Egypt leaves the Internet, citizens revolt. Update: Internet's back, still revolting.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by HOZ

IMO, it is very unlikely that Egypt will become a democracy. It has absolutely no recent history of it like South Africa had when it turned. History that is alive in the opposition and able to direct the country towards democracy.

Umm, I'm sorry but I would say Egypt has a better history in democracy than South Africa did. Although it's pretty much apples and oranges. At the very least I'd call it equal.

Egypt has had elections, and even though it's debatable how much (or little) they mattered, there was real and somewhat open political debate especially around the 2005 elections. So Mubarak is actually not completely lying when he says he's done some good for political rights in Egypt.

Also, the Muslim Brotherhood is not like Hizbollah or Hamas. Even the US government doesn't consider them terrorists, which is saying a lot since they'd propably consider the Red Crescent a terrorist organization if it wasn't for Red Cross.

I think this is a good read, even though it's clear the writer was more than a little PO'd when writing it:

"How not to say stupid stuff about egypt"
http://sarthanapalos.wordpress.com/2...f-about-egypt/

[Hanni]

Sounds like the situation on the streets is getting worse.

1. 1446: The BBC's Jim Muir in Cairo says: "I've just come back from Tahrir square and the atmosphere has changed completely from what it was like over the past few days. Near the national museum, there is a sort of front line that has been established between the protesters and supporters of President Mubarak. A lot of rocks are being thrown. I saw people breaking up the pavements so they could have sharp bits of stone to throw. In the last few minutes, there have been some shots ringing out, though it is not clear where they are coming from. The army is not trying to intervene. Its troops are not trained in how to deal with riots, and I do not know how the situation will be defused."

[transplant99]

This thing is getting ugly and really quickly. Mubarek has sent in his security force (thousands) to confront the anti-government group and fighting is erupting. Chaos all over that part of Cairo and they say all over the country...and it was obviously calculated and planned.

If you are around a TV I suggest you turn on one of the news channels, CNN is right on the edge showing history unfold. Unfortunately it is going to be bloody and clearly this is the start of a civil war.

[FlameOn]

So... it's only the police types who abandoned their posts earlier? Or some of Mubarak's personal thugs?

Shame this is going to end with a lot of blood... going to mess up whatever government that ends up taking over.

[worth]

http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/

[burn_this_city]

Nice work US, good job keeping your "ally" in check. There wont be a civil war, these Mubarak supporters are police and hangers on from the regime.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Nice work US, good job keeping your "ally" in check. There wont be a civil war, these Mubarak supporters are police and hangers on from the regime.

LOL!!!

Yup...blame the US...for everything.

Good grief.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by transplant99

LOL!!!

Yup...blame the US...for everything.

Good grief.

They deserve the blame.

This clash going on right now has been orcestrated by their buddy trying to maintain power. Perhaps if the US actually did the right thing for once and told him to get out days ago we wouldnt be at this point.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

They deserve the blame.

This clash going on right now has been orcestrated by their buddy trying to maintain power. Perhaps if the US actually did the right thing for once and told him to get out days ago we wouldnt be at this point.

You want the US to all of a sudden stop backing a government they have been supporting politically and financially for the last 30 years?

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

You want the US to all of a sudden stop backing a government they have been supporting politically and financially for the last 30 years?

Silly me, wouldnt want America to have any principles.

[VladtheImpaler]

Burn, do you live on Earth or on some fantasy world where nations have no national interests or priorities?

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Silly me, wouldnt want America to have any principles.

[burn_this_city]

I'm sick of hearing people try to justify this garbage. There is absolutely no reason these people shouldnt get democracy and the same freedoms we enjoy.

[worth]

I'm pretty sure that's what their in the midst of trying to do.

I'm sorry, I don't see the connection you're trying to make to the US at the moment.

I realize they have supported an Autocratic government for 30 years, for those 30 years they hung the Egyptian people out to dry by supporting this government. We realize that. BUt at them moment, this has nothing to do with the US. Perhaps the US helped to put these people in this situation, but at the moment, the US doesn't have a say.

You can not expect ANY government to come out and say they don't support the current government in power of a country that is an ally. You are insane if you think that is going to happen. Why would they? The outcome is still very much up in the air. What happens if they say "we support the people" and Mubarak gains power back. Now what? The US just said they supported the people, what are they supposed to do with Mubarak now? It's all politics, and you really can't expect any government is going to say anything other than "we hope this is resolved without violence".

Egyptians should get a chance at a democracy. That's why their throwing stones at Mubarak's people.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

I'm sick of hearing people try to justify this garbage. There is absolutely no reason these people shouldnt get democracy and the same freedoms we enjoy.

Hold on, hold on - what garbage? What do you want the Americans to do? Assassinate Mubarak? I think they would love Egypt to be democratic, but I also think all reasonable people should be scared of Hamas (Egypt) coming to power. It's a very delicate situation...

[FlameOn]

Plus... America has to play things very carefully in the middle east. US is so universally hated over there that any overt support for a particular side could doom that side.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by worth

I'm pretty sure that's what their in the midst of trying to do.

I'm sorry, I don't see the connection you're trying to make to the US at the moment.

I realize they have supported an Autocratic government for 30 years, for those 30 years they hung the Egyptian people out to dry by supporting this government. We realize that.

Egyptians should get a chance at a democracy. That's why their throwing stones at Mubarak's people!

When it was clear that Mubarak was finished the US should have pressured him to leave. If he hangs on until September the violence will continue. The people there are afraid that if he doesnt leave immediately there will be reprisal attacks on the people who protested. This is a country that tortures and murders its citizens for resisting the government.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

When it was clear that Mubarak was finished the US should have pressured him to leave. If he hangs on until September the violence will continue. The people there are afraid that if he doesnt leave immediately there will be reprisal attacks on the people who protested. This is a country that tortures and murders its citizens for resisting the government.

So the U.S. should intervene in domestic politics when it suits your needs? But mind their own business when it doesn't?

[Regulator75]

Anderson Cooper and his crew attacked in Egypt.

http://cnn.com/video/?/video/bestoft...t.crew.hit.cnn

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

So the U.S. should intervene in domestic politics when it suits your needs? But mind their own business when it doesn't?

They've been intervening for 30 years, why stop now?