Native Americans sue U.S. over solar power plant in desert

[SeeBass]

I have tried hard most of my life not to be racist as I find it disgusting.

And of course here is my but...
I just can't shake my bigotry for natives. I have tried to be repectful and considerate and time and time again I have gotten nothing but disrespect and rudeness back no matter how pleasant I have tried to be. I have even tried helping native charities and such and even then all I get is an attitude that I can't quite put my finger on it but it is an attitude. Is it hatred?, a feeling they are owed?, a divine right? I don't know.

I grew up in manitoba and for you guys in Alberta that is a whole different kind of native than what you know.

The kicker is I'm part native myself and I can't overcome my bigotry.

[theonlywhiteout]

Is the native population more of a "problem" in Manitoba?

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

I'm always a bit taken aback by the overt discrimination shown by members of otherwise mainstream message boards and other online communities (not just CP) toward North American natives as a particular race. A lot of the same level of commentary wouldn't be nearly as acceptable if it were directed at, say, Filipinos, African Americans or East Indians.

For some reason, on any topic dealing with Native Americans, mainstream message boards start to resemble Stormfront.

Just an observation.

Kinda curious, ain't it? When white people play the "Not In My Back Yard" card, or file a frivolous (which this may or may not be) lawsuit, nobody chimes in with "lazy honkies just looking for a handout" or "that's white people for you". We hear "that's a frivolous lawsuit" or "they are just playing the NIMBY card".

This native group does exactly the same thing and it's some sort of racial flaw, and yet another sign of how lazy a certain race of people is.

So I guess it's not really curious at all, it's just plain-old racism.

[theonlywhiteout]

Agreed, Rouge. I can't stand it when people are racist towards natives. I think that stats and figures will demonstrate issues such as alcoholism and teen suicide aren't higher in the native community; rather they're just perceived to be higher by uppity white folks.

Kudos

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by theonlywhiteout

Agreed, Rouge. I can't stand it when people are racist towards natives. I think that stats and figures will demonstrate issues such as alcoholism and teen suicide aren't higher in the native community; rather they're just perceived to be higher by uppity white folks.

Kudos

I've obviously misunderstood, and for that I apologize. When you ask if the native people are more of a "problem" in a certain area of the country than in others, I should have recognized that what you are really concerned about is alcoholism and teen suicide in the native community.

It's not racism, it's compassion. The kudos should be for you.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by theonlywhiteout

Agreed, Rouge. I can't stand it when people are racist towards natives. I think that stats and figures will demonstrate issues such as alcoholism and teen suicide aren't higher in the native community; rather they're just perceived to be higher by uppity white folks.

Kudos

Incidence (annual) of Fetal alcohol syndrome: 0.9 per 10,000 births (Caucasians); Asians 0.3, Hispanics 0.8, African Americans 6.0, and Native Americans 29.9 (NWHIC).

Source: http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/f/feta...rome/stats.htm

Sorry, American stats... but anyways, I love how people just assume they are right.

You're assuming the stats are equal because you want to. If you want to reprimand others for perceptions not based on stats, it would be wise to find the stats first in order to avoid the hypocrasy of doing exactly that yourself.

Natives get special treatment, well, because they get special treatment. No other group gets rights beyond those that are deemed adequate for every other Canadian.

[Temporary_User]

I'm racist towards natives. I grew up in a place that is different than Calgary. We had a reserve right next to us, but they also bussed them into our city for school. So I know a lot of natives, and am friends with a few.
I always judge someone I meet based on them, but I do think that the overall majority (50%+) of natives are bad.
My native friends even say most are bad. I've been to reserves and even partied there a few times. The parties I went to were somewhat "white-washed" but you would always get a few shady bad apples showing up. My friends always would tell me that I don't even know half of what goes on in the reserves. The ones that go off the reserve are the good ones. This from my empirical research, this hold true for Calgary as well.

Natives get a lot of hand-outs. In some ways I think it is a good thing, but unfortunately I rarely see it put to the good uses it could. I think a lot of the racism and problems goes back to the handouts they get.
I wonder if the racism I see is because of the handouts from tax payers.
I don't see as many blacks, hispanics, asian bums as I see white and native. I would make a guess that all but native are relative to the overall population percentage, but I do think there are more native bums per population (I would guess it almost equal to the amount of white, it is less than still though)


I know when I have time off work and not many responsibilities I drink more often. If I could live like that and have a steady income I probably would eventually become a drunk.

[To Be Quite Honest]

Originally Posted by Pinner

Actually, it's called "extortion," quite a common behavior of the "North American Indian".

It's called north American Politics...

[jammies]

End the reserve system in Canada, end apartheid. Integrate natives into society at large. How many decades of failure must occur before it's clear the system can't be fixed as it's the system which is the problem?

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by theonlywhiteout

Is the native population more of a "problem" in Manitoba?

It is a massive problem and it is the worst problem in the province

Povety,addiction,crime,poor education etc etc etc

there are over 500 native assistance organizations downtown, it is not just the natives that are the problem it is the welfare pimps that help the cycle

Winnipeg is a city of 700,000 but I bet it only has 400,000 or less middle class people

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by jammies

End the reserve system in Canada, end apartheid. Integrate natives into society at large. How many decades of failure must occur before it's clear the system can't be fixed as it's the system which is the problem?

Any politician that has proposed anything of the sort has been instantly labeled as racist and been distanced from his party.

[SeeBass]

the native issue in canada is us paying for a sin

like the americans and slavery and the Brits and colonialism

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

It is a massive problem and it is the worst problem in the province

Povety,addiction,crime,poor education etc etc etc

there are over 500 native assistance organizations downtown, it is not just the natives that are the problem it is the welfare pimps that help the cycle

Winnipeg is a city of 700,000 but I bet it only has 400,000 or less middle class people

It's bad in Saskatchewan too. I grew up about two hours north of Prince Albert, and my hometown was near two reserves. These reserves had no resource revenue and were complete Mad Max style wastelands. I had close to 600 hours of ride along time with the RCMP over the years and we rarely left the reserves - the things I saw there were shocking. The abuse, the poverty, the violence and the filth were something most people don't really have a sense of.

It's a sad sad state of affairs and no one wants to do anything about it. I suppose the government throws money at it with out reach centres and treatment programs but those aren't going to solve the problem.
The only real solution is to tear up the treaties (yes I'm fully aware they are contracts that we signed and blah blah blah) and force them into society.

[CaptainCrunch]

The paying for a sin of our forefathers has to end, not because all debts have been paid, but its actually crippling the Natives here.

The reservation system has to end, its become a corrupt system that benefits very few at the top while the average native suffers and withers.

The handing out of money without oversight has to end as well, its become fairly clear that the money isn't going to the right places.

I know its harsh, but its time to integrate the Natives properly into our society instead of seperating them from our society because what we're doing is clearly not working. Find a way to negotiate the land rights, pay them out and lets move on.

It would be intolerable if we surrounded Quebec with wire and turned them into a well meaning wellfare state.

Don't give cash to the younger natives because they've turned 18, lets give them educational incentives for the next decade, if they qualify for college we pay for it. If they don't then they don't get that money.

[Flabbibulin]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

I'm always a bit taken aback by the overt discrimination shown by members of otherwise mainstream message boards and other online communities (not just CP) toward North American natives as a particular race. A lot of the same level of commentary wouldn't be nearly as acceptable if it were directed at, say, Filipinos, African Americans or East Indians.

For some reason, on any topic dealing with Native Americans, mainstream message boards start to resemble Stormfront.

Just an observation.

You're really surprised by the mainstream attitude?

[JustAnotherGuy]

Am I racist if I do not talk to the group of 4 drunk natives that wander around the Beltline? If when they mumble something to me I just keep walking. It is probably unfair for me to assume they are drunk. But they are staggering and mumbling and later in the day you will see them passing out on a bench somewhere.

[Pinner]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Don't give cash to the younger natives because they've turned 18, lets give them educational incentives for the next decade, if they qualify for college we pay for it. If they don't then they don't get that money.

Around here not only do they get $100,000 when they turn 18, but they also get significant payoffs regularly from the oil companies.

The hand outs and extortion money doesn't seem to help the native population, and I agree it should be stopped.

[theonlywhiteout]

Originally Posted by SebC

Source: http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/f/feta...rome/stats.htm

Sorry, American stats... but anyways, I love how people just assume they are right.

You're assuming the stats are equal because you want to. If you want to reprimand others for perceptions not based on stats, it would be wise to find the stats first in order to avoid the hypocrasy of doing exactly that yourself.

Natives get special treatment, well, because they get special treatment. No other group gets rights beyond those that are deemed adequate for every other Canadian.

Wow I'm shocked. I am shocked that 2 random stats |I picked out of mid air seem to point to Natives having inherent societal issues in direct response to someone here suggesting the very notion was racist.

Oh snap I just googled what green text meant. Sorry I'll me be more vigilant in the future

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Pinner

Around here not only do they get $100,000 when they turn 18, but they also get significant payoffs regularly from the oil companies.

The hand outs and extortion money doesn't seem to help the native population, and I agree it should be stopped.

Its equivalent to giving an NBA rookie a million dollar contract, but not sitting down and coaching him how to budget and use that money.

If you give someone thats grown up in a poor surrounding like some of these reservations, you can bet that the majority will have blown that money inside of a year on stupid purchases, because they don't know any better.

Unrelated I know, but I was watching Intervention last night and the girl had been given a fairly large trust fund that included a bulk payout followed by $1000.00 a month, and she burned through $350,000.00 in two years on drugs.

[mikey_the_redneck]

I really doubt that the natives want to be integrated into society.

I think they enjoy the isolation and the free stuff.

The elders must pass on their hatred of whities to their young. It's actually quite pathetic....