2010 Blue Jays Season Thread

[Caged Great]

Also, Marcum was looking for a 5 year deal, and the Jays only 3. Probably because of injury concerns.

This is a good deal overall. Just an odd way of doing things.

[dustyanddaflames]

There is nothing wrong with acquiring top-notch minor league talent for a starter who had a good year last year. Realistically the Blue Jays are gearing towards 2012, and with that, there is a decent chance a player like Lawrie could be part of the club in two years time. I am not sure how he fits, but he sure could be a replacement to Travis Snider if moved as rumored.

I like the deal, Marcum would be a very good #3 on most contending teams, but nothing more. Look at the guys stats against Boston, New York and Tampa Bay - he sure couldn't take the ball in game 1 or 2 in an opposing park. Grienke, if it happens, is your proverbial ace - a guy with the capabilities to take the bump in an opposing stadium. If the Jays land Grienke, then I am all for a move like this. If they don't, colour me confused as to why Marcum was dealt - unless Anthopolous knew he wouldn't be re-signing in a year's time.

[flambers]

I Personally really like the trade, Jays acquired a high end Prospect.

Jays have "starting" pitching depth ........ (Stewart, Drabek, couple more from the recent drafts etc...).

Marcum was a free agent in a couple of years and it was a risk if the Jays could sign him....

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by dustyanddaflames

There is nothing wrong with acquiring top-notch minor league talent for a starter who had a good year last year. Realistically the Blue Jays are gearing towards 2012, and with that, there is a decent chance a player like Lawrie could be part of the club in two years time. I am not sure how he fits, but he sure could be a replacement to Travis Snider if moved as rumored.

I like the deal, Marcum would be a very good #3 on most contending teams, but nothing more. Look at the guys stats against Boston, New York and Tampa Bay - he sure couldn't take the ball in game 1 or 2 in an opposing park. Grienke, if it happens, is your proverbial ace - a guy with the capabilities to take the bump in an opposing stadium. If the Jays land Grienke, then I am all for a move like this. If they don't, colour me confused as to why Marcum was dealt - unless Anthopolous knew he wouldn't be re-signing in a year's time.

I just don't get how one year they dump Halladay and don't even get that much in terms of prospects for him, plus have to cover 6 million in his salary. Than the next year they turn around to go after a guy like Grienke (especially if they offer up the rumored package). This is a guy who pitches in a hitter friendly park and in one of the weaker Divisions in Baseball. Marcum sucks against good teams....how is Greinke going to do when he suddenly has to stare down the Yankees, Rays, and Red Sox 10 times a season.

To me this is Seattle Mariner type management, to change course this early.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I just don't get how one year they dump Halladay and don't even get that much in terms of prospects for him, plus have to cover 6 million in his salary. Than the next year they turn around to go after a guy like Grienke (especially if they offer up the rumored package). This is a guy who pitches in a hitter friendly park and in one of the weaker Divisions in Baseball. Marcum sucks against good teams....how is Greinke going to do when he suddenly has to stare down the Yankees, Rays, and Red Sox 10 times a season.

To me this is Seattle Mariner type management, to change course this early.

Not sure what you mean they don't get much in terms of Prospects?

Drabek is a high end starter (could be a #2), Anothony Gose (obtained in a trade) is a high end outfielder and they received a good catcher prospect.... Of course it will take "years" before the verdict can be made on that trade....

As for Grienke trade possibility, I am not sure I believe it... I am sure AA is on all of the trades however.

[habernac]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I just don't get how one year they dump Halladay and don't even get that much in terms of prospects for him, plus have to cover 6 million in his salary. Than the next year they turn around to go after a guy like Grienke (especially if they offer up the rumored package). This is a guy who pitches in a hitter friendly park and in one of the weaker Divisions in Baseball. Marcum sucks against good teams....how is Greinke going to do when he suddenly has to stare down the Yankees, Rays, and Red Sox 10 times a season.

To me this is Seattle Mariner type management, to change course this early.

To be fair, the Halladay trade was on Ricciardi's watch, wasn't it?

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by habernac

To be fair, the Halladay trade was on Ricciardi's watch, wasn't it?

Nope, it was the first trade AA did, but the writing was on the wall well before that though.

[loob job]

The Greinke Rumor i heard this morning was Drabek and Snyder, I'm all for giving them Snyder but I don't want to see Drabek go already.

[ricoFlame]

Originally Posted by flambers

Not sure what you mean they don't get much in terms of Prospects?

Drabek is a high end starter (could be a #2), Anothony Gose (obtained in a trade) is a high end outfielder and they received a good catcher prospect.... Of course it will take "years" before the verdict can be made on that trade....

As for Grienke trade possibility, I am not sure I believe it... I am sure AA is on all of the trades however.

i'm convinced that they're holding out hope of converting Gose back to pitching...a lefty who chucks mid 90's...otherwise he's just a very fast outfielder with a great arm, not so great with the twig.

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by loob job

The Greinke Rumor i heard this morning was Drabek and Snyder, I'm all for giving them Snyder but I don't want to see Drabek go already.

That's entirely too much for Grienke.

Drabek will probably develop into what we just traded in Marcum, and Snider has the potential to be a .300 30+ HR guy.

Grienke while he's very good isn't worth that. Halladay isn't even worth that. It really doesn't make any sense at the moment to do that. If you could get away with say Arencibia + Stewart + say Lind for Grienke, that'd be more in keeping with his value than trading Drabek and Snider.

[secol]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I just don't get how one year they dump Halladay and don't even get that much in terms of prospects for him, plus have to cover 6 million in his salary. Than the next year they turn around to go after a guy like Grienke (especially if they offer up the rumored package). This is a guy who pitches in a hitter friendly park and in one of the weaker Divisions in Baseball. Marcum sucks against good teams....how is Greinke going to do when he suddenly has to stare down the Yankees, Rays, and Red Sox 10 times a season.

To me this is Seattle Mariner type management, to change course this early.

to be fair he has been pretty decent against them in his career (except NYY in 07)

[secol]

also this trade could just mean that they view villaneuva as a SP and not a RP. he did both in MIL

[Lil Pedro]

I really liked Shaun Marcum, especially after coming off the Tommy John surgery. That being said, there needed to be a spot in the rotation for the young guys, therefore he was the odd man out. We have a very young staff with a bright future, the job for Farrell and the rest of the coaches is too groom these young guys into an effective starting staff.

Really excited for this season. Any word on Bautista's arbitration?

[Jason14h]

From Rotoworld.com

Gordon Edes of ESPN Boston reports that the Blue Jays are "in hard" on free agent first baseman Carlos Pena.
The Jays could either use Pena at first base or designated hitter. He hit just .196 in 2010 for the Rays, but he slugged 28 home runs and tallied 84 RBI. That kind of power would greatly improve Toronto's lineup, especially if Jose Bautista's home run streak carries over. Pena should come relatively cheap because of the poor batting average and bad defensive reputation.

[Caged Great]

I'd be all for getting Pena.

Pretty much any asset acquired at this point is a good one because at a later time they can be let go for draft picks or traded if necessary.

[bluejays]

I like Pena ONLY as a DH or if necessary 1B. His power is appealing, but if his average gets any worse, he's absolutely useless to have playing everyday. High risk if he's stuck here long term and/or we have to give up some good prospects.

[Sylvanfan]

Depends entirely on price and term for Pena. Realistically he's the type of guy who I'd maybe consider for a one year 5 million dollar contract, and hope he has a bounce back year so he can get a long term big money deal afterwards. He does have mamoth power, and despite his low average still walks a fair bit. Still I don't think he's a guy I'd want to bank on with a multi year deal.

[showtime]

Originally Posted by fleury

I like Pena ONLY as a DH or if necessary 1B. His power is appealing, but if his average gets any worse, he's absolutely useless to have playing everyday. High risk if he's stuck here long term and/or we have to give up some good prospects.

what about the gold glove caliber defense?

[Gozer]

Would love to add Pena - he would replace Overbay as the Jays most patient hitter, plus he bombs and plays elite defense. If he hit .300 then he would expect top dollar.

Solid move by AA moving a pitcher at peak value for a custom-fit prospect.

I wish Marcum well and will continue to cheer him, I expect him to excel next year.

Dreading the Greinke move though, Snider & Drabek should be untouchables - hopefully he's just driving up the price when post-Lee desperation sets in.

[Trojan97]

This is taken from DJF. It basically sums up how I feel about the amount of fans who suddenly feel like Snider is nothing more then an average prospect.

http://www.drunkjaysfans.com/

"it drives me absolutely nuts to hear Bob McCown keep talking about Travis Snider and the fact that he's yet to produce anything at the big league level-- you know, as though he's had a proper chance, hasn't been hurt, and isn't still only 22. (He's never been a .300-30-100 guy, year in, year out, "a stud outfielder." HE'S TWENTY-TWO!!!)

Now, I've definitely said that I think his value goes way down if he gets a proper chance and spends another year relatively unproductive or hurt, but over the last two years he's had a season's worth of at-bats (595 plate appearances) in the majors and has put up a .759 OPS. This is at an age when most of his peers are still firmly in the minors.

In fact, just for fun, I went through the first round and first supplemental round of his draft year-- 2006-- and picked out all the other players drafted out of high school. Except for Clayton Kershaw (drafted seventh-- Snider was 14th) nobody has come anywhere close to making the impact in the majors that Snider has already. And except for Kyle Drabek, nobody else looks like they're going to change that anytime soon.

Cut bait on him? Based on this completely unscientific information, I think we're safe to say he's well ahead of his peers:

In reverse order of selection: Caleb Clay, Steven Evans, Cory (not Colby) Rasmus, Adrian Cardenas, Kyler Burke, Preston Mattingly, Jason Place, Hank Conger, Cody Johnson, Marxwell Sapp, Colton Willems, Chris Parmelee, Kyle Drabek, Jeremy Jeffress, Chris Marrero, Kasey Kiker, Bill Rowell, Clayton Kershaw."

Snider is going to be a damn good MLB player starting the next few years.