Quebec Hockey Players Sidelined -- claims French players are less likely to be drafted, have shorter careers and earn less money than their Anglophone counterparts
hmmm... and i always thought that toronto was the center of the universe!
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As has been noted, the Q is easily the third best league in the CHL. I would also note that no team from Quebec's Junior A league has ever won the Manitoba Centennial Trophy or the Royal Bank Cup, going back to the tournament's founding in 1971. In the last 16 years, only four teams from Quebec have even advanced out of the East regional playdown. Given it is Quebec vs. Atlantic Canada, it seems they should have an advantage.
Frankly, Quebec has fewer players drafted and playing because the province develops fewer NHL calibre players. The utter lack of success at the junior level is telling, and given that is where the NHL drafts its players from...
Only one player from the QMJHL was selected in the first round of the 2010 draft - a kid from PEI. Only one taken in the second round - an import from the Czech Republic. The next kid was an import from Russia. The fourth QMJHL player picked, 68th overall, was the first Quebecker taken.
Frankly, Quebec needs to look internally for problems, not externally. It isn't discrimination leading to a supposed lack of francophone players in the NHL. Discrimination is not why there are only a handful of Latvian and Swiss players in the NHL either.
Last edited by Resolute 14; 10-26-2010 at 10:45 AM.
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The English-language book, translated from a 2009 French edition, makes its argument on the basis of a comprehensive list of NHL draft picks from Quebec since 1970.
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As has been noted, the Q is easily the third best league in the CHL. I would also note that no team from Quebec's Junior A league has ever won the Manitoba Centennial Trophy or the Royal Bank Cup, going back to the tournament's founding in 1971. In the last 16 years, only four teams from Quebec have even advanced out of the East regional playdown. Given it is Quebec vs. Atlantic Canada, it seems they should have an advantage.
Frankly, Quebec has fewer players drafted and playing because the province develops fewer NHL calibre players. The utter lack of success at the junior level is telling, and given that is where the NHL drafts its players from...
Only one player from the QMJHL was selected in the first round of the 2010 draft - a kid from PEI. Only one taken in the second round - an import from the Czech Republic. The next kid was an import from Russia. The fourth QMJHL player picked, 68th overall, was the first Quebecker taken.
Frankly, Quebec needs to look internally for problems, not externally. It isn't discrimination leading to a supposed lack of francophone players in the NHL. Discrimination is not why there are only a handful of Latvian and Swiss players in the NHL either.
Thats basically the issue there. But this again strengthens my point of the typical French entitlement complex.
It cant be their fault, because they're amazing, ergo they must be being discriminated against.
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Quick breakdown of goalies around the league. I only included 2 goalies from each team, 60 total. Injured goalies (Leclaire, Leighton, etc not included).
Rest of Canada - 15
Quebec - 11
USA - 11
Finland - 7
Sweden - 6
Czech - 5
Russia - 4
Swiss - 1
If there was a type of player that was undervalued by the league, some GM somewhere would be out looking for them, since they'd get a competitive advantage. (See first scouts in Europe for NHL, Dominican/Japan for Baseball, Moneyball, etc)
If there were truly all of these NHL calibre players from Quebec who aren't playing in the NHL, someone would sign them and build a franchise around them.
As for a team in Quebec City, he says it would help local players get a better shot at the NHL. In particular, it would mean more jobs for the muckers and grinders who are often overlooked and wind up playing in Europe.
Lord forbid that those 3 or 4 guys had to leave Quebec for europe
I did find his "fact" that a third of NHL teams not having scouts in quebec interesting.
I'd love to see Quebec have it's own entry in the WJHC - they'd likely win 37-0 agaisnt the Swiss, but then be morally and physically crushed 3-1 by TC.
Not being french or a very good hockey player - it is hard to know what really goes on the the NHL - I'd like to think that if a player is good enough, he'll be in the NHL even if he is from Mars....
i'd also like to see some hard evidence for him to back up his claims about francophones not making as much or having shorter careers.
A friend of mine brought up this book to me when it was first released in French and I stated the same thing. The noticably weaker QMJHL is the reason that there are fewer Quebecois drafted. They're still stuck in the run and gun era when the other two leagues have evolved with the NHL. .
If scouts and GMs passed over players just because of where they're from they'd be fired.
My ancestry is French and I think the book is ridiculous. One more reason for the Anglos to dismiss the French as the whiners that they appear to be.
Last edited by habernac; 10-26-2010 at 01:09 PM.
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There is a French guy named Bob?
This claim was made a few years back as Cow pointed out...and its a whole lot of nonsense. If a guy can play and contribure at the NHL level, why would any GM not get him? The sport is global, and its about winning.
As has been noted, the Q is easily the third best league in the CHL. I would also note that no team from Quebec's Junior A league has ever won the Manitoba Centennial Trophy or the Royal Bank Cup, going back to the tournament's founding in 1971. In the last 16 years, only four teams from Quebec have even advanced out of the East regional playdown. Given it is Quebec vs. Atlantic Canada, it seems they should have an advantage.
Frankly, Quebec has fewer players drafted and playing because the province develops fewer NHL calibre players. The utter lack of success at the junior level is telling, and given that is where the NHL drafts its players from...
Only one player from the QMJHL was selected in the first round of the 2010 draft - a kid from PEI. Only one taken in the second round - an import from the Czech Republic. The next kid was an import from Russia. The fourth QMJHL player picked, 68th overall, was the first Quebecker taken.
Frankly, Quebec needs to look internally for problems, not externally. It isn't discrimination leading to a supposed lack of francophone players in the NHL. Discrimination is not why there are only a handful of Latvian and Swiss players in the NHL either.
Hockey Quebec absolutely sucks these day. They are not producing elite players anymore because that's no longer what their system is deigned to do. It's completely designed for recreation with little emphasis on competition. Elite players are not given the opportunity to succeed they are in other systems. Outside of that, Hockey Quebec is full of politics. If the QMJHL didn't have the Maritimes and Newfoundland filling its cupboards (traditionally these kids played in the OHL), it would be a bigger laughing stock than it has already become.
Quebec has nothing to blame but itself, but in true Quebecois fashion, they start pointing the finger at everyone else.
No NHL GM gives a goddamn where a player is from if they are good enough and eligible to play in the NHL. In fact, the only team that actually does care a bit (because of the idiocy of their fans) is located within the borders of Quebec.
In today's age of win at all cost, I don't think that many GMs would pass over a French-Canadien for any other reason that perception of talent. As many have stated before any NHL gm would attempt to get the best players available. I would say there is a tangible avoidance of Russian players - most likely due to the transfer agreement issue (and possability of them bolting to the KHL) but even then some one is going to weigh the risk and take a flyer on some of those guys because their is some upside.
I would suggest that the author is proud and patriotic about French hockey and is more likely to see discrimination where none exists because he is projecting his value of French players and not understanding how they can be passed over for non-Francophone players.
I'd say as Flames fans we are no better when it comes to Flames players being passed over for all star games and Olympic teams etc. We think our guys are more deserving than the guys that actually make the team (ie. Bow and Dion in last Olympics) and get downright pissed when it doesn't happen (maybe we don't write books about it).
I'm curious what the stats would be for the number of players in the NHL from the six Canadian NHL cities along with Winnipeg, Hamilton and Quebec City.
Only three minutes for the franco-phobes to chime in.
Instead of attacking Bob Sirois (his book is not about him), can we discuss if he is right?
Don Cherry certainly conveys an anti-french attitude.
This is Bob's claim:
French players are less likely to be drafted, have shorter careers and earn less money than their Anglophone counterparts
Why is it, is it because they are french or is it because the QMJHL promotes a fast paced "soft" brand of hockey that doesnt translate well into the NHL.
The easiest thing someone can do is claim some form of bias based on race or ethnicity.
Alexandre Daigle was drafted in the first round and was a complete bust, is that because he is french or because he wasnt very good?
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I'm curious what the stats would be for the number of players in the NHL from the six Canadian NHL cities along with Winnipeg, Hamilton and Quebec City.
Using birthplace only, and the city proper only (as I have no idea which suburbs of Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal especially qualify), I come up with the following for players on NHL rosters today:
Obvoiusly Ottawa (Gatineau, Kanata), Toronto (many), Montreal (many), Vancouver (Burnaby, etc.) are quite under represented without using suburbs. Calgary (Airdrie, Strathmore) and Edmonton (Fort Saskatchewan - oddly, nobody listed as born in St. Albert) suffered a bit too.
I think the problem with few players picked from the Q ends up reverse-snowballing, if that's even a word. No prospects worth looking at means teams don't put a scout there. No scout there, leads to no prospects wanting to play there, as opposed to the WHL or OHL. If there is a phenomenal player from Mars, and no scouts go there, he's not going to be picked.
How many times have we heard of a scout going to some obscure town to look at a certain prospect, and then finding another diamond in the rough? I think Gary Suter was one example of that.
I don't know if the Flames even have a scout doing full time work in the QMJHL.
Using birthplace only, and the city proper only (as I have no idea which suburbs of Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal especially qualify), I come up with the following for players on NHL rosters today:
Obvoiusly Ottawa (Gatineau, Kanata), Toronto (many), Montreal (many), Vancouver (Burnaby, etc.) are quite under represented without using suburbs. Calgary (Airdrie, Strathmore) and Edmonton (Fort Saskatchewan - oddly, nobody listed as born in St. Albert) suffered a bit too.
That number for Edmonton is incredible while Quebec's is pretty pathetic.
Years ago I always noticed that french guys were always much smaller than western farm boys. We would always tower over them at tourneys.
I dont know if that is the case now but it sure was in the 70s and 80s.
When I worked at a shoes store in Western Canada we always got shipments of larger size shoes that they could not sell in Quebec and we always shipped them the smaller sizes. Not exactly a scientific survey but it was rather suprising none the less.
I guess if all things being equal between players I would probably pick the bigger guy.
