2011 Blue Jays Season Thread

[ricoFlame]

Snider is a zoo in left.

[burn_this_city]

Buckholtz is struggling, keeps loading the bases with bad walks.

[nik-]

Is this seriously going to happen again?

[Caged Great]

Yep, the pen is doing a bang up job. What is their problem.

[HamptonIce]

The jays better close this out with two outs and 0-2

[nik-]

jesus ... not making it easy on us are they?

[Jiggy_12]

Nice win...great comeback in a tough ballpark. Love to see that loaded sox lineup lose.

[Matty81]

Man the pen is sucking, that was a bit scary. They just couldn't seem to throw strikes even with a huge lead again.

Oh well, still was sweet to see Boston get kicked in the shins. A little freaked out by Jo-Jo starting tomorrow though, I hope he doesn't get beat up as bad as I think he will.

[Saint Troy]

Nice win considering the adversity at the start, easily Cecil's best effort and a sweet close by Rauch. Farrell needs to get a horsewhip for the relievers who don't throw strikes, and Juan Rivera needs to be released.

[The Big Chill]

Originally Posted by Saint Troy

Nice win considering the adversity at the start, easily Cecil's best effort and a sweet close by Rauch. Farrell needs to get a horsewhip for the relievers who don't throw strikes, and Juan Rivera needs to be released.

Agreed on both points. We really need the bullpen to step it up, especially with how young this starting staff is.

[JayP]

I thought a younger guy like Farrell would be a refreshing change with his bullpen management, but clearly it's just going to be more of the slave to the save stuff we've see for years here.

Why you decide to go with Janssen, who was called up from AAA just days before, to get you out of a 2-out jam in the 8th instead of Rauch is beyond me. That situation right there is the game - not the ridiculously easy 3-run lead save situation. The Jays won in spite of it, but bullpen management like this will cost the Jays games this year and their margin for error is razor thin is they want a sniff at the playoffs.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by Matty81

Are there CBA/Contract clauses that would prevent a guy on Rivera's contract from being sent to AAA in baseball?

No.

He would likely be released though, he makes our AAA team worse.

[Caged Great]

If you DFA'ed him with intentions to release him, you could possibly find someone to take him (Pirates) if you covered most of his costs.

Still worth it to be rid of VW

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by JayP

I thought a younger guy like Farrell would be a refreshing change with his bullpen management, but clearly it's just going to be more of the slave to the save stuff we've see for years here.

Why you decide to go with Janssen, who was called up from AAA just days before, to get you out of a 2-out jam in the 8th instead of Rauch is beyond me. That situation right there is the game - not the ridiculously easy 3-run lead save situation. The Jays won in spite of it, but bullpen management like this will cost the Jays games this year and their margin for error is razor thin is they want a sniff at the playoffs.

It's a tough decision. it's a risk using Rauch to get 4 outs in the first game of an important 4 game series. Closers are delicate and don't like going more than an inning. If Rauch comes in and blows it, not only do the Jays lose the game but he's less effective because it's in his head and he's tired. The bullpen becomes ruined for the whole weekend.

As you said, the margin for error is razor thin. It's going to be a roller coaster all year.

[Caged Great]

Personally, I would have the closer out in any tough situation like if the 3-4-5 hitters were coming up in the 8th or if the tying run was on deck or at bat. Who cares about the 9th if it's the 7-8-9 hitters as you're just as likely to shut the door having Camp, Francisco, Villaneuva out there instead of Rauch.

Just make sure that your best and 2nd best relievers are not used until the 8th and 9th and you're set. I don't see the point in having a guy like Janssen out there in a high impact situation that can directly affect the game, or Dotel last week when we blew it to the Mariners. If they throw Rauch out there after Purcey screws up, you're likely going to stop the comeback, and game over we win.

[Caged Great]

Lawrie's also making quite a push to get recalled. He's hitting .441 with a 1.219 OPS. If Rivera continues to suck, maybe he'll get DFA'ed and Lawrie will get a shot at 3rd.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

It's a tough decision. it's a risk using Rauch to get 4 outs in the first game of an important 4 game series. Closers are delicate and don't like going more than an inning. If Rauch comes in and blows it, not only do the Jays lose the game but he's less effective because it's in his head and he's tired. The bullpen becomes ruined for the whole weekend.

As you said, the margin for error is razor thin. It's going to be a roller coaster all year.

It's actually not a tough decision at all. It's just a question of using rational thought instead of traditional baseball logic.

How are closers delicate? I don't see how being the guy assigned to pitch the 9th inning of ball games makes them any different than any other reliever.

Either way, I don't care if Rauch can only get 3 outs. Have him get the 3rd out of the 8th and the 1st and 2nd of the 9th if the guy is so fragile that pitching more than an inning will ruin his career. It would give your team the best chance of winning which is what should be most important to the players, not accumulating saves. Then let whatever mediocre reliever you want get the final out in the 9th with 2 outs.

Relievers are just as capable as getting 4-6 outs as there were 10-20+ years ago. The difference is the ridiculous save stat (which should be abolished) and how it gets guys paid. It's baffling that managers still manage around it though because an obvious case of putting personal numbers ahead of the team.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by JayP

It's actually not a tough decision at all. It's just a question of using rational thought instead of traditional baseball logic.

How are closers delicate? I don't see how being the guy assigned to pitch the 9th inning of ball games makes them any different than any other reliever.

Either way, I don't care if Rauch can only get 3 outs. Have him get the 3rd out of the 8th and the 1st and 2nd of the 9th if the guy is so fragile that pitching more than an inning will ruin his career. It would give your team the best chance of winning which is what should be most important to the players, not accumulating saves. Then let whatever mediocre reliever you want get the final out in the 9th with 2 outs.

Relievers are just as capable as getting 4-6 outs as there were 10-20+ years ago. The difference is the ridiculous save stat (which should be abolished) and how it gets guys paid. It's baffling that managers still manage around it though because an obvious case of putting personal numbers ahead of the team.

You can't use a closer everyday whenever this situation comes up. There are 162 games. Closers can pitch maybe 80 innings a season? Also a team needs to use the rest of the bullpen in certain situations too.

A pitcher in the 9th is definitely different than the rest. It's the end of the game! Yes it maybe a macho thing and a confidence thing. I think it's for the good of the team to have a set closer for the 9th and have confidence in the rest of the bullpen to pick up the rest. You want the other team to know "HEY, if you're down in the 9th, you're dead" Bring in the closer in the 8th is usually a sign of panic.

[Matty81]

Reyes is looking scary again, 2 runs in the first will be lucky here.

[Gozer]

Quite the recovery in the 1st.

Snider embarasses Beckett on the basepaths.

Reyes doesn't look bad today, he could settle right in for a quality start - but things are already looking gloomy in the 2nd.