2011 Canadian Election Thread

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Well with the Liberal platform this election, if either of Ignatieff or Layton lead a coalition gov't, it will be very socialist like. At this point is there really a discernable difference between the two? I don't believe so, and it wouldn't matter who assumed the PMO.

Well, I am assuming that the Liberals don't actually mean anything they say. The Liberal party doesn't stand for anything except power - they'll say whatever they need to gain it - so, I would never really worry about a Liberal majority. I know they govern for the benefit of Upper Canada, but will not do anything crazy. However, the NDP is a party of people who want to steal my money and rich people who feel guilty about being rich (Jack Layton), so any scenario where they have power would scare me.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Well, I am assuming that the Liberals don't actually mean anything they say. The Liberal party doesn't stand for anything except power - they'll say whatever they need to gain it - so, I would never really worry about a Liberal majority. I know they govern for the benefit of Upper Canada, but will not do anything crazy. However, the NDP is a party of people who want to steal my money and rich people who feel guilty about being rich (Jack Layton), so any scenario where they have power would scare me.

Aren't you a communist? wouldn't you want the NDP in charge/

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by Ark2

The Liberals at least attempt to explain how they are going to pay for their budget. The NDP have long since figured out that their supporters are too stupid to worry about how they will pay for their free ride. I would have an inkling of hope with the Liberals in charge. With the NDP, the Canadian market would take a beating as soon as Layton becomes PM. I shudder to think of what would happen once that moron begins to jack up taxes.

That's not unlike how most of their core supporters run their finances too. If a unrealistic terrible policy like the credit card cap of prime + 5% appeals to you, I bet your own household platform is costed out in similar fashion to the NDP one.

[Stranger]

If Jack becomes PM how long is it until the credit card companies leave Canada. I can't see them making money if rates are capped at 5% above prime. Or at least any incentive plan on the card will be scrapped.

[Nehkara]

Well, since I've always been the token NDPer here, I figure I should speak up.

Nanos Research rolling poll released this morning:

CPC: 36.6%
NDP: 30.4%
LIB: 21.9%
BQ: 6.0%
GRN: 4.1%


BTW, all of you folks who are doing the lemming thing over the possibility of Jack Layton as Prime Minister are kind of ridiculous. I don't mean this is as an indictment but for the same reason I have little reason to fear a CPC minority (they can't push through their social conservative bills on many issues), you also have little reason to fear an NDP minority. The NDP won't win a majority even if they do scrounge up enough seats to be the minority, which still looks less than likely.

It was time for a change in Canadian politics and I'm glad it appears to have come at the cost of the BQ.

Here's hoping for the NDP as the Official Opposition... or maybe, just maybe... minority government.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

Aren't you a communist? wouldn't you want the NDP in charge/

That's my father.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Well, since I've always been the token NDPer here, I figure I should speak up.

Nanos Research rolling poll released this morning:

CPC: 36.6%
NDP: 30.4%
LIB: 21.9%
BQ: 6.0%
GRN: 4.1%


BTW, all of you folks who are doing the lemming thing over the possibility of Jack Layton as Prime Minister are kind of ridiculous. I don't mean this is as an indictment but for the same reason I have little reason to fear a CPC minority (they can't push through their social conservative bills on many issues), you also have little reason to fear an NDP minority. The NDP won't win a majority even if they do scrounge up enough seats to be the minority, which still looks less than likely.

It was time for a change in Canadian politics and I'm glad it appears to have come at the cost of the BQ.

Here's hoping for the NDP as the Official Opposition... or maybe, just maybe... minority government.

What about an NDP lead coalition with the Libs and BQ though?

They can push through whatever they like as long as they get those votes, and to get those votes they will be giving both some say...and i have little doubt that layton would do so in heartbeat...since he was already part of one attempt.

[Ark2]

Originally Posted by Stranger

If Jack becomes PM how long is it until the credit card companies leave Canada. I can't see them making money if rates are capped at 5% above prime. Or at least any incentive plan on the card will be scrapped.

I doubt they leave, but things would definitely change. What I find so amazing is that the left generally are very concerned for the environment and are conscious about how what we do now will affect future generations. Yet, when it comes to future sustainability of the economy, their stance seems to be "screw it, let the next generation worry about." Very odd.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Ark2

I doubt they leave, but things would definitely change. What I find so amazing is that the left generally are very concerned for the environment and are conscious about how what we do now will affect future generations. Yet, when it comes to future sustainability of the economy, their stance seems to be "screw it, let the next generation worry about." Very odd.

Come on - they've thought it all out - "the corporations" and "the rich" will pay for all of it.

[Ark2]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Well, since I've always been the token NDPer here, I figure I should speak up.

Nanos Research rolling poll released this morning:

CPC: 36.6%
NDP: 30.4%
LIB: 21.9%
BQ: 6.0%
GRN: 4.1%


BTW, all of you folks who are doing the lemming thing over the possibility of Jack Layton as Prime Minister are kind of ridiculous. I don't mean this is as an indictment but for the same reason I have little reason to fear a CPC minority (they can't push through their social conservative bills on many issues), you also have little reason to fear an NDP minority. The NDP won't win a majority even if they do scrounge up enough seats to be the minority, which still looks less than likely.

It was time for a change in Canadian politics and I'm glad it appears to have come at the cost of the BQ.

Here's hoping for the NDP as the Official Opposition... or maybe, just maybe... minority government.

If the NDP win a minority, the Liberals will support them (or at least abstain from defeating them) just like they did with the Conservatives. They'll do this because they can't afford to go back to the polls given how weak their party will be after this upcoming election. An NDP minority means that we are all screwed. As bad as the BQ is, they could never do as much damage as the NDP can.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Well, since I've always been the token NDPer here, I figure I should speak up.

Nanos Research rolling poll released this morning:

CPC: 36.6%
NDP: 30.4%
LIB: 21.9%
BQ: 6.0%
GRN: 4.1%

I just wanted to say that this poll (along with others that have come out recently), and the ridiculous press conference this morning for Harper has to be somewhat infuriating to the CPC faithful? I don't even mean from a policy/partisan standpoint either. I just mean from the perspective that the majority had to have been within their grasp early on in the campaign, but a terrible strategy in terms of the actual campaign is going to see that disappear, and even worse reduce their number of seats.

I know its easy to look at the Liberals and say what a disaster for them (and it ain't pretty!), but this sure doesn't look like its time for the CPC to gloat either. What a train wreck.

The other thing that seems to be showing as more likely is Elizabeth May winning her seat against Lunn.

[IliketoPuck]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Come on - they've thought it all out - "the corporations" and "the rich" will pay for all of it.

Ferraris and Mansions for all the underpriviledged. We can just hike the taxes on russian lawyers to pay for it, they like communism anyways so it will be a breath of fresh air to them, right comrade?

[Ark2]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Come on - they've thought it all out - "the corporations" and "the rich" will pay for all of it.

lol

I know. They'll raise taxes and when they find that doing so does nothing to actually raise tax revenue, they'll have to borrow money. When I think of the amount of debt that Bob Rae was able to sink Ontario with in just a few short years, it literally scares the crap out of me thinking what the NDP could do with all of Canada. Some frightening times.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by IliketoPuck

Ferraris and Mansions for all the underpriviledged. We can just hike the taxes on russian lawyers to pay for it, they like communism anyways so it will be a breath of fresh air to them, right comrade?

If the NDP runs the Fed, I will donate $1,000 to a credible Alberta/Western separatist party... should one come into existence.

[Matty81]

Woke up to read the latest Nanos poll in the globe which I think is the best polling organization and wow is all I can say. Awesome to see the election get interesting - I'm still not sure who I'm voting for but I enjoy a good contest.

I think all the hairpulling about the NDP is kind of ridiculous. I've never voted for them to this point but the alliance/reform people villainizing them is borderline comical. A coalition with the liberals would be a pretty solid check on them fiscally - the last couple liberal governments spent way less money than the current government.

[IliketoPuck]

People can't honestly be ignorant/un-informed enough to actually vote for the NDP can they?

Anyone in their right mind can see that Jack Layton promises the moon, because he has never had to actually follow through with his fairy tale promises. His entire election campaign is built around unsustainable fiscal policy that will end up dragging Canada much deeper into debt, which in the medium/long term is the absolute worst thing possible. Raising taxes to the levels he is talking about will stagnate our economy faster than you can say Joseph Stalin.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by Stranger

If Jack becomes PM how long is it until the credit card companies leave Canada. I can't see them making money if rates are capped at 5% above prime. Or at least any incentive plan on the card will be scrapped.

Actually it's pretty clear what would happen as a result of this policy.

1) If I were a credit card company I would immediately drop the credit limit of anyone with a balance and medium to low credit to exactly that balance and lower it with every reduction of principal that person makes. Futhermore I wouldn't issue new cards to new accounts without pristine credit history, because credit card debt is unsecured. This isn't really being predatory, it's really protecting your own behind because the only thing that allows the credit card company to give money away that people take decades to pay back without collateral is insanly high interest payments.So basically this removes a credit card from a lot of people's wallets.

2) To make up for losses, the credit card companies are going to grind businesses on transaction fees, which will in turn raise prices for the consumer.

3) The end result will be higher prices on goods that are purchased with credit cards and lower credit capacity among purchasers. This obviously leads to less transactions occuring, lower business profits, worse economy in the short to medium term.

4) The only shining light with this policy is that it might for the long run remove a blunt object that so many people use to hit themselves in the head with. Credit card debt keeps poor people poor. This would take away the ability of so many people from self harming themselves.

[Ark2]

Originally Posted by Matty81

Woke up to read the latest Nanos poll in the globe which I think is the best polling organization and wow is all I can say. Awesome to see the election get interesting - I'm still not sure who I'm voting for but I enjoy a good contest.

I think all the hairpulling about the NDP is kind of ridiculous. I've never voted for them to this point but the alliance/reform people villainizing them is borderline comical. A coalition with the liberals would be a pretty solid check on them fiscally - the last couple liberal governments spent way less money than the current government.

Okay, please answer this question for me:

Why would the Liberals keep the NDP in check? First, their platforms are virtually identical, so it's not like they are this great fiscally conservative babysitter. Second, their party will be extremely weak and they won't be able to enter another election until they have sorted our some serious issues within their party. That being said, they will have no choice but to support NDP bills as defeating them would mean going to election that they aren't even remotely ready for.

[automaton 3]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Well, since I've always been the token NDPer here, I figure I should speak up.

Nanos Research rolling poll released this morning:

CPC: 36.6%
NDP: 30.4%
LIB: 21.9%
BQ: 6.0%
GRN: 4.1%


BTW, all of you folks who are doing the lemming thing over the possibility of Jack Layton as Prime Minister are kind of ridiculous. I don't mean this is as an indictment but for the same reason I have little reason to fear a CPC minority (they can't push through their social conservative bills on many issues), you also have little reason to fear an NDP minority. The NDP won't win a majority even if they do scrounge up enough seats to be the minority, which still looks less than likely.

It was time for a change in Canadian politics and I'm glad it appears to have come at the cost of the BQ.

Here's hoping for the NDP as the Official Opposition... or maybe, just maybe... minority government.

Please name one, with evidence to back up your claim.

[Matty81]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

Actually it's pretty clear what would happen as a result of this policy.

1) If I were a credit card company I would immediately drop the credit limit of anyone with a balance and medium to low credit to exactly that balance and lower it with every reduction of principal that person makes. Futhermore I wouldn't issue new cards to new accounts without pristine credit history, because credit card debt is unsecured. This isn't really being predatory, it's really protecting your own behind because the only thing that allows the credit card company to give money away that people take decades to pay back without collateral is insanly high interest payments.So basically this removes a credit card from a lot of people's wallets.

2) To make up for losses, the credit card companies are going to grind businesses on transaction fees, which will in turn raise prices for the consumer.

3) The end result will be higher prices on goods that are purchased with credit cards and lower credit capacity among purchasers. This obviously leads to less transactions occuring, lower business profits, worse economy in the short to medium term.

4) The only shining light with this policy is that it might for the long run remove a blunt object that so many people use to hit themselves in the head with. Credit card debt keeps poor people poor. This would take away the ability of so many people from self harming themselves.

I think you're definately right in assuming credit cards will not be as common. Any bill legislating maximum interest rates is surely going to have some laws around other fees to circumvent workarounds though.