will not score 50 goals in Calgary again; he's the driving force of the offense, and he's not capable of being that guy any more. In a situation where he's a complimentary player, he could easily hit 40 if not 50 again.

In Calgary, he is a 30 goal man. Which is valuable, but it seems reasonable to assume that, with 7 million extra dollars, we could find those 30 extra goals somewhere, for decent value. Plus the picks/prospects that he'd return? Trade him now, for the good of everyone.

[logan_izer10]

ummm. Am I in the wrong thread here? I clicked on Sven Fricken Baertschi hoping to ease my mind and focus on something positive and about the future and as I scroll through I see "Jarome this, Jarome that, Gm's this, Varlamov that." leaves....

[Resolute 14]

Most of CP has gone full ###### lately. There might not be a single thread that doesn't have people crying about Iginla, Sutter or their own desire to fail right now, regardless of the nominal topic of the thread.

[kirant]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Most of CP has gone full ###### lately. There might not be a single thread that doesn't have people crying about Iginla, Sutter or their own desire to fail right now, regardless of the nominal topic of the thread.

I've said it before, but most CP topics basically returns to the same discussion topics, picked based on whatever is closest to the actual point of the thread:
- Sutter sucks
- Iginla needs to be traded
- Kiprusoff needs to be traded
- Bouwmeester sucks
- Stajan sucks
- Phaneuf trade
- Blow it up
- Butler sucks

[ThisYear]

Originally Posted by kirant

I've said it before, but most CP topics basically returns to the same discussion topics, picked based on whatever is closest to the actual point of the thread:
- Sutter sucks
- Iginla needs to be traded
- Kiprusoff needs to be traded
- Bouwmeester sucks
- Stajan sucks
- Phaneuf trade
- Blow it up
- Butler sucks

I believe you missed "Canucks suck".

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by kirant

I've said it before, but most CP topics basically returns to the same discussion topics, picked based on whatever is closest to the actual point of the thread:
- Sutter sucks
- Iginla needs to be traded
- Kiprusoff needs to be traded
- Bouwmeester sucks
- Stajan sucks
- Phaneuf trade
- Blow it up
- Butler sucks

I don't dissagree, but what else would you have the fans of this team discuss? Not much else relevant to talk about prior to the emergance of the young prospect who's the focus of this thread.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by fotze

This is why organized religion is so destructive. It is because people in parasite communities cost the city more money than those of the inner city, causing drivers to police Deerfoot themself by going 105 in the left hand lane, and lets not forget that vanflamesfan liked the Transformers movies.

Ummmm, yay Sven?

[Stay Golden]

I don't usually pull for american WHL teams but it would awesome to see Sven in memorial cup!

[Kofy]

http://winterhawks.com/article/recor...rmances/120321 Some nice number for Sven.

Also he's at this time second best scorer in playoff with 5G and 12A for 17P in 6 games. That's ridiculous

[Kipperking]

Bust.

[Lt.Spears]

Originally Posted by Kipperking

Bust.

a nut at how good he is?

[CaptainCrunch]

I hear that he treats people badly, just the other day, he stole candy from a baby, punched out a girl guide who tried to sell him cookies, and for kicks he offered to help a old lady across the road and abandoned her half way across.