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View Poll Results: When will the ring road be completed?
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1-3 years
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8 |
3.85% |
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4-7 years
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91 |
43.75% |
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7-10 years
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65 |
31.25% |
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10-20 years
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20 |
9.62% |
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Never
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24 |
11.54% |
07-13-2011, 03:51 PM
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#801
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CP Gamemaster
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: The Gary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
Exactly.
So much for hard-line stances.
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They didn't change the road or anything like that, so I'd say the government did just fine.
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07-13-2011, 03:54 PM
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#802
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Memento Mori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazrim
They didn't change the road or anything like that, so I'd say the government did just fine.
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Well, yeah, everybody did fine.
But according to some, the Indians, you know, the ones with the lands you whiteys want, deserved to be punished or some such other thing for not wanting your awesome deal because there was no way another such awesome deal was going to come along again...
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07-13-2011, 04:02 PM
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#803
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CP Gamemaster
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: The Gary
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Yes, only white people want to use the ring road! 
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07-13-2011, 04:04 PM
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#804
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazrim
Yes, only white people want to use the ring road! |
There is going to be a toll booth at the Grey Eagle off-ramp...
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07-13-2011, 04:07 PM
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#805
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Memento Mori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazrim
Yes, only white people want to use the ring road! |
There's no way us Asians will be able to drive in a loop without getting dizzy.
__________________
If you don't pass this sig to ten of your friends, you will become an Oilers fan.
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07-13-2011, 04:20 PM
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#806
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
Well, yeah, everybody did fine.
But according to some, the Indians, you know, the ones with the lands you whiteys want, deserved to be punished or some such other thing for not wanting your awesome deal because there was no way another such awesome deal was going to come along again...
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I was a relatively hard-liner. I figured that if no deal coul be made a contingency should be considered that involved cutting access at 37th.
In case you aren't aware part of negotiating means playing hardball and being able to walkaway if need be. That's actually the best position to be negotiating from.
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07-13-2011, 04:25 PM
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#807
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Wucka Wocka Wacka
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: East of the Rockies, West of the Rest
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When you put a deal in front of the Tsuu T'ina that says we will do our best to get you land elsewhere you can't be surprised that they would say no...
...say you were to going to sell your car for $20k...would you sign a contract to take 10K in cash and take the guys best efforts to get the remaining $10k? I wouldn't...and unless you would take that deal you shouldn't blame the Tsuu T'ina for not accepting it either. That's just a crap offer IMO.
But as a resident of Redwood Meadows I just hope they get this figured out quickly so we can get working on the lease renegotiation for the townsite.
__________________
"WHAT HAVE WE EVER DONE TO DESERVE THIS??? WHAT IS WRONG WITH US????" -Oiler Fan
"It was a debacle of monumental proportions." -MacT
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07-13-2011, 04:32 PM
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#808
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Memento Mori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slava
I was a relatively hard-liner. I figured that if no deal coul be made a contingency should be considered that involved cutting access at 37th.
In case you aren't aware part of negotiating means playing hardball and being able to walkaway if need be. That's actually the best position to be negotiating from.
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Well that's nice to say but the next best alternative for the gov't was significantly higher in cost.
Even indians can do math.
__________________
If you don't pass this sig to ten of your friends, you will become an Oilers fan.
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07-13-2011, 04:33 PM
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#809
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
Well that's nice to say but the next best alternative for the gov't was significantly higher in cost.
Even indians can do math.
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Well that's why there is a negotiation.
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07-13-2011, 04:38 PM
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#810
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CP Gamemaster
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: The Gary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
There's no way us Asians will be able to drive in a loop without getting dizzy.
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OH! So that's why it's always asian drivers going 20km/h in loop ramps. Blows my mind every time.
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07-13-2011, 05:49 PM
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#811
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Playboy Mansion Poolboy
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Close enough to make a beer run during a TV timeout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fozzie_DeBear
When you put a deal in front of the Tsuu T'ina that says we will do our best to get you land elsewhere you can't be surprised that they would say no...
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I guess it depends on what the exact wording was. I would almost wonder if there were words like "should be able to provide", etc due to the fact that it was possible the land might not be useable. Like if there was a train derailment that contamonated the land.
And of course there is the question of who wanted that conditional clause. Maybe the TT leaders or their lawyers asked that question, and the contract was modified to say "Land X if it is available and habitable; otherwise another parcel of land the same size as X."
It seems to me that if the deal being offered now is the same without conditions, the Province would have just offerred that right away when told the TT didn't like the condition part.
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07-14-2011, 10:11 AM
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#812
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
Well that's nice to say but the next best alternative for the gov't was significantly higher in cost.
Even indians can do math.
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I've always thought we should put a toll booth at the access at 37th street if we have to build the ring road the other way.
You know, to help cover all that extra cost.
They'd be within their rights to deny us the building of a road, and we'd be within our rights to charge for the use of our infrastructure.
$10 for every vehicle entering the casino? I think that is actually our BATNA (Best alternative to a Negotiated Agreement)
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07-14-2011, 10:28 AM
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#813
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Memento Mori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bizaro86
I've always thought we should put a toll booth at the access at 37th street if we have to build the ring road the other way.
You know, to help cover all that extra cost.
They'd be within their rights to deny us the building of a road, and we'd be within our rights to charge for the use of our infrastructure.
$10 for every vehicle entering the casino? I think that is actually our BATNA (Best alternative to a Negotiated Agreement)
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Well, if this isn't negotiating in good faith, I don't know what is.
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If you don't pass this sig to ten of your friends, you will become an Oilers fan.
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07-14-2011, 10:46 AM
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#814
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Calgary
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^ I think that, aside from possibly missing out on a huge cash and land compensation deal, the Tsuu T'ina are smart enough to realize that open access to the land nearest the city will benefit them immensely in terms of future development. I can't foresee access to the land being possible (politically or physically) if the ring road is running along the perimeter. Except, of course, the legally-obligated access point at Anderson Road.
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07-14-2011, 12:30 PM
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#815
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Calgary.
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^ Yup. The Nation's adjacent land doubles in value the minute the ring road in complete.
Prime spot for commercialization, and (to my limited knowledge) they can essentially build whatever the heck they feel like on their land.
Rejecting the deal makes losers out of EVERYONE involved. The flip side is that acceptance of the deal makes us all winners.
__________________
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07-14-2011, 02:10 PM
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#816
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
Well, if this isn't negotiating in good faith, I don't know what is.
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Both sides have a lot to gain from making this work. At some point, if a deal can't be reached, you need to go with your best alternative to making a deal.
There would be a lot of value from making that deal. The band would get the $, replacement land, and a huge increase in the value of their remaining land. The city would get to build the road in a way that actually makes sense.
If the two groups can't reach a deal, eventually you have to move on and build the back up plan. I'm not sure why we'd continue to give the band's casino free access to our infrastructure in that situation...
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08-30-2011, 10:51 AM
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#818
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Voted for Kodos
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The Nose Hill Drive Interchange is out for tender. It looks like a lot of work - it includes:
A bridge taking Nose Hill Drive over Stoney Trail
Widening the existing Stoney Trail bridge over the CP Rail tracks
A new bridge for the southbound lanes of Stoney Trail over the CP Rail tracks
A new pedestrian bridge over the CP Rail tracks
A wildlife underpass under Nose Hill Drive
Three pedestrian underpasses, under Stoney, Nose Hill Drive, and one ramp.
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08-30-2011, 11:33 AM
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#819
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed
The Nose Hill Drive Interchange is out for tender. It looks like a lot of work - it includes:
A bridge taking Nose Hill Drive over Stoney Trail
Widening the existing Stoney Trail bridge over the CP Rail tracks
A new bridge for the southbound lanes of Stoney Trail over the CP Rail tracks
A new pedestrian bridge over the CP Rail tracks
A wildlife underpass under Nose Hill Drive
Three pedestrian underpasses, under Stoney, Nose Hill Drive, and one ramp.
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Over my dead body!! grumble, grumble. What a waste. Silly Hall! Druh Farrell! Lattes!!
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08-30-2011, 11:49 AM
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#820
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Such a pretty girl!
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed
The Nose Hill Drive Interchange is out for tender. It looks like a lot of work - it includes:
Widening the existing Stoney Trail bridge over the CP Rail tracks
A new bridge for the southbound lanes of Stoney Trail over the CP Rail tracks
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Why would they both widen and add an additional bridge over the tracks?
Are they making it 3 lanes each direction? Does this effect the bridge over the river?
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Last edited by BlackArcher101; 08-30-2011 at 11:53 AM.
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