I suspect my landlord is not paying tax on my rent

[Dion]

Originally Posted by First Lady

He doesn't need proof. When you report a suspected drunk driver you don't need a blood sample from the suspect.

It's up to the proper authorities to investigate.

Reporting a drunk driver is a lot different from reporting someone who only accepts cash. With a suspected drunk driver there are at least signs he or she has had too much to drink.

[First Lady]

Originally Posted by Dion

Reporting a drunk driver is a lot different from reporting someone who only accepts cash. With a suspected drunk driver there are at least signs he or she has had too much to drink.

Maybe they just reached for a CD. There is no proof.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by First Lady

Maybe they just reached for a CD. There is no proof.

One measely swere and you're on the phone?

I hope I never have a neighbour like you. I'm done here.

[First Lady]

Originally Posted by Dion

One measely swere and you're on the phone?

I hope I never have a neighbour like you.

LOL.... my family says the same thing...

I'm done here.

G'nite.

[pylon]

Originally Posted by First Lady

I think you missed the main part of the sentence where I referred to cash.


Paying cash in and of itself isn't necessary a big deal.

The fact there is ZERO paper trail in this case is a HUGE red flag.


btw: This is not linked to my political ambitions. It is part of my work ethic and has been longer than my political ambitions. It just happens to go nicely on that front as well.

I pay my taxes and then some as well, and I regularily work a grueling 60-70 week when called upon. That doesn't make me special as there are tons of people that do that and more.

However I am curious to your answers to the scenarios I gave you. Would you meddle in someones business, and go out of your way to snitch people out in those scenarios? Each one of them is far worse than not declaring taxes, so how would you handle them?

Also, if the OP is renting without insisting on a tenancy agreement, is he not enabling the problem? If he is so uncomfortable with the situation, he should remove himself from it. Kind of a pot kettle scenario, wouldn't you agree?

[First Lady]

Originally Posted by pylon

I pay my taxes and then some as well, and I regularily work a grueling 60-70 week when called upon. That doesn't make me special as there are tons of people that do that and more.

However I am curious to your answers to the scenarios I gave you. Would you meddle in someones business, and go out of your way to snitch people out in those scenarios? Each one of them is far worse than not declaring taxes, so how would you handle them?

Originally Posted by pylon

So by your rationale....

I suspect my neighbours are smoking pot, because I can smell it.... I'll call the cops.

Are they only smoking it or dealing too? If they are casual users, chances are they are not in possession of enough for the cops to charge them. So, no I wouldn't call the cops. I don't think this is as bad as tax evasion.

If I suspect them of dealing, yes, I would call the cops on them. IMO this is worse than tax evasion. And yes, I have reported suspected drug houses in my neighborhood.

A guy I was having a conversation with in the motorcycle shop last week was telling me how quick his bike got to 200 kph, better rat him out too.

As I understand it police can only charge for speeding if the person is clocked at a certain speed. They can't go on the statement (judgement) of a lay-witness. I have called on this type of thing before.

A friend of mine wore a new watch across the border and didn't declare the duty.... better call the CRA and ruin his life.

Actually I think it's border services you would call in this case. I don't honestly know what I would do in this scenario. Thankfully my friends and family know me well enough they would never put me in the position of needing to make the decision.... They simply wouldn't share it with me.

Also, if the OP is renting without insisting on a tenancy agreement, is he not enabling the problem? If he is so uncomfortable with the situation, he should remove himself from it. Kind of a pot kettle scenario, wouldn't you agree?

It's not a pot kettle scenario; he might be making it easier for the landlord to avoid tax (if he is). But he isn't an accomplice.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by First Lady

...


Actually I think it's border services you would call in this case. I don't honestly know what I would do in this scenario. Thankfully my friends and family know me well enough they would never put me in the position of needing to make the decision.... They simply wouldn't share it with me.

....

I think I agree with you in part First lady, but this part is what I totally do not agree with.

You think someone who is engaging in questionable business practices, that happen every day in many industries should be reported to the CRA. Accepting cash, giving no receipt, no contract are all common for any sort of tipped service, any casual labour situation, heck even the guy who sells hot dogs outside my office. I would never think to report someone for doing those things, or assume that a business that was employing one of these types of people, because it isn't out of the ordinary if they don't tell you otherwise.

Same with your watch scenario, you would hope they didn't tell you about it so you wouldn't have a problem with figuring out if you needed to report them or not. That's what is happening here. Landlord dude hasn't admitted to a crime or tax evasion, but that doesn't stop you from wanting to throw him under the bus.

The reality of the situation is that even if he isn't including the income from the rental property on his taxes, he probably wouldn't need to pay much if any taxes on those funds even if he did. So reporting someone for a potential violation that even if it is a violation has a limited chance of actually making a real change in the taxes paid, seems kinda pointless.

Would I do it? Probably not.

[bigtmac19]

Originally Posted by First Lady

You are the one saying you won't file your tax return unless you "end up with a little whiner like d-bag" tenant.

If you feel that makes legitimate business sense.... then, yes, I was patronizing you.

Where did you get 4x4 saying he won't file his tax return?? He never once said that. Along with every one else in here, I'm glad you aren't my neighbour either.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by First Lady

He doesn't need proof. When you report a suspected drunk driver you don't need a blood sample from the suspect.

It's up to the proper authorities to investigate.

No, but you do have to have a reasonable suspicion or you can be found guilty of filing a false report.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by First Lady

I'm pretty sure snitches aren't require to gather the proof.

One of the dumbest things I have ever read.

HE IS GUILTY.


BUUUUUUURN HIM.

wow.

[Starfishy]

I really hate tax evasion. Given that I actually pay my taxes and realize that the more money that goes into the pot into which my taxes go, the more likely it is I will see tax relief down the road.

In a way tax evaders are certainly damaging mine (and all of your) bottom lines. That said, it seems to me as though the moral high ground here would be to stop allowing him to evade taxes. This means to tell him that you will require a reciept and that you will be paying him by cheque. Only two things can happen: 1) You get evicted and have to find a new place (not a big deal as you have told us he is not giving you any kind of "breaks" on your rent), 2) He starts paying his taxes (and you sleep better at night).

BTW, I was also very surprised how many people on here think that somehow "screwing the government" is not really a crime. I am often amazed how people think that tax fraud doesn't affect them. Just remember that every time someone doesn't pay there taxes the rest of us are left forking the bill.

[photon]

This whole discussion is silly.

ALL of you would be snitches at one point or another, the severity of the offense and your confidence in the person being guilty being two factors in deciding.

Pretty much everyone would snitch if they were pretty sure their neighbour was guilty of murdering their spouse, or snitch on the guy who hangs around the school yard with a long lens camera every day.

Everyone just has different levels at which they decide something becomes worth doing it for. Some people are swayed by the visibility of the victim, tax evasion appears more like a victimless crime. How can a discussion get so heated when it's basically a case of slightly different levels of tolerance?

The fact that "there's no paper" trail... given the # of landlords that seem to do that out of ignorance I don't think it's that big a deal. It's far more likely that it's simply a guy who has no idea of the landlord tenant act. An easy way to test would be to simply request a rental agreement, or even draw one up to have the guy sign it. If he refuses, then you have a better idea.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Starfishy

That said, it seems to me as though the moral high ground here would be to stop allowing him to evade taxes. This means to tell him that you will require a reciept and that you will be paying him by cheque. Only two things can happen: 1) You get evicted and have to find a new place (not a big deal as you have told us he is not giving you any kind of "breaks" on your rent), 2) He starts paying his taxes (and you sleep better at night).

That's a really good solution.

Originally Posted by Starfishy

BTW, I was also very surprised how many people on here think that somehow "screwing the government" is not really a crime. I am often amazed how people think that tax fraud doesn't affect them. Just remember that every time someone doesn't pay there taxes the rest of us are left forking the bill.

I don't think anybody has said that.

I think the most likely scenario is the guy was getting a deal on his rent because he was paying with cash. He denies this of course, but usually in this sort of arrangement the guy paying with cash will save a little as an incentive to pay with cash versus other methods of payment. In this case, he's just as culpable from a moral perspective as the guy ripping off the government, which makes him a complete and total a-hole for even contemplating calling the CRA.

If he wasn't getting a break on his rent, it's likely the landlord is paying his taxes as there is not one single shred of proof to the contrary, which makes him a complete and total a-hole for even contemplating calling the CRA.

Regardless, I think it's super obvious the OP has a beef with the landlord totally unrelated to the cash issue, but he's using that as a way to get back at the landlord. It's so weak it's unbelievable.

[algernon]

Originally Posted by Sliver

That's a really good solution.



I don't think anybody has said that.

I think the most likely scenario is the guy was getting a deal on his rent because he was paying with cash. He denies this of course, but usually in this sort of arrangement the guy paying with cash will save a little as an incentive to pay with cash versus other methods of payment. In this case, he's just as culpable from a moral perspective as the guy ripping off the government, which makes him a complete and total a-hole for even contemplating calling the CRA.

If he wasn't getting a break on his rent, it's likely the landlord is paying his taxes as there is not one single shred of proof to the contrary, which makes him a complete and total a-hole for even contemplating calling the CRA.

Regardless, I think it's super obvious the OP has a beef with the landlord totally unrelated to the cash issue, but he's using that as a way to get back at the landlord. It's so weak it's unbelievable.

I think he was getting a break by not having to pay rent on a place when he wasn't there. Unless he's staying in a Hotel, that's a pretty good situation he had. No Damage Deposit means he has a extra cash in his jeans. I also think the poster has a beef with the landlord, and ratting him out with out any proof is a chicken way of dealing with things.

As for First Lady- isn't it a bookkeeper's job to advise their clients on what they can and can't do? IE: If I wasn't sure about a tax-break, and asked you if I could claim it, would you take that to mean I'm trying to commit tax evasion and rat me out??? OR on another tack, should a lawyer rat me out if I ask for advice on a matter that turns out be illegal if I follow through?

[Starfishy]

Originally Posted by Dion

Suspicion is not proof for reporting someone.

Actually, this is not correct. Suspicion is certainly a good reason for reporting someone.

As an example, when I lived in Edmonton I reported to the police a suspicious house in my neighborhood. People coming up to the door at all hours of the night seemingly making a very quick visit on the doorstep and then leaving without even shutting off there vehicles most of the time. I informed the police that I suspected there might be something shady going on, and about 2 months later my neighbors were escorted away in a police car and the house went up for sale shortly after that. I was apparently not the only neighbor that reported them.

It is my civic duty to report this kind of behavior. I am not saying that the OP has enough proof to say for sure, but I think he has some grounds for suspicion. It is ultimately not up to him as to whether this case is looked into. But I don't think it would be unfair for him to present his concern to the proper authorities.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by First Lady

You are the one saying you won't file your tax return unless you "end up with a little whiner like d-bag" tenant.

If you feel that makes legitimate business sense.... then, yes, I was patronizing you.

I did not say that.

[Starfishy]

Originally Posted by photon

This whole discussion is silly.

ALL of you would be snitches at one point or another, the severity of the offense and your confidence in the person being guilty being two factors in deciding.

Pretty much everyone would snitch if they were pretty sure their neighbour was guilty of murdering their spouse, or snitch on the guy who hangs around the school yard with a long lens camera every day.

Everyone just has different levels at which they decide something becomes worth doing it for. Some people are swayed by the visibility of the victim, tax evasion appears more like a victimless crime. How can a discussion get so heated when it's basically a case of slightly different levels of tolerance?

The fact that "there's no paper" trail... given the # of landlords that seem to do that out of ignorance I don't think it's that big a deal. It's far more likely that it's simply a guy who has no idea of the landlord tenant act. An easy way to test would be to simply request a rental agreement, or even draw one up to have the guy sign it. If he refuses, then you have a better idea.

This is certainly the most rational post in this entire thread. I think it pretty much sums up how I feel.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Starfishy

This is certainly the most rational post in this entire thread. I think it pretty much sums up how I feel.

O RLY?

Looks to me like Photon said it wasn't a big deal:

Originally Posted by photon

The fact that "there's no paper" trail... given the # of landlords that seem to do that out of ignorance I don't think it's that big a deal. It's far more likely that it's simply a guy who has no idea of the landlord tenant act. An easy way to test would be to simply request a rental agreement, or even draw one up to have the guy sign it. If he refuses, then you have a better idea.

But you say you'd report the guy!

Originally Posted by Starfishy

It is my civic duty to report this kind of behavior. I am not saying that the OP has enough proof to say for sure, but I think he has some grounds for suspicion. It is ultimately not up to him as to whether this case is looked into. But I don't think it would be unfair for him to present his concern to the proper authorities.

Your post is in direct conflict with Photon's! lol

[Starfishy]

Originally Posted by Sliver

O RLY?

Looks to me like Photon said it wasn't a big deal:



But you say you'd report the guy!



Your post is in direct conflict with Photon's! lol

I believe you took that quote out of context. When I said that I would report this behavior, I was talking about the drug trafficing that went on at my neighbors house, which didn't seem to make the cut on your quote.

I have stated in two posts now that I would not report the landlord. That said, I do feel that if he suspects illigal activity and if he is morally conflicted about it then he has every right to report him.

[JustAnotherGuy]

Originally Posted by Mr.LOL

For the past year (besides spring break up) I have been renting a room in a oilfield town, paying by the month. There was never any security deposit or contract signed. The landlord said he preferred cash and never offered a receipt. I never felt a receipt would be of any benefit to me so I never forced the issue.

Other people I work with have stayed there in the past and it's the same situation. The landlord has mentioned the renovations he has had to make to turn it into a legal rental property and also how he gives all the cash to someone 'who takes care of it all for him.' I suspect if I start requesting a receipt one day I will come home from work and find all my stuff missing.

I have strong suspicions that this shady character is not paying any tax on the money I give him. what would be the best thing to do to make sure he is not committing tax fraud?

I suppose if you feel that strongely about it you could move out and then call the appropriate authorities. If that makes you feel better. It is your decision.

It is all about what makes you sleep easier. Do you sleep okay now knowing you might be sleeping in an house where the person is not paying the proper taxes on? Will you feel better if you phone the authorities of him?

How many months have you suspected him of this behavoir?