Ezra Levant Talk at the U of C

[Kybosh]

I actually thought Levant made some compelling arguments supporting the oil sands in "Ethical Oil". Making an argument based on ethics is quite tricky but I thought he did a swell job.

[Jimmy Stang]

Originally Posted by bigearl

How does he appear in the pictures?

The photos are good. A few suggestions:

- Trim down your selection more. 5 good ones of the primary subject is plenty. One or two of the intro, closing remarks, etc are fine.
- There are a few where is hand and/or fingers are cropped outside of the frame, which many people find awkward. Either crop closely deliberately, or make sure his arm waving stays within the frame with a little bit of a buffer,
- It would be good to see some closer shots instead of a bunch of the same 3/4 length ones. I am guessing that you were limited by your lens, however.

Technically, they're fine though. No blur, decently exposed, etc.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by rubecube

How is saying that money spent on Canadian oil goes to a government who enforces environmental standards and doesn't use the money to oppress it's people, as opposed to money that goes to the Saudis, where everything is the exact opposite, a logical fallacy?

I'm reminded of the old Dudley Moore movie Crazy People where Moore's character is a burnt-out advertising executive who ends up in an insane asylum. There he concocts a campaign for the Greek tourism council that went "Visit Greece, we're nicer than the French."

So I take it Newman's pitch is "Buy your oil from those nice Canadians."

How about the same for those nice, Canadian wheat farmers? Or those nice, Canadian auto-workers?

The same companies drilling in Nigeria or Saudi Arabia do business in Alberta too.

His pitch does nothing to protect the Canadian environment, nor does it do anything to help oppressed third-world people.

[bigearl]

..

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

I'm reminded of the old Dudley Moore movie Crazy People where Moore's character is a burnt-out advertising executive who ends up in an insane asylum. There he concocts a campaign for the Greek tourism council that went "Visit Greece, we're nicer than the French."

So I take it Newman's pitch is "Buy your oil from those nice Canadians."

How about the same for those nice, Canadian wheat farmers? Or those nice, Canadian auto-workers?

The same companies drilling in Nigeria or Saudi Arabia do business in Alberta too.

Yes they are, but we can at least regulate them here. The more business they do here, the less they do in those other countries.

His pitch does nothing to protect the Canadian environment, nor does it do anything to help oppressed third-world people.

How can you possibly know that it wouldn't help at all? It sounds like you're more concerned with the NIMBY aspect of things than the plight of people in those countries.

I'm not disagreeing with you that its idealistic and probably a bit naive, but there is logic behind it and it's an interesting take on the situation.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by rubecube

How can you possibly know that it wouldn't help at all? It sounds like you're more concerned with the NIMBY aspect of things than the plight of people in those countries.

Yup, dumping dangerous toxins into the ecosystem is a NIMBY issue. Got me there.

Originally Posted by rubecube

I'm not disagreeing with you that its idealistic and probably a bit naive, but there is logic behind it and it's an interesting take on the situation.

I'd say Ezra's keenly interested in his "take."

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Yup, dumping dangerous toxins into the ecosystem is a NIMBY issue. Got me there.

But your posts imply that it's only Canada's ecosystem you're concerned about, whereas the way we produce oil is actually more eco-friendly than countries like Nigeria and Saudi Arabia.

Do you honestly think relying on foreign oil, propping up despotic regimes in the process, is better than producing it in Canada?

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by rubecube

But your posts imply that it's only Canada's ecosystem you're concerned about, whereas the way we produce oil is actually more eco-friendly than countries like Nigeria and Saudi Arabia.

Do you honestly think relying on foreign oil, propping up despotic regimes in the process, is better than producing it in Canada?

Please.

Ezra Levant is a professional polemicist. I doubt it's even the issues that are important to him any more, it's all about political theatre. Fair enough. He's apparently making a good living at it.

Patting Canadians on the back for being such swell lads doesn't address the issues.

But enjoy your lollypop.

[bigearl]

..

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Please.

Ezra Levant is a professional polemicist. I doubt it's even the issues that are important to him any more, it's all about political theatre. Fair enough. He's apparently making a good living at it.

Patting Canadians on the back for being such swell lads doesn't address the issues.

But enjoy your lollypop.

Isn't it then a question of scale? A large amount of lollypops will make someone sick. However isn't a lollypop followed by a tummy ache better than Middle Eastern lollypops with razorblades in them?

[Azure]

The solution is not to simply stop drilling for the stuff. Solution is to replace the need to drill for the oil with alternative energy. Until then the oil sands are about the best choice in the world.

[Kybosh]

Originally Posted by Azure

The solution is not to simply stop drilling for the stuff. Solution is to replace the need to drill for the oil with alternative energy. Until then the oil sands are about the best choice in the world.

It isn't just about energy either. Oil is the feedstock for damn near everything (materials, pharmaceuticals, luxury yachts. . . you name it).

[HOZ]

Erza Lavant's argument is simple enough and makes sense:

Until those magical dilithium crystals are found that will power everything using oil, coal and Nuclear energy is the most efficient ways to go. They is not the cleanest but it is by far more efficient that wind farms and solar plants. Using our know how to continue to clean these sources of energy up is the way to go until we develop an equally (hopefully MORE) efficient source of energy. Until then, we can choose to get this from Canada or we can continue to fund the a$$holes of the world.

[bigearl]

..

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by HOZ

Erza Lavant's argument is simple enough and makes sense:

Until those magical dilithium crystals are found that will power everything using oil, coal and Nuclear energy is the most efficient ways to go. They is not the cleanest but it is by far more efficient that wind farms and solar plants. Using our know how to continue to clean these sources of energy up is the way to go until we develop an equally (hopefully MORE) efficient source of energy. Until then, we can choose to get this from Canada or we can continue to fund the a$$holes of the world.

One cannot abrogate one's personal responsibility simply because the other guy does.

Same goes for countries.

Levant is pitching a gimmick, a schtick, a sound bite. A mantra. Repeatedly advancing the meme of "Ethical Oil" does not make it so.

Oil commodities will continue to be bought and sold irrespective of origin or extraction methods and regardless of Levant's efforts to play Stewart Smalley to the Canadian oilpatch industry.

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Oil commodities will continue to be bought and sold irrespective of origin or extraction methods and regardless of Levant's efforts to play Stewart Smalley to the Canadian oilpatch industry.

Agree totally. But, do we not have a choice of WHERE we get our oil?

Alberta vs OPEC

Who produces their oil cleaner? Alberta
Which do you think will try to improve the way they effect the environment due internal or external forces? Alberta
Who treats their workers better? Alberta
Who pays their workers better? Alberta
Which has a democratic government? Alberta
Which has more freedom? Alberta
Which place give better economic boost to the rest of the Canadian economy? Alberta

So...What have we abrogated by choosing the Oil Sands?



BTW: Soon enough it will be Saskatchewan and Alberta voiced in the same sentence.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by HOZ

Agree totally. But, do we not have a choice of WHERE we get our oil?

Alberta vs OPEC

Who produces their oil cleaner? Alberta
Which do you think will try to improve the way they effect the environment due internal or external forces? Alberta
Who treats their workers better? Alberta
Who pays their workers better? Alberta
Which has a democratic government? Alberta
Which has more freedom? Alberta
Which place give better economic boost to the rest of the Canadian economy? Alberta

So...What have we abrogated by choosing the Oil Sands?



BTW: Soon enough it will be Saskatchewan and Alberta voiced in the same sentence.

The gas in your car tank. Right now. (Assuming you have a car).

Where is it from?

Don't know?

Ezra Levant has this preposterous notion that it's okay to pollute the Athabaska River because Imams chop off the clitorises of little girls in the Sudan.

It's altogether an insane notion, and actually quite offensive.

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

The gas in your car tank. Right now. (Assuming you have a car).

1)Where is it from?

Don't know?

2)Ezra Levant has this preposterous notion that it's okay to pollute the Athabaska River because Imams chop off the clitorises of little girls in the Sudan.

It's altogether an insane notion, and actually quite offensive.

1) I am in Japan. So...either Iran or Saudi Arabia. Albertans get theirs' from the Oil Sands. Ontario...somewhere from OPEC. How could I possibly know? That is where their supplies come from. Simple.

2) He is not being preposterous. You are. He is not saying that.

Which oil is produced cleaner, has had more environmental oversight and actually puts money toward improving the way they produce it? OPEC or Alberta?

Which person would you want to receive your money when you pump gas into your vehicle? A Calgary Oil company or a nation that promotes terrorism?

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Please.

Ezra Levant is a professional polemicist. I doubt it's even the issues that are important to him any more, it's all about political theatre. Fair enough. He's apparently making a good living at it.

Patting Canadians on the back for being such swell lads doesn't address the issues.

But enjoy your lollypop.

Again you've failed to address any of the content of his argument and resorted to ad hominem attacks.

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

The gas in your car tank. Right now. (Assuming you have a car).

Where is it from?

Don't know?

Ezra Levant has this preposterous notion that it's okay to pollute the Athabaska River because Imams chop off the clitorises of little girls in the Sudan.

It's altogether an insane notion, and actually quite offensive.

Your arguments scream personal bias, and your statements show that you've made no attempt to read or listen to Levant's argument objectively (if at all). The issue isn't just about human rights. Alberta oil has shown to be much more ecologically friendly than its OPEC counterparts.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by bigearl

That being said, just because something hasn't been invented we are not excused from environmental responsibilty. In an academic sense his arguments fall on a logical fallacy. He is not allowed to speak at McGill for this reason apparently.

Which logical fallacy would that be? Levant isn't denying that the tar sands are bad, he's arguing that they're the best option until a different alternative has been found. Who do you think spends more of their profits green energy research, OPEC or Canada?