4 in 10 Americans Still Hold Creationist Views

[Finny61]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Laugh. You really got my gears.

I bother because it's fun to eat turkey and drink booze and exchange presents. Do you think I should stop because I don't attach supernatural significance to the day?

And stop the commercial train that is Christmas? No way. I'm not your mother, do what you want.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Finny61

True and Dec 25 was chosen as the day of Christmas because of pagan celebrations during that time of the year. Its all competition so to speak, I like to get an athiest's gears when they "celebrate" Christmas, I say why bother at all if you don't believe in its foundation for the day.

To tell you the truth, Christmas is party time, exchange gifts and hang with family and friends. I don't even give the Christ thing a thought, guess that's why I sign my cards Merry Xmas.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Finny61

And stop the commercial train that is Christmas? No way. I'm not your mother, do what you want.

And Merry Christmas to you too.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by Finny61

True and Dec 25 was chosen as the day of Christmas because of pagan celebrations during that time of the year. Its all competition so to speak, I like to get an athiest's gears when they "celebrate" Christmas, I say why bother at all if you don't believe in its foundation for the day.

I don't celebrate Christmas.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

And Merry Christmas to you too.

Same to you also.

[MrMastodonFarm]

I can't beleive someone is trying to pretend religion has a monopoly on Christmas...

[Stumptown]

Originally Posted by Finny61

True and Dec 25 was chosen as the day of Christmas because of pagan celebrations during that time of the year. Its all competition so to speak, I like to get an athiest's gears when they "celebrate" Christmas, I say why bother at all if you don't believe in its foundation for the day.

Let's see... it's the darkest, coldest time of year, and a time of seasonal transition. It's comforting on many levels to have a nice big meal with those you are closest to, give them things that make them happy, place a symbol of everlasting nature in your home to remind you of the coming of spring, and brighten up a cold, dark night with pretty lights. That has nothing to do with any of the religious traditions that surround this time of year. If you ask me, all of the religious traditions (going way back into pre-Christian times) stem from these basic humanistic desires. They've been ritualized and co-opted many times in different cultures, and more recently have become ridiculously commercialized, but there are very basic reasons why people around the world who are not even vaguely Christian (Japan) "celebrate" an idea Christmas in their own way.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

I can't beleive someone is trying to pretend religion has a monopoly on Christmas...

Too bad a bunch of religious prudes ruined a perfectly good bacchanalian orgy.

[Finny61]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

And Merry Christmas to you too.

Same to you of course.

[GGG]

Christmas as currently celebrated has little if nothing to do with Christianity. It is a festival of capitalism where we worship at the alter of God stolen from the story of a Saint and given life by a Cola company.

Having gone to a Catholic School in Saskatchewan I am always surprised to see how many young earth creationists there are. I didn't know that they existed for a long time. At our school in regligion class it was God guided evolution but don't ask too many questions. And evolution in science class was taught as pure science.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by GGG

Christmas as currently celebrated has little if nothing to do with Christianity. It is a festival of capitalism where we worship at the alter of God stolen from the story of a Saint and given life by a Cola company.

Having gone to a Catholic School in Saskatchewan I am always surprised to see how many young earth creationists there are. I didn't know that they existed for a long time. At our school in regligion class it was God guided evolution but don't ask too many questions. And evolution in science class was taught as pure science.

That in a nutshell is the evolution of religion.

[Thor]

Funny I was just thinking about this here in Iceland, how its not Merry Christmas in Iceland and most of northern Europe, but Yul or Jól here in Iceland.

Yule is the Germanic pagan tradition on the winter solstice and I was thinking a lot about it here in Iceland how I don´t see anything about Jesus or nativity scenes anywhere, but lots of lights, trees, santas, trolls (yes trolls), and a celebration in the middle of the darkest part of the year for Icelanders celebrated with light, family, good food and a way to beat the mid winter darkness.

Nobody here talking about a war on Christmas, no Christians here talking about how persecuted they are when no one says merry Christmas here. Just a lot of people celebrating a holiday thats been a tradition for 1000's of years mixed in with pagan, Christian and other traditions rolled up into one.

In fact Iceland has some really interesting ones including Grýla (a scary troll) and the 13 santa clauses. The whole set of traditions is briefly outline in the northern EU nations on wikipedia which is worth a read, interesting variations and cool customs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yule

Iceland

The peak of Icelandic jól is when presents are exchanged on aðfangadagskvöld, the evening of December 24, then the gifts are given. It is a custom to eat hamborgarhryggur (smoked pork loin) or rock ptarmigan. Before Christmas some people cut patterns into laufabrauð (e. leaf bread) and bake piparkökur (e. ginger biscuits).


On Þorláksmessa (mass of Saint Thorlakur), December 23, there is a tradition (originally from the Westfjords) to serve fermented skate with melted tallow and boiled potatoes. Boiling the Christmas hangikjöt (smoked leg or shoulder of lamb) on Þorláksmessa evening is said to dispel the strong smell which otherwise tends to linger around the house for days. The hangikjöt and laufabrauð are usually served at Christmas Day, December 25.


Unlike other countries there are 13 traditional jólasveinar Yule Lads that play the same role as the Santa Claus. The first one comes to town from the mountains December 11 and the last one arrives 13 days later on December 24. Children leave their shoe in the window and the Yule Lads leave something in the shoe when they arrive in town. If the children are naughty they might get a potato but if they are nice they might get something good, like candy, clementines or a toy. The Yule Lads all carry a specific name that describes his actions. For instance, the sixth one is Pot-Scraper and what he does best is to scrape leftovers from pots.

Also should be noted that in Europe Yul is celebrated on the 24th, with even the 23rd holding special meaning.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Screw you, Thor and you awesome Icelandicness!!!

[Stumptown]

Originally Posted by Thor

...to serve fermented skate with melted tallow..

Mmmm. I think I'll skip this feast and go straight to the smoked lamb.

[John Doe]

Originally Posted by Finny61

Do athiests Christmas shop?

I do. However, I didn't realize that buying and giving presents was a religious rite.

I also eat chocolate eggs on Easter, drink beer on St. Patricks day (although I only have some Irish ancestry and have never even been to Ireland), and don't work Victoria day (even though I don't think the monarchy is relevant anymore) and Thanksgiving (and eat turkey but don't really thank anyone besides the cooks). I also don't work Boxing day, but have yet to return any gifts on that day. I used to take off Family day before I was married and had a family of my own. I give out candy on Halloween (even though I don't believe in ghosts, goblins, etc.). I take off New Years day (although I think that the whole celebration of the new year is silly). I have gone to retirement parties and weddings for people I hardly know and birthday parties for my wife's friends and relatives. Although I am neither Ukrainian or Chinese, I will gladly go to any of the feasts that these cultures have to celebrate their New Years.

Don't Christians do any of those things?

[Finny61]

Just curious if any of CP's finest athiests go as far as to remove themselves from the day altogether. Mention of it just gets the arse hairs in a knot though apparently. And I'm sure Christians partake in many of your examples, yes even Halloween.

[onetwo_threefour]

I (and I think many others) don't understand why you keep asking if atheists remove themselves from the day altogether. Are atheists not allowed to celebrate family and togetherness on the same day as Christians? My side of the family is at least nominally Catholic with the exception of myself and my wife (and probably my nine-year and three year old, although we don't really raise the subject all that often ). We celebrate with the rest of the family but why should we remove ourselves from the celebration of family just because they may also be celebrating something else. It's kind of like going to a party for a guy who's retiring on his birthday. Some people might be celebrating one or the other and some both, why exclude anybody from the party?

[John Doe]

No arse hairs in a knot here. I do have a question, however.

Why would we remove ourselves from enjoyable situations? See, that's the beauty of being an atheist. We get to do all the fun things that religious folk do and more!

[Finny61]

Originally Posted by onetwo_threefour

I (and I think many others) don't understand why you keep asking if atheists remove themselves from the day altogether. Are atheists not allowed to celebrate family and togetherness on the same day as Christians? My side of the family is at least nominally Catholic with the exception of myself and my wife (and probably my nine-year and three year old, although we don't really raise the subject all that often ). We celebrate with the rest of the family but why should we remove ourselves from the celebration of family just because they may also be celebrating something else. It's kind of like going to a party for a guy who's retiring on his birthday. Some people might be celebrating one or the other and some both, why exclude anybody from the party?

I say "altogether" because from personal stories of some athiests on CP, its about being brought up in the religious system and then rejecting that belief structure. In doing so, would an athiest not want to remove a Dec 25 celebration from their schedule? Or just embrace the nice aspects? Perhaps just a difference between athiests?

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Finny61

I say "altogether" because from personal stories of some athiests on CP, its about being brought up in the religious system and then rejecting that belief structure. In doing so, would an athiest not want to remove a Dec 25 celebration from their schedule? Or just embrace the nice aspects? Perhaps just a difference between athiests?

Christmas isn't about about Christianity for us. It's about Santa, family, gifts, fun, etc. Jesus is a non-issue.