2012 Federal Budget

[etherealgirl]

Not much point in going through this as I completely disagree with you. But, a lie is a lie is a lie. The Conservatives campaigned on not changing the CBC's funding, so it was part of their mandate, and now they have broken that promise.

The CBC has undergone several cuts in recent years, and each time their programming is compromised. For CBC TV's part, their mandate, or arguably the way they fulfill that mandate, or (also arguably) the way Canadian content is developed and broadcast, should be updated in my opinion, but their existence is essential to a healthy democracy. CBC Radio is excellent. Unfortunately with the budget cuts, it's suffered and had to put on more repeats. It's doing an excellent job with what it's given, however. I am not looking forward to seeing what impact this latest round of cuts has.

I assume you are aware of the attack on the CBC by Sun Media/Quebecor and that much of what they've done politically/legally in the last couple of years has been in that context.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

The Conservatives campaigned on not changing the CBC's funding, so it was part of their mandate, and now they have broken that promise.

I do seem to remember them promising that, not sure why.

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

The CBC has undergone several cuts in recent years, and each time their programming is compromised.

Which cuts were those?

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

their existence is essential to a healthy democracy.

That's a stretch, Mansbridge is that you?

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

It's doing an excellent job with what it's given, however. I am not looking forward to seeing what impact this latest round of cuts has.

There are a few good shows, not worth even close to 1.1 billion dollars worth.

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

I assume you are aware of the attack on the CBC by Sun Media/Quebecor

By attack on CBC I assume you mean asking them to show how they are spending our money? How mean to attack them that way, they shouldn't have to show us peasants anything. Who cares how much they piss away on parties, bonuses and expense accounts, there are plenty of tax dollars to go around.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

Not much point in going through this as I completely disagree with you. But, a lie is a lie is a lie. The Conservatives campaigned on not changing the CBC's funding, so it was part of their mandate, and now they have broken that promise.

The CBC isn't a priority when it comes to spending, there are way more important programs that got axed then the CBC. And Moore frankly is a moron, he looked like an a%% during pornogate, and he's not the last word on government funding. You pulled out a quote from last year, great, but the first mandate that this government promised was reducing the budget, so I'm not going to cry that the CBC got gutted on the alter of saving money. Besides that if you look at Moore's comments in June 2011, he stated that CBC should be prepared to see cuts

http://www.cbc.ca/news/arts/story/20...-cbc-arts.html

[QUOTE=etherealgirl;3633513The CBC has undergone several cuts in recent years, and each time their programming is compromised.[/quote]

CBC's tax payer portion of their budget in 2009 was $930 million, by 2011 last budget it was at a billion.

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

For CBC TV's part, their mandate, or arguably the way they fulfill that mandate, or (also arguably) the way Canadian content is developed and broadcast, should be updated in my opinion, but their existence is essential to a healthy democracy.

You keep stating that CBC is reaquired for a healthy democracy, I disagree with you. If the CBC was apolitical you might have a point but it isn't.

You talk about Canadian content as a holy grail, but frankly its not like anyone is going out of their way to watch CBC programming, and Canadian content is being carried more successfully on other networks. For example shows like Rookie Blue and Degrassi and others don't seem to need a Canadian government broadcaster to survive.

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

CBC Radio is excellent. Unfortunately with the budget cuts, it's suffered and had to put on more repeats. It's doing an excellent job with what it's given, however. I am not looking forward to seeing what impact this latest round of cuts has.

The problem with CBC is that they're incredibly inefficient, they don't budget well, they spend money foolishly, their executives are incredibly corrupt and spend tax payer money like its their own, and then they refuse to live up to the actual government rules in terms of disclosing what they're spending our money on. CBC radio and T.V. are not doing an excellent job, their ratings are low and they constantly have a shortfall in selling advertising revenue so they're not all that appealing to their own demographic.

I don't think in the day and age of open airwaves and the internet that we need the CBC, we could keep news world and dump the rest of it and save a ton of money that can go to more important programs, like healthcare, or education or infrastructure or native living conditions, right now the CBC is just a big massive parasite run by spoiled children sucking up money.

Originally Posted by etherealgirl

I assume you are aware of the attack on the CBC by Sun Media/Quebecor and that much of what they've done politically/legally in the last couple of years has been in that context.

You choose to ignore that the CBC really started the whole thing by going after Quebecor right? The war was pretty much started when CBC decided to go after Sun Media's television statement (One that I don't watch) But the game got too tough for them when Quebecor and sun media actually used the nations law to make the CBC look ridiculous. And lets be honest, while CBC flailed around and spent a ton of money fighting sun media, sun media broke the story on George Stompolupusdingdongs near 6 figure ego party, the CBC's abuse of its travel, expense account, and equipment usage, broke a story on a memo distributed by the CBC executives on doing things like paying Ezra Levant and maybe hiring him so he wouldn't be mean.

Chop the CBC down to a news only channel cost to cost for a quarter of their budget, and create grants for creating canadian content that can be broadcast elsewhere. Or cut CBC funding, move it to a subscriber channel, force it to make up its shortfalls with ad revenue and let it survive or not based on subscriptions.

but don't tell me that CBC funding should take priority over most of the other programs that got cut.

[OffsideSpecialist]

Originally Posted by Azure

Read more: http://www.canada.com/business/2012+...#ixzz1qdIH33fm

??

From my travels it appears that they are rebuilding or renovating a lot of the train stations in smaller cities at the moment, while also upgrading their trains. That's probably where a lot of this money is going.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by OffsideSpecialist

From my travels it appears that they are rebuilding or renovating a lot of the train stations in smaller cities at the moment, while also upgrading their trains. That's probably where a lot of this money is going.

I don't understand it why public money has to pay for it when other rail companies like CP are privately funding.

If VIA can't hack it, sell it off.

[sevenarms]

If a campaign has a funding cut to the CBC proposed in an election platform they're not going to get a fair shake for TV coverage.

[OffsideSpecialist]

Originally Posted by Azure

I don't understand it why public money has to pay for it when other rail companies like CP are privately funding.

If VIA can't hack it, sell it off.

I don't disagree, but as long as it's a Crown Corporation the government is responsible for ensuring it's buildings aren't falling apart and that it has up to date equipment.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by OffsideSpecialist

I don't disagree, but as long as it's a Crown Corporation the government is responsible for ensuring it's buildings aren't falling apart and that it has up to date equipment.

I'm sure a corporation like that spends more than a few hundred million every year. I'll have to go look up the actual numbers.

I read somewhere a while back that VIA rail is struggling which is why I said they should be sold.

No reason the government needs to run it anymore when there are private companies doing the same thing.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by OffsideSpecialist

I don't disagree, but as long as it's a Crown Corporation the government is responsible for ensuring it's buildings aren't falling apart and that it has up to date equipment.

It certainly shouldn't be a crown corporation any more. Rail service isn't essential in this day an age, between highways and air travel.

When the gov't privatized the daylight service of via rail in 1990, they created proof that private operators could be much more efficient than Via. The Rocky Mountaineer has been investing money in expansion and winning awards for great service ever since. It's been hiring, and promoting our country abroad. (You can barely open a newspaper in Australia without seeing ads for Rocky Mountaineer tours). Via continues to suckle off the public teat. If it was privatized, at worst we'd be able to stop the bleeding, but there might be room for some economic train service in Canada. Their cross country and (especially) Toronto-Ottawa-Montreal services seem like they should be able to operate federal funding free.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Azure

I'm sure a corporation like that spends more than a few hundred million every year. I'll have to go look up the actual numbers.

I read somewhere a while back that VIA rail is struggling which is why I said they should be sold.

No reason the government needs to run it anymore when there are private companies doing the same thing.

Is that true? What private company provides national passenger rail service?

[OffsideSpecialist]

Yeah, I would have no problem with VIA being privatized, I agree with you guys. It seems like they should be doing a decent business though with the fact that many commuters use them on a daily basis in Southern Ontario and Quebec and that they are frequently used for business purposes between the major cities here. Must be their business through the prairies and in the Maritimes that is giving them trouble? If VIA were to ever go under, I imagine another rail company would come in to provide the same type of service between Windsor and Quebec City given how popular they are, and I don't think it would need to be a Crown Corp.

[Canuck-Hater]

Looks like cuts were made to Elections Canada... How friggin convenient And the head honcho of Elections Canada was invited to testify on the same day the Federal Budget was announced. Also, very convenient.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/stor...-thursday.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/stor...n.html?cmp=rss

"Elections Canada funding will be cut by $7.5 million a year, starting in 2012-13."

[Thrillingbroom]

Originally Posted by Canuck-Hater

Looks like cuts were made to Elections Canada... How friggin convenient And the head honcho of Elections Canada was invited to testify on the same day the Federal Budget was announced. Also, very convenient.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/stor...-thursday.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/stor...n.html?cmp=rss

"Elections Canada funding will be cut by $7.5 million a year, starting in 2012-13."

Elections Canada has authority to spend how much as needed to investigate any violations of the Elections Canada Act, so I don't really see what you are trying to get at.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Thrillingbroom

Elections Canada has authority to spend how much as needed to investigate any violations of the Elections Canada Act, so I don't really see what you are trying to get at.

Evil Conservative agenda etc etc.

[Canuck-Hater]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Evil Conservative agenda etc etc.

Actually im just stating the facts.

[etherealgirl]

Jacks -

- I quoted the promise in another post. I assume they wanted to look "moderate" before being elected, that's why.

- I can't find info on the cuts, so I retract that. There may have been speculation in the media, and I didn't absorb the details correctly in the haze of my life in the last couple of years. I assumed the radio repeats were a (lack of) funding issue.

- Nope, not Mansbridge. And not a stretch at all. We live in an age of media convergence and the more variety in accountability and ownership, the better, including public.

- Oh I agree there could be more efficiency (especially for TV). I was talking about Radio in this case. As for TV, really complex issue.

- I think they should provide information on how our money is spent, to an extent. There's a difference between this and a politically-motivated witch hunt, however. And I'm frankly more than happy paying <$50 per year for a national service in both official languages that I enjoy all the time.

[burn_this_city]

Why not complete transparency? The CBC is a crown corporation and should be accountable to the taxpayers for the money they spend. It's not a witch hunt, people want to know where $1B in tax dollars goes, which I think is a reasonable request.

[etherealgirl]

Captain Crunch -


- Right, so a lie isn't a lie if it serves a greater purpose. Like helping to win an election.

- Are you talking news, or lobbying, or....? As above, diversity of media ownership is important for democracy.

- Actually, lots of people are watching great Canadian programming, despite the significant obstacles that are sometimes required to produce it. Other networks are getting much better at producing CanCon, but there would be a serious dirth without the CBC.

- Actually, both TV and Radio are doing better than they ever have in the past. Do you actually watch or listen?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...ontent=2387386

- Also, the CBC is launching lots of new online initiatives. CBC 3 was an early one, now CBC Music channel, apps, lots of other stuff. They're not limiting themselves to traditional media.

- You may claim not to watch Sun, but you speak like a true Krista Erickson fan. Sun is such bull, sorry. And if you think Sun and Quebecor are not sleeping with the government and that all of this is not purely ideological, you have another thought coming.

- I don't actually disagree with you on the CBC needing to make some tough decisions and changes - TV, I mean. I think what many CBC fans find problematic is the cavalier way people talk about an institution that has served the country well for decades and continues to make a pretty big impact in a lot of people's lives, and deserves more than derision.

Now back to my family, sorry.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Why not complete transparency? The CBC is a crown corporation and should be accountable to the taxpayers for the money they spend. It's not a witch hunt, people want to know where $1B in tax dollars goes, which I think is a reasonable request.

I'm fine with that. I also want to know why the government is giving money to venture capitalists in this budget and where that $500M is going. Surely I can't be the only one on this who thinks that Steve and Jim ought to look in the mirror next time they trot out the not in the business of being in business" line.

[etherealgirl]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Why not complete transparency? The CBC is a crown corporation and should be accountable to the taxpayers for the money they spend. It's not a witch hunt, people want to know where $1B in tax dollars goes, which I think is a reasonable request.

Agree in general terms. I wonder though, when it's the Conservatives who just want to find excuses to get rid of it, or other broadcasters wanting competitive information. It's no coincidence that all this happened now. (And no, the CBC isn't blameless either).